Inevitable Fatality vs.Illusory Free Will

[Galyna]

@Leo Gura

Leo, if you have some time, can you please answer my question in two words or something. Otherwise, I will go crazy by cracking this code. Long story short:

Usually, feeling of regret was unknown to me. I was a firm believer, and still am, that free will was illusory and did not exist, therefore if I am not in control of my actions, I cannot really claim the ownership of them. But I feel like this time I did something, and now I regret and can’t let it go. Your video about letting go has helped, but only for a short period of time. I guess I need to do a deep shadow work to look at this issue from another angle. 

If a free will does not exist, when looking back at my actions and analyzing my behavior, what is the best way to learn? If I am not a doer but rather an observer, is there a way for me to understand what Life/God wants me to grasp by putting me in a certain situation? I am puzzled, because if the certain action leads to multiple outcomes, how to understand what God wants me to realize by putting me into certain scenario? I am trying to be objective, but I fail over and over again. I really do not know what was there for me to learn. In fact, I have tons of various hypotheses…but I am not sure which one is the most correct for my situation. I am really confused for the first time in my life. Very often I could dig very deep and always got a correct layout of the situation and actions I need to take. 

P.S. I was trying to meditate. I've asked myself a question, let it go, and after about 30 minutes of meditation I got a spontaneous answer. Can this be a legit answer or just the tricks of my subconscious mind that plays to entertain itself? 

Thank you so much for your time.

 

Edited April 17, 2020 by Galyna
mistake

[Leo Gura]

Reality is nondual, so you cannot put it into simplistic human cateogries like free will vs no free will.

There really is no difference between the two.

Since you are God, you are in the very nexus of creation, where Will and Being merge into a seamless Unity. You are in the driver's seat, driving creation.

Reality/God is a tautology, which means it cannot be any other way than the way it is. But it is always in the process of creation, so it will become whatever you create. Your destiny is whatever you end up creating in the now. What is meant to be is whatever you create.

Whatever you regret, the ultimate lesson is to forgive yourself and love yourself. There are probably other lessons there as well, but the highest lesson is to accept reality as it is, which in this case includes whatever bad act you committed. You can learn to do it better next time, but the fact is whatever mistakes you made in the past are whatever they are, and could not be otherwise. So accept it. But the future is open and unknown, so you are not doomed to repeat the same mistakes. You get to decide how things will unfold.

It's okay to be confused about the lesson. It might take months or years before you learn what the lesson was. The lesson may still be unfolding so maybe you don't have enough data yet to draw a solid conclusion.

[ZahariaNicu]

Assuming that you have something to learn only from certain situations it ll make it complicated to understand for you. 

You are the creator of the universe, so if there is something to learn from anything is that no matter the situation you re in or were in is there for you to learn from. Just realize  that you re infinite intelligence and you ll use for sure everything that you ve learned councious or unconscious to to give value to your being. So if you're tendency is to become a serial killer, concentrate and learn to become a good one(just kidding don't do that)

[Nahm]

@Galyna

You’re in control of and responsible for your actions. 

[zeroISinfinity]

16 minutes ago, Nahm said:

@Galyna

You’re in control of and responsible for your actions. 

No man hand flipping exercise ® proved to me that I do not have any control. 

It's all maya, there is NoThing . 

Maybe just maybe I am Creator and fully THIS. 

Nothigness itself but you know self agenda and maya it's all predestined nihilistic deterministic stuff with no freedom. 

God must be so cruel. 

Be like children. More like be robots or human primates. ☺️

(oh man that was machine gun rafal, yeah I guess lol) 

Edited April 17, 2020 by zeroISinfinity

[SoonHei]

we have absolute free will... total!

but we aren't free from the necessary and inevitable consequences of those actions

 

to hope/want the consequences to be different is not seeing the bigger picture.

it's like wanting to dip your hand in the water and not wanting it to get wet

dipping of the hand in the water = hand getting wet

 

and as you gain more and more control over your actions and these actions are made out of the understanding and love for the whole vs egoic/karmic actions - then what you can do with that free will also expands... like a baby learning to talk/walk/use their hands vs not knowing how to initially... the next domain unlocked is that of the mind... to will and create the narrative as you see it to be... you being the highest authority of your domain

your king of the kingdom and queen of your queendom

[Galyna]

1 hour ago, Nahm said:

@Galyna

You’re in control of and responsible for your actions. 

I knew you would tell me this . Your words still echo in my mind from our last conversation. The paradox of the free will can’t be grasped yet: if every action in the past predetermined my choice in the future, seems like there is no free will, and I did what I had to in the following situation. But hey, thank you, I am sure you know that your advice is very much appreciated.

[Galyna]

Gosh, thank you so much for your response. I would literally drive myself crazy with my monkey mind.   

The issue that I have pertains to the inner dimension of my being. Not that I did something wrong or was unethical toward other people. I guess I am trying so hard to escape this reality and live in the world of my own illusions. Sorry for being vogue. So, the ego hates to see through the illusion. It is always in the escape mode. This illusion became so powerful and overwhelming that manipulates its own creator (which is me in this case). And regret is the last resort for the ego to utilize in order not to surrender to what is and rest in the present moment, because it takes so much courage, because by regretting it still leaves the room for the control. Like I had multiple scenarios to choose from in the first place, this is so funny.

14 hours ago, Leo Gura said:

It's okay to be confused about the lesson. It might take months or years before you learn what the lesson was. The lesson may still be unfolding so maybe you don't have enough data yet to draw a solid conclusion.

I was thinking about it a lot ,and can not agree more with your words. Life is not over , so there is no way I can gather the whole puzzle now, unless I will be dead right at this moment. 

[Galyna]

14 hours ago, ZahariaNicu said:

You are the creator of the universe, so if there is something to learn from anything is that no matter the situation you re in or were in is there for you to learn from. Just realize  that you re infinite intelligence and you ll use for sure everything that you ve learned councious or unconscious to to give value to your being.

There is a kernel of truth to this statement. On the level of the Absolute to become infinite and evolve, you have to encapsulate all the states and beings. On the level of the human being, it's still tempting to look ahead.  

[Galyna]

7 hours ago, zeroISinfinity said:

God must be so cruel. 

It is not what I was trying to say. Cruelty vs. benevolence is a different topic. It has nothing to do with cruelty. If I am nothing and everything at the same time, there is no such thing as cruelty. I am not in denial. I am not being nihilistic. I wish I would understand the divine intention, life would be way easier in this case (probably boring at the same time, lol), and I would not need to waste my precious time on unnecessary things. 

 

[Galyna]

7 hours ago, SoonHei said:

we have absolute free will... total!

No you are not. You are not choosing what country to be born, what parents to have, what language to talk, what religion to practice( at least in the early stages of your life) what health state to have (in case you are handicapped, became or born). I see a human being is an evolving entity that is hardly influenced by its environment. And only, maybe, less than 1% of people have the ability to escape the existing system or order. 

[Nahm]

@Galyna

If you would just read everything you said on this post, and notice you are the one saying it. When you say it - it is so. 

7 hours ago, Galyna said:

The paradox of the free will can’t be grasped yet:

Well, if you say so. Seems to me you grasped it a long time ago. Surely you notice “free will” is a thought, and “no free will” is a thought. That’s it. That’s all there was to “grasping it”. It’s just thoughts. Are you expecting a “free will” to walk in the door and say “here I am! It’s me!”.

All thinking is dualistic. How do I suppress my desire? Easy, existential rumination. How do I stay asleep? Easy, claim there’s an ego. But how do I get what I want? Easy, it’s already the case, acknowledge resistant thoughts, and let them go. But how the hell do I let thoughts go? Easy, focus on perception & feeling instead. But that won’t solve anything!! There wasn’t a problem. But I want to know what to do! That arises in the emptiness where the rumination was. But how am I supposed to remember it’s easy!? 

Amazon. $11.94. 

(Also, suffering, resistance, tension, stress, etc. The button’s just easier, imo)

[Galyna]

@Nahm Let's talk about it, really. I remember you have mentioned it in our last conversation. I do not mind to have a free will, but I just can not understand this being a duality. Seems like it should be either one. How can I drive and be the one on the back seat at the same time? 

[Nahm]

8 minutes ago, Galyna said:

@Nahm Let's talk about it, really. I remember you have mentioned it in our last conversation. I do not mind to have a free will, but I just can not understand this being a duality. Seems like it should be either one. 

Easy! You feel the resistance of thoughts which aren’t true. Let them go. 

Nobody said you have a free will. That’s a thought. Now, say I don’t have a free will. Say it real loud. Notice what happens.     Nothing. 

Intuition saying you’d love to throw something at me right now. ?

”How can I drive and be the one on the back seat at the same time? “

Easy! Use your feet. 

[Galyna]

@Nahm Answered in the PM

[Verdesbird]

seriously now ... 

i dont believe free will as a lesson to be learned 

as leo says free will versus inevitability merges into one since the driver behind the whell is you

[Galyna]

37 minutes ago, Nahm said:

Intuition saying you’d love to throw something at me right now.

LOL, how cool to have people on this forum that know my crazy temper . This place became a little sanctuary for me, a little special community. What would I do without Leo, this forum and strangers I meet here occasionally. This is super valuable place to learn. Love all the people here and this forum...

 

Edited April 17, 2020 by Galyna

[Galyna]

31 minutes ago, Verdesbird said:

as leo says free will versus inevitability merges into one since the driver behind the wheal is you

Believe me, I get this intellectually. But thinking about it makes me confused. I do not know how to act...or should act....there is a stagnation. 

[Nahm]

15 minutes ago, Galyna said:

LOL, how cool to have people on this forum that know my crazy temper . This place became a little sanctuary for me, a little special community. What would I do without Leo, this forum and strangers I meet here occasionally. This is super valuable place to learn. Love all the people here and this forum...

 

[Visionary]

9 hours ago, Nahm said:

@Galyna

You’re in control of and responsible for your actions. 

THANK YOU, dearest Nahm

Much love

 

32 minutes ago, Galyna said:

Believe me, I get this intellectually. But thinking about it makes me confused. I do not know how to act...or should act....there is a stagnation. 

There is little value in getting stuff intellectually. I would recommend a very open attitude of not-Knowing (which is NOT an intellectual attitude of rejection) and wonderment. Non-duality can be a hidden agenda for our shadow personalities who actually do not want to exist at all and are fueled by self-hatred. Try to filter your perceptions of concepts and view everything with fresh new eyes. Or else you'd be seeking for a theoretical confirmation with those eyes.

Surrendering to a Higher/Divine Will can only be achieved as a person. If you're an energy sensitive person I would recommend Yoga, Tai Chi, spiritual transmissions, Matt Kahn.

I would recommend to read the work of Cynthia Bourgeault (The Heart of Centering Prayer). This is a high quality book. She explains how Grace emerges as an energetic shift. She teaches a beautiful technique and has a lot of background info on how we can shift into the nondual state of consciousness.

I also would recommend transmissions by Peter Cutler (youtube channel the Enlightened Way). 

PLEASE do not get trapped into the intellectual interpretation of this work where words like meaninglesness and No Free Will are actually nothing but possibilities for a toxic misinterpretation (which could also lead shadow integration.. but still.... i wouldn't be doing that).