Coping with new mental state - round 2

[electroBeam]

A few days ago i wrote that i saw nothingness in everything and this changed my relationship with my career and relationships.

This was because I saw all words, sentences, meaning, object recognition, as simply nothingness if you contemplated far enough. And what causes us to think that words and sentences have meaning is our ignorance, or unwillingness to contemplate far enough. If you contemplate far enough all meanings collapse into nothing. I now see this everywhere. Literally everything is nothingness, and the world is created through not focusing or meditating on the present moment enough. By not meditating on the present moment, you allow yourself to believe and mistake thought stories as reality. Meaning/creation is created by us pretending we cannot contemplate further, and our thoughts are the fundamental, most reduced element of this world. whats that? A tree? but whats a tree? its just a tree thats it! by refusing to contemplate further we create reality. As soon as we start contemplating what a tree is, we risk seeing nothingness. 

 

I went into a radically new mindset today, just by contemplating "whose responsible for all of this". The immediate answer was "me". Im the one whose choosing to not contemplate further to create reality. Or im the one who chooses to see nothingness. Its all me. Im doing it. But what is me? If im a human, how can i willfully make the world nothingness or something? Ahhhhhh......... Im the universe, acting through a human. And I thought i was a human because i totally forgot that the ability to perceive and be aware, is not caused by being a human, but by being the universe. A human does not perceive, and cannot perceive or be aware. A human does not have such capabilities. A human does nothing. Its the universe that perceives and is aware. This body has nothing to do with me. And me is the centre of the universe, because there is nothing outside of me. And me is the one running the show. Not the human. The universe is acting from the centre of the human flesh. The universe is being aware from the centre of the human. But its the universe that is perceiving and being aware, not the human. When i was saying I, I thought i meant the human, but i actually meant the universe. I is referring to the universe, not to the human. 

 

This has opened a radically different viewpoint. I dont know what to do anymore. There is no where to go, and nothing to achieve or accomplish. There is a very strange sense of completion, because, you cant be more than this. Its literally everything. You cant complete yourself by becoming some famous artist, because you are the one who makes up the idea of the famous artist itself. You are prior to it. You cant even become enlightened, because its your unwillingness to contemplate and collapse the world, or you pretending that your thoughts are fundamental and that you cant deconstruct further, that is creating enlightenment. You are prior to enlightenment.

 

What do you do in such a mindset? I dont know what to do. Theres no where to go or be. 

[fi1ghtclub]

Welcome dude.

Now you can absolutely do whatever the fuck you want without wanting to complete or better it.

You can do it just for pure joy.

Everything becomes a celebration after knowing this. Or not. Doesn't matter.

[LfcCharlie4]

This is common in an early awakening breakthrough to feel despair and fear. 

It's like visiting the biggest city in the world alone, with no maps, no idea where you are and no idea where you're going. 

My advice would be to keep going, realize that nothingness = complete freedom, and then allows you to live from a place of absolute love and joy. 

You can still take action, except it is the universe/absolute working through you, as you ad the SMall I are not the Doer, it is the absolute that is taking care of everything. 

Paradoxically it frees you up to do whatever you want, and in an even more amazing way as you now have 0 demands on anything or anyone to make you happy, meaning you can actually enjoy them way more than you ever did, as there is 0 fear of losing them, you can just purely enjoy life as it is, here, now. 

[Nahm]

Seem to be equating nothingness to a mental state. Intuition seems to be saying, that’s not quite it.

[SOUL]

What to do from being complete and fulfillment? Everything.

It's not about 'what' specific thing to do.... it's that no matter what you do do, it is done in fulfillment and being complete.

Chop wood, carry water before realizing liberation, chop wood, carry water after liberation.

Liberation empowers everything with fulfillment so transcend the 'mental state' of it and realize the 'being' it.

[Girzo]

That is not Enlightenment. So keep doing the spiritual work.

Edited March 6, 2020 by Girzo

[electroBeam]

8 hours ago, LfcCharlie4 said:

It's like visiting the biggest city in the world alone, with no maps, no idea where you are and no idea where you're going. 

hahahahahha good one. 

The fear also comes from knowing its all you, and you have to take responsibility for all of it. Literally everything, which is fucken huge.

Cant blame anyone anymore

And because you need to drop this idea that youre going somewhere, that youre growing... I dont know, growing doesnt quite make sense. Yes your thoughts and beliefs and paradigms might change, but you cannot grow, youve already grown. How can the universe grow hahahahahaha

8 hours ago, LfcCharlie4 said:

You can still take action, except it is the universe/absolute working through you, as you ad the SMall I are not the Doer, it is the absolute that is taking care of everything.

In my current mental state(which may change) the universe isnt even working through you. You are directly the universe working through the body. The ego was actually the universe and somehow got confused as the body. Which twists the whole notion of 'do' hahahahahahahhahahahha

the ego = human -> ego = universe is a ridiculously, ultra subtle change of perspective. Its almost as if nothing changed, yet because something ultra small has changed, everything has changed. It was like that all along, but yeah. Its different.

I think one big teaching Leo did was differentiate from you and You, little self vs higher self. This made me think I, like who I actually am, is different to the universe or I must be different to the universe. and I thought(from this teaching) that I am an ego, and the real I must be something Im not experiencing right now, and have to meditate to get into a state of consciousness where i do experience im the universe. I think this is a slightly misguided teaching. You should say, no you(little you) is the universe. There is no difference between you and You. Thats impossible. little self was the universe all along. There is no you is human, and big you is god, that separation is non sensical. The ego is the universe, youre just confused and hence dont get it. it doesnt exist, its not real, it doesnt make sense, thats just impossible. 

What the ego actually is, is not that feeling of 'who i am'. No No No. Thats the universe, no matter what state of consciousness youre in. You could be a monkey and the I is the universe, not the ego of monkey or whatever. What the ego actually is, is the subconscious(subconscious = youre half aware of them, thoughts you(universe) has which you slightly notice but dont have a full grasp on or got that thought fully under control) habits, patterns of behaviour, etc. The universe sometimes gets sucked into these patterns of behaviour and accidentally thinks that these are real. Very Very subtle and small. THIS is ego. You don't ever experience being an ego. Never ever. Thats not true. Thats a very misleading teaching.

Omg everyone on the forum saying "im an ego, im an ego, am i an ego talking about an ego" have it so fucked up and wrong. That is just so wrong on so many levels. You are not an ego. You are NOT experiencing yourself as an ego. You are always experiencing yourself as the universe. Its impossible to experience yourself as an ego. when you ask 'who am i' no matter how deluded and dualistic you are, could be a fundamentalist christian, the thing or answer you get, answer you feel, is ALWAYS the universe. Yes that feeling IS UNIVERSE. Dont let anyone tell you thats ego or human. Thats is very very untrue. 

8 hours ago, Nahm said:

Seem to be equating nothingness to a mental state. Intuition seems to be saying, that’s not quite it.

While it is clear that you = universe, literally. This just cannot be changed, this must be fundamental. Cannot imagine something more fundamental than this. But I feel that this whole universe is nothingness is the tip of the ice berg. And hence i will call it a mental state to signify a modest tone to how much I think ive experienced of reality. To show that i expect or am open to things changing. 

Edited March 6, 2020 by electroBeam

[electroBeam]

13 minutes ago, Girzo said:

That is not Enlightenment. So keep doing the spiritual work.

Yep theres an infinite way to go. Can understand the universal mind more and more deeply. Can continue Deconstructing mental or egoic habits, but there is nothing final to be or become. You already are that. You cant get enlightened. Thats ridiculous. How can the universe 'get' anything? It already is everything it can be. Enlightenment is a misleading idea.

[Inliytened1]

@electroBeam awesome!  Your consciousness has expanded to where you can be conscious that you are the universe experiencing itself via human form.  Thats a huge step.  And you are conscious of the Absolute perspective and how all duality must collapse into the Absolute which is everything and nothing.  

This is a huge leap in consciousness and now you will need time to integrate and then start seeing things from the relative perspective again.  But right now the Absolute is blatantly clear and its all you can see.  Just allow yourself time for integration of this insight.

 

[Girzo]

I don't think that the idea of Enlightenment is misleading. It tells you that in a limited time that this body-mind has in its current form it can get conscious enough to grasp the Absolute Truth. At least some degree of it, with maybe becoming happy and loving as a spill-over side effect of that realization. 

From my perspective telling people who clearly live in a delusion that they are Enlightened is more misleading.

[Inliytened1]

18 minutes ago, Girzo said:

I don't think that the idea of Enlightenment is misleading. It tells you that in a limited time that this body-mind has in its current form it can get conscious enough to grasp the Absolute Truth. .

@electroBeam Yes and when that happens you become it.  It is the falling away of the self or death of the self/perceiver which never really existed, as well as all distinctions.  Only Being remains.  After that there was no self to be enlightened.  God has awakened to itself.  

[electroBeam]

@Girzo I could say(and feel like saying) that grasping absolute truth has nothing to do with enlightenment. Your psychedelic experiences have nothing to do with enlightenment. And i feel very strongly about that.

But i wont say that, because there is a meta point that could be made here.

You need to first consider that, who I am, and what 'Im living' is your construction. Its you projecting that. There is no human called electrobeam having experiences. That is all made up by you, constructed through synthesising spiritual information and various interpretations of meditative and psychedelic experiences you seem to have had. Whether im living in delusion or Im enlightened is purely determined by how YOU perceive me. Its completely relative, and whether im enlightened or deluded depends on your ideas or definitions of enlightenment, which are abitrary, not grounded in reality, and are not true.

I did not say im enlightened. Because I do not think enlightenment is real. That is your construction, purely. In reality there is no electrobeam claiming to be enlightened. But it may be helpful to see me that way, because it helps support your ideas and beliefs of what enlightenment is, and do a sneaky sense of confirmation bias. 

I have a strong sense that you have experienced God, joy, bliss and unconditional love during a psychedelic experience, and labelled that as 'enlightenment'.

I totally appreciate that you really do think this is enlightenment, and because the post above did not have the same vibe as that experience, you labelled it as 'not enlightenment' or 'claiming to be enlightened when living in delusion'. I would have done the same if i took psychedelics. 

If it was experienced sober, same shit. Same point being made.

What you need to have the courage to do, not for me, but for understanding this meta point, and opening yourself up to greater possibilities in life, is to recognised YOU are the one who labelled this experience as enlightenment. And that was arbitrary. There was nothing about that experience which implied enlightenment apart from you CHOOSING to. You secretly, through indenial, constructed the sense of 'enlightenment' from thin air. There is nothing real about the meaning of enlightenment. 

What youve effectively done, is labelled a state of consciousness, enlightenment. You labelled properties of God, as enlightenment. When people refer to enlightenment, it is not a state. It is not a set of properties of God. It is a sense of completion, a sense of wholeness. And this experience can, but does not necessarily need to be joyful, loving, etc. The other properties. 

Enlightenment operates on a different plane to states of consciousness. Its totally different or beyond states of consciousness: joy, love etc. Just because you experience absolute joy or absolute love, or a strange loop, does not mean youre enlightened. And just because you DONT experience joy or absolute love 24/7 doesnt mean youre not enlightened.

I guess this is the critique people talk about with psychedelics, conflating states of consciousness with enlightenment.

Also be open to the possibility that enlightenment isnt achieved after finishing some sort of race to going meta on states of consciousness. Its not like after experiencing 10000 hours of absolute love, you are enlightened. No, you could be enlightened within the first 10 or after 100000. Because enlightenment is operating on a different plane.

 

Also be aware that people define enlightenment differently. Self proclaimed enlightened teachers have different depths of enlightenment BECAUSE ENLIGHTEMENT AS A LABEL IS RELATIVE. 

Saying "you arent there yet, keep going" is ridiculously simplistic. And misses a lot of points.

[Nahm]

57 minutes ago, electroBeam said:

It is a sense of completion, a sense of wholeness. And this experience can, but does not necessarily need to be joyful, loving,

Doesn’t need to be because it is.

[electroBeam]

4 minutes ago, Nahm said:

Doesn’t need to be because it is.

An enlightened person is not necessarily experiencing joy and bliss 24/7, but he is aware/knows he IS joy and bliss 24/7.

[Nahm]

@electroBeam I agree. But there’s no enlightened people.

[electroBeam]

57 minutes ago, Nahm said:

@electroBeam I agree. But there’s no enlightened people.

I agree  

What is super interesting, is having a realization that YOU invented enlightenment. And prior to experience and thoughts(before the big bang), there was no enlightenment. 

But that's going too much off the deep end, and risks pissing people off on here because their egos wouldn't be open to such a preposterous claim. So I will keep it at that. 

EDIT: The entire spiritual path, is completely and utterly imaginary. Enlightenment is imaginary. Its not real, the entire path is not real. The entire path was created by you, enlightenment was created by you. And its possible to realize, and to come home to a place prior to enlightenment, and the spiritual path, and remember yourself creating it all. 

All of you, every single one of you reading this now, are so fucken lost in your thought stories, and in your world, that you invented this ridiculous idea called enlightenment to try and remind yourself of how fucken lost in the thought story you are. And you're so fucken lost, that you even got lost in the ideas of enlightenment, and totally forgot that enlightenment was to remind you of how fucken lost you are in your own creation. This is how fucken lost you are. Hello! Can you hear me! I'm literally YOU! Yes you! The ego, the brain, the soul, whatever you think you are, I'm THAT! I'm literally you talking to you! I'm not hidden in some psychedelic state! I'm not hidden in some long determination sitting! I'm not hidden in Leo or some guru! Look I'm here! I'm you! That sense that pops up when you ask who you are, wake up! That's not a human mate! That ME THATS ME! THE ONE WHO WROTE THIS MESSAGE!

When you ask 'who am i' and you really feel that YOUness. Who you are. That's Leo, Adyshanti, the mods, your friends, your girlfriend, your parents. That's all you. And they want to help you, because they love you. Some may not see it that way, but deep down the love you. 

Its so obvious, yet but so hard to see. The signs are everywhere, you can't find yourself no matter where you look, you somehow experience everything even though you're a human, there's no scientific basis for how chemicals in the brain produce consciousness, you know yourself so well. You know who you are, very very well. You've felt it your entire life. You're a micro-micro-micro-micro-micro metre away from just making that slight recontexualisation, and seeing that you, you've known for so long and know so well, and seeing it as not a human. Making that micro leap, and just connecting the 2 together, that you are somehow experiencing all of this, and not located anywhere, and that means a lot more than you're a human. 

You've experienced yourself your entire life, you've never not experienced yourself. You been with yourself all this time. That is the universe! That really is it! You, its YOU, yes, the one reading this, the one reading this IS YOU/the universe! The universe is reading this dude! Not a human! Its the universe reading this! Its you reading this!

Edited March 7, 2020 by electroBeam

[Nahm]

@electroBeam Delight. Full. ?

[Inliytened1]

18 minutes ago, electroBeam said:

I agree

What is super interesting, is having a realization that YOU invented enlightenment. And prior to experience and thoughts(before the big bang), there was no enlightenment. 

But that's going too much off the deep end, and risks pissing people off on here because their egos wouldn't be open to such a preposterous claim. So I will keep it at that. 

 No it's not going off the deep end - You are imagining all of it.

[electroBeam]

3 minutes ago, Inliytened1 said:

 No it's not going off the deep end - You are imagining all of it.

Yes you're exactly right hahahahahahahahahahah. Its all imagination. Its amazing. Its beautiful. And if it wasn't for the imagination, I wouldn't have seen it. I'm so glad I created this. 

[Inliytened1]

Just now, electroBeam said:

Yes you're exactly right hahahahahahahahahahah. Its all imagination. Its amazing. Its beautiful. And if it wasn't for the imagination, I wouldn't have seen it. I'm so glad I created this. 

I said the same thing when i had the epiphany

Its beautiful