How To Practice Advaita (non Duality) Teachings In Daily Life? - Advaita Talk

[Salaam]

On 7/8/2016 at 1:23 PM, Galyna said:

@Salaam

" Non-duality goes against the theory of relativity, but multi-dimensionality and relativity work together for real practical success in life. "

Reading you, feels like you have a lot of knowledge, but here is the thing, everything you mentioned here comes from an objective Reality, how can you prove Objectivity? Please support your arguments here. Everything you are talking about it is an Objective Reality that CAN NOT BE VERIFIED BY YOU.

If you can not verify it, it is just a story in your mind. All that you can verify is "your" focal awareness, that is it!!!!  

"There are 118 elements on the periodic table and they all have different reactions and chemistry with each other. How would the world work if there was only one element? What would it combine with to form blood, bone, organ, and muscle tissue?"

Here, what they are trying to claim is that everything is unified with regards to correlation and distinctions. 

Personally, I love Quantum Physics and respect people who work hard to discover things.

But again, here is what bugs me is my subjective world VS objective Reality. I feel like it is the place where I should dig.

All the facts you've mentioned here are just stories outside "your" focal awareness. You can not really know how Reality works since observer and observation can be the same, the only fact that by observing we bend Reality is so huge that scientific world exacerbate this conflict of opinions what really IS. 

 

 

 

Foundational Objective Reality is "verified", by consistency of motion and successful application, which I find this whole non-duality stuff woefully inadequate with.

Are you mixing up objectivity and subjectivity? I prefer to use the words structure/shape/form/order and dynamics/motion/expression/chaos.

Anyways, there is at least one thing that both objectivity and subjectivity share and that is motion/change/activity/life. Movement can form patterns that over-lay, connect and become structures, and it can also be patterns of expression that come from those structures. These different forms of movement contrast and inter-relate with each other, they literally bounce off of each other and that collision creates contrast which are in turn different kinds of motion. That's how sonar works, echo location, that's how seeing works, light bouncing off shit in different patterns, expressing in different colors., that's how our mind works, creating associative thought in contrast to the inner movements and influences/chemistries inside us, as well as the external movements and influences/chemistries that touch us. Whether our level of sensitivity is pinging them on our conscious awareness or not.

That contrast is important because it's the same principal that allows you to connect with and gain context from things outside your focal awareness. (which in turn creates a connective chain of contrast that EXPANDS your awareness via synergy). Our brain interprets the contrast of that light well enough for me to navigate a car at speeds that could kill me if I crashed, but luckily objective reality of contrast is verified over and over again via consistent application and success.

See, you and others on this site, hear me talk about these things and don't realize that I didn't just get this information intellectually. I didn't just read this stuff, I'm experiencing it everyday and growing and changing from it everyday. I understand structure and dynamics, objectivity and subjectivity, because I've worked for many years to track motion. And like sonar, or navigating by the contrast of light, I can expand my awareness by expanding the depth and breadth of my ability to hold and increase volume of contrast.

I'm not limited to just my "thinking" mind. Even though my mind is a self-contained system it is effected and affected by other things inside me that "bounce" off of it much like that light and sonar. I'm fast enough to track how they move, the patterns they have, the forms they take, and the expressions they make.  Like Trust. Do you know what Trust is, how it moves, it's patterns, and chemistry? No one seems to, judging from the literature out there. But, I'm fast enough to feel it's effect and affect, or what it feels like and how it shifts me.

Motion/change is the most honest thing in the world. If we want to connect and intimately understand the universe we have to understand movement, contrast, and multi-dimensional balance. We have to develop ourselves and evolve, so we can hold a greater volume of inter-relations across multiple tiers, not just within our mind, but throughout our body.

This is how growth works, learning works, evolution works.

This is how life works.

 

On 7/8/2016 at 1:42 PM, abrakamowse said:

Now that @Galyna mentions it, on a second read @Salaam  you are saying that:

"There are 118 elements on the periodic table and they all have different reactions and chemistry with each other. How would the world work if there was only one element? What would it combine with to form blood, bone, organ, and muscle tissue?"

You  are talking there about physical world, and the "idea" that everything is one, is beyond physics. Imagine the "nothingness" that is consciousness or awareness, and can create matter of 118 elements, or anything from nothing. Because it is nothing and everything.

I know what I am saying is a concept too, but it is not ONE "physically" that Buddhism and other philosophies refer to.

 

See my response above.


 

[abrakamowse]

3 hours ago, Salaam said:

See my response above.

Nothing of what you said responds what I pointed to you... I just pointed to the moon with my finger, but the finger is not the moon.

You have to "accept" (or be extremely open) that there can be things that go outside of that "verified" or measured reality that you are talking about.

Now we have this reality because consciousness wanted it to be like that, you don't know what the I AM is capable of doing. You are not seeing the big picture.

[Salaam]

2 hours ago, abrakamowse said:

Nothing of what you said responds what I pointed to you... I just pointed to the moon with my finger, but the finger is not the moon.

You have to "accept" (or be extremely open) that there can be things that go outside of that "verified" or measured reality that you are talking about.

Now we have this reality because consciousness wanted it to be like that, you don't know what the I AM is capable of doing. You are not seeing the big picture.

Really with the bruce lee quote? You're not pointing at the moon, you are pulling things out of imagination land that isn't grounded in reality whatsoever and choosing to believe them. You have heard or read second-hand that consciousness is this magical nothingness, rather than working with reality and burdening your limitations of awareness, and devoting yourself to expanding them.

You're big picture is built off the interpretations of un-grounded experience by people who have spent little to no time at all developing their actual senses and is doing very little in the way of changing your physical reality.

Why would I entertain that, when I have so much experience and understanding backed up by the real world that shows me differently?

People make up magical stories about attachment and non-attachment filled with pedestalization and aggrandizement. I work with the actual physical forces in real life that propel attraction/attachment and repulsion/non-attachment, and gain a whole new set of feelings and sensations that I've carried with me everyday for years now. 

People question subjectivity and objectivity, but I see and work with the foundation that bridges them both together in real time, via a staggering number of combinations of patterned motion.

People talk about how we are limited by our mind, but I have uncovered and work with structures deeper than my mind, which contrast with it and affect my reality.

People talk about having a limitless awareness, yet they are completely unaware of nuance and detail and all the staggering amount of inter-related movements that make up just a single second of change within the limited scope of the human body. And that's not even counting potentiality.

How many potentialities can you hold in your head? I've been able to see and act on 8 within a fraction of a second. Are you fast enough to feel a thought attach to you and in that fraction of a second before immersion, choose 8 different potentialities in relation to it? I doubt you have even the foggiest idea of what I'm talking about, because neither you or anyone else on here has spent the years training to pick up on the all the things going on within such a small window of time. How can you hope to properly describe consciousness if you're too slow and dull to see even a thimble full of all the different patterns going on with your very own perceptional system?

God you people are arrogant in your delusions. Thinking some two-bit, shallow ass belief about consciousness magically solves everything. Not even realizing or addressing the motivations pushing you to assume such beliefs.

The patterns and principles I talk about are inherent all over the world and have been here before humans and any programming of oneness. The same principles I use to balance effect and affect are the same ones found with electrical capacitance and the shifting tides on both the sun and in the ocean.

But hey, if you want to believe un-grounded stuff, that's cool. But, don't push it like it's the one ultimate truth, when it's just another iteration of religiosity, requiring blind faith.

You talk about capability, but If it was this amazing thing, people who have it, should be able to tell you about the foundational elements of learning. They should be able to learn anything they choose, slow down their perception of time as they choose, they should understand how actual physical reality works, seduction, music,  biology, emotional realities, etc.

None of these people who believe in this stuff are any more capable for it. But, the stuff I talk about changes me everyday. It evolves me.

For me, enlightenment, non-duality, and nothingness, is a pale substitute for actually developing all of who I am.

But that's me, everybody has their own journey of evolution to undertake. My road bears fruit with every step.
 

Edited July 11, 2016 by Salaam

[Mal]

3 hours ago, Salaam said:

Really with the bruce lee quote? You're not pointing at the moon, you are pulling things out of imagination land that isn't grounded in reality whatsoever and choosing to believe them. You have heard or read second-hand that consciousness is this magical nothingness, rather than working with reality and burdening your limitations of awareness, and devoting yourself to expanding them.

You're big picture is built off the interpretations of un-grounded experience by people who have spent little to no time at all developing their actual senses and is doing very little in the way of changing your physical reality.

Why would I entertain that, when I have so much experience and understanding backed up by the real world that shows me differently?

People make up magical stories about attachment and non-attachment filled with pedestalization and aggrandizement. I work with the actual physical forces in real life that propel attraction/attachment and repulsion/non-attachment, and gain a whole new set of feelings and sensations that I've carried with me everyday for years now. 

People question subjectivity and objectivity, but I see and work with the foundation that bridges them both together in real time, via a staggering number of combinations of patterned motion.

People talk about how we are limited by our mind, but I have uncovered and work with structures deeper than my mind, which contrast with it and affect my reality.

People talk about having a limitless awareness, yet they are completely unaware of nuance and detail and all the staggering amount of inter-related movements that make up just a single second of change within the limited scope of the human body. And that's not even counting potentiality.

How many potentialities can you hold in your head? I've been able to see and act on 8 within a fraction of a second. Are you fast enough to feel a thought attach to you and in that fraction of a second before immersion, choose 8 different potentialities in relation to it? I doubt you have even the foggiest idea of what I'm talking about, because neither you or anyone else on here has spent the years training to pick up on the all the things going on within such a small window of time. How can you hope to properly describe consciousness if you're too slow and dull to see even a thimble full of all the different patterns going on with your very own perceptional system?

God you people are arrogant in your delusions. Thinking some two-bit, shallow ass belief about consciousness magically solves everything. Not even realizing or addressing the motivations pushing you to assume such beliefs.

The patterns and principles I talk about are inherent all over the world and have been here before humans and any programming of oneness. The same principles I use to balance effect and affect are the same ones found with electrical capacitance and the shifting tides on both the sun and in the ocean.

But hey, if you want to believe un-grounded stuff, that's cool. But, don't push it like it's the one ultimate truth, when it's just another iteration of religiosity, requiring blind faith.

You talk about capability, but If it was this amazing thing, people who have it, should be able to tell you about the foundational elements of learning. They should be able to learn anything they choose, slow down their perception of time as they choose, they should understand how actual physical reality works, seduction, music,  biology, emotional realities, etc.

None of these people who believe in this stuff are any more capable for it. But, the stuff I talk about changes me everyday. It evolves me.

For me, enlightenment, non-duality, and nothingness, is a pale substitute for actually developing all of who I am.

But that's me, everybody has their own journey of evolution to undertake. My road bears fruit with every step.
 

Wow David. Really interesting.

How come you are on here? A website of 30 or so people who are all on the non duality path, trying to argue with them that they know jack about their own experiences.  Wouldn't your time be better off writing a book about this so that the world can benefit from your amazing insights? Surely then your time and energy wouldn't be flushed down the can like it is here?

Do you have a link to your website?

I for one would like to see how your insights hold up against expert scrutinisation 

Edited July 11, 2016 by Mal

[Mal]

3 hours ago, Salaam said:

God you people are arrogant in your delusions. Thinking some two-bit, shallow ass belief about consciousness magically solves everything. Not even realizing or addressing the motivations pushing you to assume such beliefs.

Would you talk to somebody face to face like this?

If you don't speak to others like this face to face then these kinds of comments are nothing but trolling and baiting.  

[abrakamowse]

9 hours ago, Salaam said:

Really with the bruce lee quote?
 

Well, I didn't know it was a Bruce Lee quote until now. But I googled it and I see that Bruce Lee used that quote frequently. Cool...

Well, the quote is not original from Bruce Lee, but is fun to see your level of knowledge. The quote is used on thousands of Zen and Buddhist books and it was said also by Buddha (I have to confirm this, but for sure Bruce Lee was not the creator of the quote).

I hope you can achieve everything with your grounded "reality". I know what are you talking about, and I know with what kind of stuff your are playing... I only hope you don't go too high, because the fall is going to be painful.

 

You are playing with the fingers, have fun!!! The moon is there, but you don't wanna see it!

[abrakamowse]

"The Buddha says "my teaching is not a dogma or a doctrine, but no doubt some people will take it as such." The Buddha goes on to say "I must state clearly that my teaching is a method to experience reality and not reality itself, just as a finger pointing at the moon is not the moon itself. A thinking person makes use of the finger to see the moon. A person who only looks at the finger and mistakes it for the moon will never see the real moon."

[Salaam]

@Mal

Working on the book, transitioning the website, and my radio show with my wife airs in August.

Kind of ironic how a forum titled as self-actualization is populated by people who ascribe to the idea of no-self (not all do however). But, at least there were a couple cool people I met, so it's not a total waste.

@abrakamowse

No, you don't know what I'm "playing" with. You haven't developed those capabilities and sensitivities. You haven't worked with tension to the degree I have and you're armchair quarterbacking with those assumptions. But that's okay, to your perception I'm just some guy. How can I expect you to understand?

To me Buddha is a failure who swung the pendulum to the other side, rather than taking the reins of the pendulum itself. But, that's my perspective from my experience. My view of how he's not seeing the bigger picture or the "real moon".

People can react how they want to it.

[Falk]

Some people can turn everything into a contest of "who is right and who is wrong"

"My reality is the REAL reality and yours is just the STUPID reality, i´m enlightend and you are not so go and suck my dick!"

[abrakamowse]

2 hours ago, Salaam said:

@abrakamowseNo, you don't know what I'm "playing" with. You haven't developed those capabilities and sensitivities. You haven't worked with tension to the degree I have and you're armchair quarterbacking with those assumptions. But that's okay, to your perception I'm just some guy. How can I expect you to understand?

That's right, probably I am not understanding what you are trying to do.

 

2 hours ago, Salaam said:

To me Buddha is a failure who swung the pendulum to the other side, rather than taking the reins of the pendulum itself. But, that's my perspective from my experience. My view of how he's not seeing the bigger picture or the "real moon".

That's true, nobody can now for sure what is because we see it from our perspective and experience. I am not trying to say you are wrong, if I see someone I think is wrong I try to tell him, that's all. But I can be wrong. I am open to that.

The thing is that for me the most important thing in this life is "enlightenment" and that is: seeing reality the way it is, without the filters that distort reality. And what I feel is that what you are telling me is true too, there's that "power" there, but in my opinion is just distractions, very attractive distractions, but it is not the real thing. Because we will be using those capabilities to fulfill our own agenda. The big picture is that we are not this separated being, we are the whole thing. There's no "self agenda" that's just a delusion.

The idea of no-self is not an idea or belief, you have to see it. And it is not you who shows it or get it, it is consciousness who begins to get awaken.

But maybe you don't agree with that.

Anyway it was interesting chatting with you and sharing different points of view.

Thanks!

Edited July 13, 2016 by abrakamowse

[Mal]

@Salaam 

If you're going to write a book, could I suggest one thing?

That you tone it down on the intellectual aspect.  I get tired and bored reading too much monkey mind, I prefer texts that wake me up rather than put me to sleep.  You will reach a much wider audience this way.

Also, if you are indeed trying to help and deliver the right information, at least learn how peoples psyches work, less insults, put downs, terrible twos competitiveness, slander, accusation, projection, mindless profanity fucking this fucking that... these things put people off if you're also not willing to learn and be open minded yourself, or at least try to accommodate others or admit you're wrong every so often. 

These attributes just put peoples backs up and make them just see you as a dickhead. 

You're not a dickhead in my eyes, but you could be percieved as one by the way you go about presenting your ideas.  Most influential people had people skills in order to effectively deliver their message in ways their audience could hear.  Even the common man knows and is aware of such things.

Even a failure like the Buddah managed to influence a handful of people. You have managed 0.

Less attachment to your theories too, most people hate a bore at a party.  It's the same dynamic here. At least make it entertaining and easy to read please. 

Thanks 

Edited July 13, 2016 by Mal

[Infinite]

On 7/6/2016 at 11:20 AM, Salaam said:

See, as soon as you think deeply about stuff like this you see the flaws. A world without different things that contrast and have a chemistry with each other would not be able to support any kind of life.

There are 118 elements on the periodic table and they all have different reactions and chemistries with each other. How would the world work if there was only one element? What would it combine with to form blood, bone, organ, and muscle tissue?

@Salaam Why are you assuming that multiplicity implies inherent separateness? There is multiplicity, but it is the infinite multiplicity of one underlying reality. It doesn't get more simple and obvious than this. The infinite multiplicity of multidimensional existence is all of one reality. Isn't this obvious? There can only be one reality. Even if there are infinite parallel universes and/or dimensions, these infinite parallels are all arising out of one underlying reality. 

Nobody is saying that there is only one element. You're perceiving it in that manner do to your misinterpretation of what non-duality implies. Non-duality does not imply that there is no multiplicity or multi-dimensionality. That would literally be contradictory to our direct experience. All non-duality implies is that there is one underlying reality, and this underlying reality is the essence of all things. So in regards to your 118 elements argument, there are 118 elements, but they all appear within & exist as one underlying reality. They are 118 aspects of one reality, as is everything else. 

[dirkbeszia]

i consider non duality to be a path that i resonate with deeply. i recommend nisargadatta (anything), david carse (perfect brilliant stillness), ramana maharshi and also jed mckenna is great. be prepared for alot of intense (and sometimes frustrating) mind games and uncovering of untruths. there is no other way to "get" advaita. best of luck to you brother.

Edited July 14, 2016 by dirkbeszia

[Salaam]

22 hours ago, Infinite said:

@Salaam Why are you assuming that multiplicity implies inherent separateness?

I'm not. I specifically go out of my way to say we can have distinction and difference rather than JUST separation and still be connected.

People are so quick to say we are just one thing and then discard all the distinction and nuance and inter-relation, because they are stimulated by the comfort of it's simplicity. I'm protecting all that, because it is within the distinctions and inter-relations that we grow and evolve and actually move with life. We are not JUST one thing.

If we really want to be accurate we are both connected and separate, or to put it another way, still able to have distance and be connected. The are different types and different degrees of connection that layer with different types and different degrees of distance and they all inter-play, creating contrast. Like the distance between a magnet and a metal, that while physically distant are still connected and influencing each other through the magnetic field. So physical separation, but energetic field connection. Both happening at the same time.

That is what people lose when they fuse with this idea of one-ness and lose sight of differentiation.

But whatever, people can think how they want.

It takes being able to hold tension and face resistance of the forces and fields that mediate all those differentiations in order to even balance and understand that bigger picture. Otherwise, people just tunnel-vision  back to a single layer understanding of inter-relation.

Why? Because our minds are affected by these fields as well, and when you don't balance them properly and see the inter-relations, you come up with faulty and limited conclusions about things. 

[Natasha]

@Salaam - Alaikum ('Peace be unto you' in Arabic) 

Leo has a great video out this week '10 Important Things You Don't Know You Want -- Re-examining Your Self-Improvement Goals'. This is quite an advanced topic, so if you're as advanced as you say you are, you'll dig what Leo is saying here: 

  

Edited July 14, 2016 by Natasha

[Mal]

LOL.

This thread is dead

[dirkbeszia]

Mal it was never "living"...

[Salaam]

22 hours ago, Natasha said:

@Salaam - Alaikum ('Peace be unto you' in Arabic) 

Leo has a great video out this week '10 Important Things You Don't Know You Want -- Re-examining Your Self-Improvement Goals'. This is quite an advanced topic, so if you're as advanced as you say you are, you'll dig what Leo is saying here: 

  

That's cool that you feel so strongly about this video. I've got other things I'd rather do, but if you want to give me a summary about what 10 things he think are important I'll give you a response.



 

[Natasha]

10 hours ago, Salaam said:

That's cool that you feel so strongly about this video. I've got other things I'd rather do, but if you want to give me a summary about what 10 things he think are important I'll give you a response.
 

Leo called it intervention  that will save people decades if they hear him out. So would be better if you watch it for yourself.

Here's also a synopsis of the video:

 

[Salaam]

@Natasha

Oh, so that's your aim with pointing that towards me. 

No thanks, I'm fine. 

From my view, experience, and capabilities I see this paradigm you and others believe in as limited and extremely flawed. It makes me sad sometimes, seeing what you and others discard and treat like shit in your efforts, but you and them won't get that. It'll probably just irritate you and come across as pretentious  

You of course view things differently and feel drawn to show me how you see it, while probably feeling something similar in regards to my view and perspective. 

And that's okay. 

But man, I wish I could share for a second how incredibly precious and amazing the world can be after nurturing and developing the things I've felt. To see your body and mind actually change all the way down to your dna. To have a completely different set of feelings and emotions layered on top of normal human ones. To be able to blend and layer different feelings, different speeds, different potentialities, and to see the energetic structures that play a part in the movement of the universe alive and growing and working cooperatively together. 

Its so beautiful. I wouldn't give that up for anything and the world shows me I don't have to. Me and the universe change, balance, add, and synergize. We don't discard and replace. 

I love our relationship. Man, just feeling that fills me to near bursting with happiness and energy. 

And most of all I love knowing what it's like to feel my core or my soul, palpably. To build and nurture it consciously. To know the difference between living with it and within it at this threshold, and what it's like when it's small and undeveloped and unable to regard itself through multiplicity of contrast. 

But that's just me. Other people will harvest whatever fruits they've planted along their own road.