NOTHING MATTERS!!! (Rejected inquiry) but why?

[fridjonk]

1 hour ago, tedens said:

What "effects" have you achieved so far?

I've entered blissful states a couple of times where time stops and the false self vanishes, but nowhere close to my psychedelic induced states.

I'd love to develop my meditation to deeper levels. 

[tedens]

@fridjonk Awesome. Hard work. Blissness, that's it.

 

[fridjonk]

@tedens Work in progress baby! 

[Visionary]

5 hours ago, VeganAwake said:

No you're not getting it... nothing actually matters because there isn't anyone here for it to matter for...

The self that you think you are inside the human body is an illusion(MAYA)

How could something matter for No One

Reality = mattering or matterness (lmao) = it matters as an intrinsic process to itself which is No-Self (that doesn't mean it's no one)

So Everything DOES matter. Just for No-One.

No One can only exist because of matterness. LMAO. In a way this is also wrong, because this implies causality. They are actually both the same and ain't.

Duality is actually where the illusion is created that things really can't matter, because of seperation of existence. On a deep level the ego thrives on fighting against meaninglessness, so it needs things to not matter for its own hidden agenda (which eventually matters, so it can't lie its own way out of it lmao).

To conclude: No-thing Matters means No-thingness' essence is matterness. And things can only matter because there is No One, because Reality is REAL. 

Meaninglesness is an illusion that the ego needs for his own agenda, so it can fight against it. Ego's fight is against meaninglessness to give meaning  as a way of overcoming the illusory fight. 

So the way the ego 'gives meaning' is inherently flawed as it always assumes there is a separation/meaninglesness, not knowing that everything is mattering for its own as its own. Edit: even this flawed process matters lmao.

Edited April 3, 2020 by Visionary

[VeganAwake]

1 hour ago, Visionary said:

Reality = mattering or matterness (lmao) = it matters as an intrinsic process to itself which is No-Self (that doesn't mean it's no one)

So Everything DOES matter. Just for No-One.

No One can only exist because of matterness. LMAO. In a way this is also wrong, because this implies causality. They are actually both the same and ain't.

Duality is actually where the illusion is created that things really can't matter, because of seperation of existence. On a deep level the ego thrives on fighting against meaninglessness, so it needs things to not matter for its own hidden agenda (which eventually matters, so it can't lie its own way out of it lmao).

To conclude: No-thing Matters means No-thingness' essence is matterness. And things can only matter because there is No One, because Reality is REAL. 

Meaninglesness is an illusion that the ego needs for his own agenda, so it can fight against it. Ego's fight is against meaninglessness to give meaning  as a way of overcoming the illusory fight. 

So the way the ego 'gives meaning' is inherently flawed as it always assumes there is a separation/meaninglesness, not knowing that everything is mattering for its own as its own. Edit: even this flawed process matters lmao.

If you would have said lmao one more time it would have been a new forum record.?

Everything matters for no one... that's interesting.

Your whole story kind of just falls apart there so there's no need to go any further.

Fortunately it doesn't matter!!

Edited April 3, 2020 by VeganAwake

[Visionary]

6 minutes ago, VeganAwake said:

If you would have said lmao one more time it would have been a new forum record.?

Everything matters for no one... that's interesting.

Your whole story kind of just falls apart they're so there's no need to go any further.

Lmfao

Which story? Is there a story? Is there a me? Is there a you? (must resist....can't....resist...L-M-A-O).

You should know there is a certain responsibility when advocating "nothing matters", especially when there are a lot of young members here getting lost in endless psychological loops. Stuff matters infinitely. It just doesn't need us do the mattering. And it kinda does. 

Edited April 3, 2020 by Visionary

[Visionary]

20 hours ago, Inliytened1 said:

Yes and to even say anything is going too far when it comes to the Absolute/Pure Formlessness...

it just is..it just......... --- end all form and language now just pure bliss - not even pure bliss that is going too far ----

 

No teaching is the highest teaching because the highest teaching is the collapse of teaching.  It is Being.

 

THIS

[VeganAwake]

56 minutes ago, Visionary said:

THIS

And just being... has no meaning purpose or value whatsoever it doesn't matter in any way at all.

 

[VeganAwake]

1 hour ago, Visionary said:

Lmfao

Which story? Is there a story? Is there a me? Is there a you? (must resist....can't....resist...L-M-A-O).

You should know there is a certain responsibility when advocating "nothing matters", especially when there are a lot of young members here getting lost in endless psychological loops. Stuff matters infinitely. It just doesn't need us do the mattering. And it kinda does. 

The opposite of what you just said is true...

Nothing matters infinitely...why

Because the YOU that believes things matter is an illusion... not kind of an illusion not sort of an illusion ...there isn't a you inside the body period.

You could explain all day how something matters for No One but trust me it doesn't ?

 it's not a debatable topic it's simply the case.

[Visionary]

53 minutes ago, VeganAwake said:

The opposite of what you just said is true...

Nothing matters infinitely...why

Because the YOU that believes things matter is an illusion... not kind of an illusion not sort of an illusion ...there isn't a you inside the body period.

You could explain all day how something matters for No One but trust me it doesn't ?

 it's not a debatable topic it's simply the case.

Yes of course, but you misunderstand what I'm saying.

For things to matter is not an individual decision. It's beingness. Mattering/not-mattering is all there is/not-is. Your statements benefit the people who have kinda progressed on this path. 

But can be very dangerous to the young folk who can misinterpret it. 

What we're discussing here falls into the dualistic problem within language. So why not choose the words carefully and be more nuanced? 

What you're saying is true. No-thing does matter infinitely. 

 

[traveler]

9 hours ago, Prevailer said:

If you have cancelled nothing matters...with everything matters and you want to stop multiple EGO deaths.Why not sit on the fence and say I’m not sure whether things matter or not.

 If the EGO is truly dead this is the only SANE reasoning you can now adopt surely....you can’t use  definites one way or the other or you will experience multiple EGO deaths.

I dont know and I dont care. If you look at the phrase "nothing matters" or "everything matters" what does that even mean? Why should it matter, why shouldn't it matter, who cares? Okay everything matters. Okay nothing matters. Doesn't mean anything. Things does apparently matter on the level of the body, that's great. Who cares? Nothing wrong with it. 

Not directed at you Prevailer, this just came out, it seems to be somewhat related to your comment. 

Edited April 4, 2020 by traveler

[Inliytened1]

@VeganAwake listen to what @Visionary is saying.  Don't get yourself kicked outa here.  You are Infinite Love. 

[traveler]

11 minutes ago, Visionary said:

Yes of course, but you misunderstand what I'm saying.

For things to matter is not an individual decision. It's beingness. Mattering/not-mattering is all there is/not-is. Your statements benefit the people who have kinda progressed on this path. 

But can be very dangerous to the young folk who can misinterpret it. 

What we're discussing here falls into the dualistic problem within language. So why not choose the words carefully and be more nuanced? 

What you're saying is true. No-thing does matter infinitely. 

 

I do agree with this. The radical message WILL be misinterpreted by the ego and can be sort of dangerous for some.

[Visionary]

@VeganAwake

Here are some passages from Ramaji's book '1000'

Since this non-doership is such a big change, and there is no experience of a seperate self anymore, it is easy to understand how this stage might be thought of as the ultimate stage. But it is not. There may be an enjoyable "glow" phase after this awakening. It may last for a few months. It may last for years. 

This new sage can protest vehemently that there is nobody here, there is only no-self, I don't exist - but it just doesn't ring true. Who exactly is it who is asserting that they don't exist? It smells a little fishy.

It's not wrong exactly, but it isn't right, either. The situation is a bit like being hungry and going to a restaurant that serves, as its specialty, non-food. Can you eat non-food? Can you eat a non-apple? You can talk about a non-apple all day, but you cannot eat a non-apple ever. 

To make sense of what a non-apple is, you need to know what an apple is. Being an advocate of non-violence makes sense because you know what violence is. No-Self NEEDS a Self.

There is an attachment to No-Self and Non-doing. Therefore there is a problem with self and doing. 

Many who arrive at this stage spend the rest of their lives there. They believe this non-doing "no self" or "life without a self" is IT. 

Ramaji speaks of a negation rather than a transcendence. A complete self-realized person abides in the Absolute, in the Self, all concepts, all notions of other and all ideas of world are annihilated.

The No-Self person has not annihilated this as he needs the Self tot separate itself from.

[VeganAwake]

23 minutes ago, Visionary said:

Yes of course, but you misunderstand what I'm saying.

For things to matter is not an individual decision. It's beingness. Mattering/not-mattering is all there is/not-is. Your statements benefit the people who have kinda progressed on this path. 

But can be very dangerous to the young folk who can misinterpret it. 

What we're discussing here falls into the dualistic problem within language. So why not choose the words carefully and be more nuanced? 

What you're saying is true. No-thing does matter infinitely. 

 

Good points..

I've tried to explain the freedom the message ultimately points to...

It's really an attempt to deprogram some of the deep societal conditioning...

Meaning purpose value and things mattering, are like a wolf in sheep's clothing... on the outside they appear comforting until the egoic self agenda gets a hold of them and they become vicious taskmasters down the road.

For someone that used to suffer from anxiety it would seem like the burden of things Mattering being dropped, would be a positive... but yes the message is completely misunderstood in almost every way possible. Conditioning runs deep.

Thank you for the positive feedback...

It may be apparently beneficial to break the message down and reword it differently.

 

[Inliytened1]

10 minutes ago, VeganAwake said:

Good points..

I've tried to explain the freedom the message ultimately points to...

It's really an attempt to deprogram some of the deep societal conditioning...

Meaning purpose value and things mattering, are like a wolf in sheep's clothing... on the outside they appear comforting until the egoic self agenda gets a hold of them and they become vicious taskmasters down the road.

For someone that used to suffer from anxiety it would seem like the burden of things Mattering being dropped, would be a positive... but yes the message is completely misunderstood in almost every way possible. Conditioning runs deep.

Thank you for the positive feedback...

It may be apparently beneficial to break the message down and reword it differently.

 

Nicely put sir.

[VeganAwake]

43 minutes ago, Visionary said:

@VeganAwake

Here are some passages from Ramaji's book '1000'

Since this non-doership is such a big change, and there is no experience of a seperate self anymore, it is easy to understand how this stage might be thought of as the ultimate stage. But it is not. There may be an enjoyable "glow" phase after this awakening. It may last for a few months. It may last for years. 

This new sage can protest vehemently that there is nobody here, there is only no-self, I don't exist - but it just doesn't ring true. Who exactly is it who is asserting that they don't exist? It smells a little fishy.

It's not wrong exactly, but it isn't right, either. The situation is a bit like being hungry and going to a restaurant that serves, as its specialty, non-food. Can you eat non-food? Can you eat a non-apple? You can talk about a non-apple all day, but you cannot eat a non-apple ever. 

To make sense of what a non-apple is, you need to know what an apple is. Being an advocate of non-violence makes sense because you know what violence is. No-Self NEEDS a Self.

There is an attachment to No-Self and Non-doing. Therefore there is a problem with self and doing. 

Many who arrive at this stage spend the rest of their lives there. They believe this non-doing "no self" or "life without a self" is IT. 

Ramaji speaks of a negation rather than a transcendence. A complete self-realized person abides in the Absolute, in the Self, all concepts, all notions of other and all ideas of world are annihilated.

The No-Self person has not annihilated this as he needs the Self tot separate itself from.

I've definitely heard this material before...

I've heard this guy talk several times... not a fan... these guys all Advocate that there's some kind of path that can be followed or steps taken to reach the top(ultimate stage)

This is not at all how Liberation works( quite literally the opposite)... Liberation is not a gaining of knowledge for the illusory individual... it's a falling away of the entire self structure/egoic self agenda driving the machine.

There's a noticeable insecurity and lack of understanding in this statement below:

This new sage can protest vehemently that there is nobody here, there is only no-self, I don't exist - but it just doesn't ring true. Who exactly is it who is asserting that they don't exist? It smells a little fishy.

He sounds to me like somebody who had a deep experience but didn't quite reach liberation... didn't quite shatter the paradigm completely.

He probably now resents others that did and makes a story that there are more stages past this because he's upset he didn't attain it or it wasn't full Awakening and it didn't stick.

You will notice with these guys that there's no end... even after you reach loc 1000 you still need to integrate the experience and on and on it goes running on the hamster wheel... I'm surprised they haven't made another book called 2000 ?

That's just what is seen here, it could be completely wrong..

Thank you very much for the information ❤

Edited April 4, 2020 by VeganAwake

[Inliytened1]

29 minutes ago, Inliytened1 said:

Nicely put sir.

After going back through @Visionary post i realized there is much more wisdom in what he said. 

Ramaji speaks of a negation rather than a transcendence. A complete self-realized person abides in the Absolute, in the Self, all concepts, all notions of other and all ideas of world are annihilated.

The No-Self person has not annihilated this as he needs the Self tot separate itself from..

It seems you are stuck in the no self 

Take a deeper look into yourself bud

 

[Visionary]

17 minutes ago, VeganAwake said:

I've definitely heard this material before...

I've heard this guy talk several times... not a fan... these guys all Advocate that there's some kind of path that can be followed or steps taken to reach the top(ultimate stage)

This is not at all how Liberation works( quite literally the opposite)... Liberation is not a gaining of knowledge for the illusory individual... it's a falling away of the entire self structure/egoic self agenda driving the machine.

There's a noticeable insecurity and lack of understanding in this statement below:

This new sage can protest vehemently that there is nobody here, there is only no-self, I don't exist - but it just doesn't ring true. Who exactly is it who is asserting that they don't exist? It smells a little fishy.

He sounds to me like somebody who had a deep experience but didn't quite reach liberation... didn't quite shatter the paradigm completely.

He probably now resents others that did and makes a story that there are more stages past this because he's upset he didn't attain it or it wasn't full Awakening and it didn't stick.

That's just what is seen here, it could be completely wrong..

Thank you very much for the information ❤

That's a lot of assumptions my friend. This is by no means meant to be a linear chronological developmental map for people to be attached to. 

He actually does speak about liberation. But the ghost town of No-Self ain't it. It is enlightenment, but not liberation. 

People like Tony Parsons actually don't seem self-realized to me. Energetically they don't transmit a thing. 

Much love.

@Inliytened1 

Thanks my man

Edited April 4, 2020 by Visionary

[Inliytened1]

 

9 minutes ago, Visionary said:

That's a lot of assumptions my friend. This is by no means meant to be a linear chronological developmental map for people to be attached to. 

He actually does speak about liberation. But the ghost town of No-Self ain't it. It is enlightenment, but not liberation. 

People like Tony Parsons actually don't seem self-realized to me. Energetically they don't transmit a thing. 

Much love.

@Inliytened1 

Thanks my man

  No problem.  These guys are not truly awake.  They just aren't.