Ego-driven VS Nature-driven purposes, (reflexion).

[Moreira]

Im gonna tell 2 diferent "invented" stories to make you understand my point:

 

Story A

There's a kid called Leo who is very anxious, he has overweight and decides to start exicising.

He goes to the supplement shop to buy some proteins and find advice. The guy who owns the shop is a retired champion bodybuilder and feels very identified with Leo because he was fat as a kid, so he decides to train him for free.

Leo acquire a muscular physique with the strenght training and as a result his testosterone level is very high. So he has a high libido and need to start hiting on girls. High testo gives him high confidence and balls to aproach girls and in free time he learns pickup so he end up meeting hot girls.

He bang girls hotter than victoria secret models but he feels the calling of having a family. He chooses Melissa, they marry and have a kid.

 

Story B

There's a kid called Leo who likes videogames and is overweight. He decides to go vegan to fix his weight problems. He has a job as a videogame developer in Boston , this may sound his dream job but is not that good. He has low testosterone but he doesnt know it. As a result he is constantly depressed, has negative thoughts, and isnt interested in girls. His ego wants to escape all this suffering and is seduced by the benefits of spiritual enlightenment as a liberation.

He read tons of books, study all possible spiritual doctrines from east to west and is commited to a daily practice of meditation, and in the free time he runs a successful web about self-actualization.

 

I repeat, this stories are invented and im not saying the real leo has low testosterone.

The conclusion and dilemma

Which purpose is more legitimate, rightful, divine?

Fact: Free will does not exist, we are influenced by everything, from hormones, ego,believe systems, diet...

The case A sums up a life run by nature, all beings are designed by nature(GOD) to reproduce as a main purpose.

The case B sums up a life run by the EGO. But its not the typical ego drive of "power, fame, wealth, success, validation".

Its the Ego need of ending the neverending psychological suffering.

 

The debate
If the ultimate goal was enlightenment why God  set up a so hard game which only 0.5% of world population will succed?

Lets pretend God set up this as a experiment, to see how much people can return to the source with all the mundane traps and distractions that he prepared for us (mating, love, sex, physical needs, ego) isnt this imbalanced?

 

[Phil777]

I had the exact same thought about life. I was completely content living a 'normal' life with my friends, enjoying my art, going to music festivals and parties and progressively upgrading my life on a material basis. Only after I was negatively affected by a health condition (obstructive sleep apnea) did this natural growth path seem unfulfilling. I was searching for answers, spiritual solutions to my suffering. Deep down I just want to be healthy, be free and have fun doing what I love with the people I love. 

[Tim Gardner]

He bang girls hotter than victoria secret models but he feels the calling of having a family. He chooses Melissa, they marry and have a kid.

 

Nothing really wrong with that per say. However, what you call nature is also ego my friend.

[MisterMan]

On 28/03/2020 at 10:30 PM, Moreira said:

Im gonna tell 2 diferent "invented" stories to make you understand my point:

 

Story A

There's a kid called Leo who is very anxious, he has overweight and decides to start exicising.

He goes to the supplement shop to buy some proteins and find advice. The guy who owns the shop is a retired champion bodybuilder and feels very identified with Leo because he was fat as a kid, so he decides to train him for free.

Leo acquire a muscular physique with the strenght training and as a result his testosterone level is very high. So he has a high libido and need to start hiting on girls. High testo gives him high confidence and balls to aproach girls and in free time he learns pickup so he end up meeting hot girls.

He bang girls hotter than victoria secret models but he feels the calling of having a family. He chooses Melissa, they marry and have a kid.

 

Story B

There's a kid called Leo who likes videogames and is overweight. He decides to go vegan to fix his weight problems. He has a job as a videogame developer in Boston , this may sound his dream job but is not that good. He has low testosterone but he doesnt know it. As a result he is constantly depressed, has negative thoughts, and isnt interested in girls. His ego wants to escape all this suffering and is seduced by the benefits of spiritual enlightenment as a liberation.

He read tons of books, study all possible spiritual doctrines from east to west and is commited to a daily practice of meditation, and in the free time he runs a successful web about self-actualization.

 

I repeat, this stories are invented and im not saying the real leo has low testosterone.

The conclusion and dilemma

Which purpose is more legitimate, rightful, divine?

Fact: Free will does not exist, we are influenced by everything, from hormones, ego,believe systems, diet...

The case A sums up a life run by nature, all beings are designed by nature(GOD) to reproduce as a main purpose.

The case B sums up a life run by the EGO. But its not the typical ego drive of "power, fame, wealth, success, validation".

Its the Ego need of ending the neverending psychological suffering.

 

The debate
If the ultimate goal was enlightenment why God  set up a so hard game which only 0.5% of world population will succed?

Lets pretend God set up this as a experiment, to see how much people can return to the source with all the mundane traps and distractions that he prepared for us (mating, love, sex, physical needs, ego) isnt this imbalanced?

 

To play devils advocate.

 

ego is a force of nature aswell. So the two are inseperable through that framework

In option A,  he may be run by nature however the ego in option A is still seeking to escape suffering in anyway possible. We all have our own stairways to heaven, some it's money, others it's spirituality and others it's playing devils advocate on a forum. 

To debate wether it's unbalanced or not you'd have to look at what balance is. And how can we quantify balance in infinity?

When you recognise that all of our distinctions are predicated upon our conditioning from past experiences, (force of nature)

It pretty much lumps every one into the same category of being run by nature. Wether you're spiritual or not.

Where is the question/debate coming from within? What caused you to ask this? And how do you feel about it?

 

I feel you'd get more answers by questioning the presumptions of your debate deeper rather than the calculations of them.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited April 9, 2020 by MisterMan