What is wrong with soy?

[Enizeo]

In "How to shop for healthy food" Leo told us to avoid five foods: sugar, wheat, corn, dair and soy. I've researched all of them and found the downsides in all of them except for soy.

It seems like there is some smaller studies that found issues with it, but if you look further it seems like a pretty healthy source of protein.

[Hello from Russia]

It messes up with estrogen-related hormones for Males

[TrynaBeTurquoise]

Its estrogenic, not an optimal source of protein for males at all. Negatively affects your hormones. 

Some prisons were feeding their male prisoners soy and they started developing all these health problems. It was determined it was a cruel and unusual punishment: 

https://nourishingtraditions.com/state-illinois-still-poisoning-male-prisoners-soy-diet/

There are natural forms of soy which can be beneficial in moderation, such as in miso soup. But all the processed stuff soymilk, soy protein, soybean oil, all garbage. 

Edited March 1, 2020 by TrynaBeTurquoise

[Ampresus]

Just when I started replacing milk with soy milk you guys come with this...  

[robinmk4l]

1 hour ago, Hello from Russia said:

It messes up with estrogen-related hormones for Males

This is a popular myth because soy contains high levels of phytoestrogens, but I am pretty sure there are no real evidence to support that soy consumption for humans messes with our hormones. 

[Michael569]

The oestrogen-theory is not supported in research. Soy contains something called phytoestrogens, plant chamicals that resembles a molecular structure of oestradiol and can dock onto a certain type of oestrogen receptors.  They, however, do not have the same affinity and same strength, phytoestrogens potency at the oestrogen receptor is one-thousandth the amount of actual biological oestrogens. 

In females, soy is protective against oestrogen dominant diseases such as endometriosis, fibroids, potentially PCOS and breast cancer and ovarian cancer as well as bone loss and complications of menopause in older women. In men, the effects is extremely weak and unlikely to produce any effects. The manboobs you see are from other animal products, from lack of physical activity, sedentary lifestyle, sugar and excessive aromatisation (androgenic hormone production) in the fat cells  You need to be hundred times more affraid of the crap you get in dairy which is a bovine oestradiol, several times stronger than biological one in humans accompanied by growth factor IGF-1. 

Everybody is afraid of soy yet we continue happily drinking milk and eating dairy and cheap meats. 

When going for soy, go for organic where possible though because it has been heavily sprayed and modified....so that kinda suck but the health benefits have been proven. 

[pluto]

Traditional Organic soy is fine, just consume it with Iodine or Sea Vegetables like the Japanese and Korean people do. Its actually very healthy and to experience those negative effects is usually caused by Genetically Modified(GMO Soy) when consumed in abundance daily with poor diet/lifestyle choices and lack of Iodine in diet. Soy is targeted by the meat/dairy industries because it can easily replace dairy and its superior to dairy and meat for human health. Hemp is another great option if you want an alternative.

Edited March 2, 2020 by pluto

[LfcCharlie4]

@Michael569 Well said, Soy is a minor issue compared to Processed (proven to be Carcinogenic) Meats like Ham, Spam, Hot Dogs, etc and Dairy. 

I agree with @TrynaBeTurquoise that processed forms of Soy like Soy Milk aren't great, there's much better plant milks out there for example. 

But, there's also great, healthy forms of Soy available! 

[Mada_]

If the crops are genetically modified, proteins can form in the plant that are foreign to the plant. The immune system sees this as a foreign invader, and in the process attacks its own tissue. (I read this in relation to gluten in a book by Sarah Blum M.D, but I think the principle could potentially still apply.)

[Elisabeth]

14 hours ago, TrynaBeTurquoise said:

Its estrogenic, not an optimal source of protein for males at all. Negatively affects your hormones. 

Some prisons were feeding their male prisoners soy and they started developing all these health problems. It was determined it was a cruel and unusual punishment: 

https://nourishingtraditions.com/state-illinois-still-poisoning-male-prisoners-soy-diet/

There are natural forms of soy which can be beneficial in moderation, such as in miso soup. But all the processed stuff soymilk, soy protein, soybean oil, all garbage. 

What the heck is that blog! But ok, I google further, it seems there has actually been a lawsuit. 

But also, everything is poisonous in too high a dose. 

I also recently replaced the milk in my coffee with soy-milk, how much soy a day is dangerous?

[Michael569]

1 hour ago, LfcCharlie4 said:

that processed forms of Soy like Soy Milk aren't great

you know I am a bit on the fence with Soya Milk. One thing are soya isolates and concentrates like to Soy-derived drinks and Soy proteins. That stuff will mess you up. But the typical Soy Milk like Alpro in UK has sooo little actual soy that it is in my opinion harmless. But I haven't researched this to be able to tell for sure. 

Edited March 2, 2020 by Michael569

[LfcCharlie4]

@Michael569 Exactly, but since plant milks are so readily available these days (and there's nicer ones anyways like Oat) it's probably better to just avoid. 

I'd still imagine Soy > Normal Milk, but Dairy caused me so many acne issues in the past I'm very biased 

[BETGR164128]

@Enizeo Its only soy isolates that are said to mess you up. Not soy itself. 

[Enizeo]

I found this meta study which found no correlation between consumption of soy foods, soy protein isolates or even isoflavone extracts (the plant estrogens) and testosterone levels in males:

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/19524224

So it seems we are better off with soy protein than with dairy, if you also consume another form of plant protein to get a sufficient amount of all essential amino acids.

 

 

I have not yet researched the health issues that might come from GMO soy, but you can get non-GMO soy products in Europe. 

 

 

About processed soy foods: I've read that it looses a lot of it's health benefits (like all processed foods), but I have not (yet) found any associated health risks. Especially for soyprotein isolate I've read that it's actually a good alternative to whey protein.

[TrynaBeTurquoise]

If I recall correctly about 99% of soy on the market is genetically modified.

Having no correlation between soy itself and testosterone in males makes sense to me. However, by avoiding soy you are doing yourself a huge favor in not having to walk the tightrope of being exposed to GMOs and other harmful ingredients that are usually combined with soy in the vast majority of soy products. 

In its purest form, I don't think there is anything wrong with soy. But good luck with practically implementing that as a substantial/sustainable nutrient source in your diet. 

[PlayTheGame]

@Ampresus Go with almond milk

[Ampresus]

@PlayTheGame I tried almond milk for a long time, saw Kurzgesagt's video about milk, switched to soy. Apparently soy does have more benefits for the environment.

Video of reference:

 

[Roy]

I've been some form of vegetarian for quite a few years now. Never really ate any soy products.

I don't even know the health effects of it, it honestly just tastes disgusting and that's enough to keep me from eating it.

[Consilience]

I drink soy milk nearly everyday and dont experience any estrogen like effects. Sex drive is still very high and I have quite a muscular frame from years of resistance training and high protein diet. 

The concerns of soy have always seemed way overblown to me, Ive never found conclusive research for it being harmful, but then again maybe Im slowly killing my body. 

[mmKay]

Heavily GMO, may containt wheat and gluten that can trigger intolerance. Plus you don't want to be called a SOY BOY do you?