Have anyone awakened from psychedelics?

[dvdas]

I have never seen someone awaken from psychedelics. All I observe is Ups and Downs to the baseline, its like they are on a traboline 

What suprise me though is people *understanding* the whole universe and absolute love being defensive and calling people that are not aligned with their ideas clowns. People are actually defensive about their psychedelic path! 

I also think that mystics are not completely irrelevant, they expertise is spiritual dimensions, which they are constantly on, if I were you i would consider their concerns.

Now as far as this being a technology, as I said in the beginning i dont see anyone here awakened. It's funny actually, people taking psychedelics for years without a significant change in their baseline consciousness although with significant peaks, and if you doubt them they are very capable of getting angry.. personally I can't see the technology. If you were to take from them all substances forever how close would they be to surrendering themselves. 

I dont know guys do you really want to be needing constantly something from outside to be spiritual? If it were to stay okey! But it seems it doesn't. And again if every substance is taken from you, has anything changed in your experience significantly? If yes, sorry ignore the post

Cars make you experience speed that alone could never reach, but they will never make you a faster person.

Of course I might be missing something, these are just observations I made over time in this community, and also I'm not heavily into the spiritual path, so please dont expect me to get triggered and answer every little post and forgive me if I'm naive. 

[LfcCharlie4]

@dvdas I do agree, it seems to produce peak experiences, but like you said I don't know enough to comment myself. I would be more interested to know how it effects people on a moment by moment and day by day basis after these trips. The integration so to speak. These amazing awakening stories are great, but if the trips aren't integrated and your 'baseline' Consciousness/ Happiness/ Peace etc isn't increasing then aren't you missing the most important part. But, I could also be wrong and maybe some on here do have lasting awakenings from Psyches, I personally just prefer the absolute sense of peace and happiness over lots of peak experiences. 

My first MDMA roll showed me true love, and speared me on to take spirituality a lot further and quit dabbling, so they can be incredibly useful tools. But, as @Johnny5 it seems people expect them to do everything for them without actually doing the work and going through the hard stuff that nobody wants to admit is involved. 

However, more research is going into these compounds on their healing effects, even over here in the UK which is awesome and will be interesting to see, although I think it's a much lower dose than what people take or more 'awakening' trips. 

Dr Rosalind Watts and Professor Nutt (I know) are two main researchers over here in the UK. Would also be interesting to see the long term effects of regular use on Mental Health/ Brain Health etc, unless that's already been studied. 

Before, my first awakening I was depressed on and off for 2 years at the breakdown of My Sense of separate self, and trying to understand all of this conceptually. It's called the 'Dark Night of The Soul' and it can be fucking dark. But, the lasting light at the end of it is worth it more than anything else. 

I think it was Shinzen Young who said he would rather live one day knowing the truth about his being, rather than 100 days in his old way (typical life) of being. I think that shows the incredible depth of this work

[electroBeam]

Youre wrong in that you think psychedelics are a useless tool/technology absolutely, but youre right in that it can make some people just go back to baseline. 

Shamans (and other spiritual traditions like yogis) have been using these tools for healing since the dawn of time. They do work. But its not guaranteed it will work. You need to put in just as much effort as the psychedelic is. 

The point of psychedelics isn't to significantly increase your baseline. Thats a point you're getting completely wrong. Its to get you(temporarily) in touch with your deepest self so that you know how to increase your baseline. Its to show you states of consciousness that are so bizzare that your mind opens and it unlocks blind spots, things that have been getting you stuck in your journey. Its a tool to boost the process you use to increase the baseline, but it does not increase the baseline itself. Thats why the work is still needed.

You won't find anyone who got awakened through psychedelics because thats not their role. Their role is more fundamental then that.

Their role simply replaces the role of having a guru or listening to a teacher. With psychedelics you can channel your own teacher who is perfect for you.

Who asks: has anyone gotten enlightened by their guru? Like seriously guys come on, no one gets enlightened by spiritual teachers. Therefore spiritual teachers and gurus are a waste of time, ineffective. Dont listen to them kids.

[LfcCharlie4]

@electroBeam Thanks for the explanation, that makes more sense. I guess it's because they're held in such a pedestal on here, that's why I felt like that. But, I do believe they're a very useful tool  

P.S. I would say why not also have a teacher help you and Psychedelics, wouldn't that be like going to the gym and using steroids in some cases

Just some food for thought. 

[Arzack]

Martin Ball.

/Thread

[LfcCharlie4]

@Arzack I would look a bit more into that guy and how he is right now before using him as an example. 

[Arzack]

15 minutes ago, LfcCharlie4 said:

@Arzack I would look a bit more into that guy and how he is right now before using him as an example. 

He has physical problems. Physical, even Ramana died of cancer, so your point is invalid. Look into Jan Esmann too, he is going through "brain related health issues" (and he is "very high level enlightened", a concept he introduced, although it's mentioned in ancient Indian literature too).

[Raptorsin7]

@dvdas I had an awakening on LSD that transformed my life. Was already deep on the path, but LSD was crucial. Saved me so much time, it's like a direct, silver bullet.

[TrynaBeTurquoise]

Haven't awakened in one fell swoop on psychedelics, but have accessed mystical states that have opened my mind in ways I didn't think were possible and have been a huge catalyst into personal growth and deeper inquiry into the nature of reality. 

The psychedelics didn't do it alone for me, its all about intention and what your mind is open to, how deeply you question, the understanding you already have. You need some context into non-duality as a roadmap and not be locked into any limiting paradigm. 

[SgtPepper]

Yes, there has been significant change in my experiences.

[LfcCharlie4]

@Arzack i would just say there’s better teachers to “learn” from than Martin Ball, that’s all, such as Ramana, Nisgardatta, Rupert Spira, Francis Lucille, Adya, Shinzen Young to name a few. 
 

im also not denying the power of psychedelics for giving you insights and experiences. I do just feel, for me at least, nothing has beaten that lasting peace and happiness that a true awakening brings. 
 

if Psychedelics can help people realise the nature of their own being, then I’m all for it. The question was whether they alone can fully awaken someone, (Ramana, Nisgardatta depth of awakening) and I’m yet to see it, that’s all. 

[Gneh Onebar]

@dvdas Check out Christopher M. Bache. He seems pretty enlightened to me.  

[ElvisN]

There are plenty of people who've awoke through psychedelics of course. @Leo Gura, Chris Bache and Martin Ball are popular examples

[ElvisN]

You underestimate how many trips it can take to awake fully

[ElvisN]

6 minutes ago, Johnny5 said:

Except they haven't...

The one thing I agree with Leo about is that almost all teachers out there are still asleep. But that includes Leo.

There are endless degrees of "awakeness" or lucidity within the dream of subjective reality, but there are no degrees of truth or enlightenment.

Semantics.

[LfcCharlie4]

@ElvisN wouldn’t call it Semantics, none of the people you mentioned are Fully Self-Realized, it’s not like a 1=1 scenario where all awakenings are of the same depth and understanding. 
 

This is emphasised pretty clearly by Neo-Advaitans and teachers who haven’t awakened to love. 
 

these teachers may be awake, but have they had the 10th Ox Herding picture kind of awakening? Most haven’t. 
 

again not doubting these people have all had awakenings, and probably incredible experiences on Psyches and they’ve helped them so much, but they are not at the depth of True masters such as Ramana and Nisgardatta. 
 

If you want to see an embodiment of true western masters, go read/ watch Rupert Spira and Francis Lucille. 

[ttm]

15 hours ago, LfcCharlie4 said:

@Arzack I would look a bit more into that guy and how he is right now before using him as an example. 

What do you mean by this? I tried to Google him, but nothing relevant to this came up.

[LfcCharlie4]

@ttm I saw something on one of Leo's awakening videos, linking to a podcast where he's essentially begging his followers for money and talking about his struggles, I think the comment mentioned mental health issues, but I could be very wrong, so don't take my word on it. 

But, can you or anyone point me to long term research on 5MEO or LSD etc that shows regular long term usage of these substances and the effects on the Body/Mind. I am open to being proved wrong, just from my own POV I haven't seen anyone fully awaken from psyches, but there's lots of fully enlightened teachers out there. 

And, we don't know the long term effects of regular usage of these compounds, or if someone does please point me to it, to the levels being used here. So 1 trip a week I think is the most people here do? I just personally lean on the side of caution, when there are plenty of Drug-Free ways to awaken, that are incredibly effective. Also, I'm only 20 and know a lot of young people are also on here, so regularly using mind-altering drugs on undeveloped brains could also cause problems down the line. 

I'm kind of just trying to act as the other side of the argument, as everyone is here is SO strongly for Pshcedelics, I'm more saying be careful, do your research and don't expect full awakenings from trips.

It seems these compounds are incredibly effective at giving insights and helping show you what's possible but don't seem to alter the baseline except with deep integration work. 

Like I said, 10-20 years down the line I could be completely wrong and people are using these compounds regularly having full awakenings, or the regular usage could cause long term damage. I guess we will see. 

[electroBeam]

@LfcCharlie4 Why arent we looking at Shamans??? Am i missing something here? Plenty of shamans that talk about the infinite.

Also no matter how good your argument skills are, you arent gonna get to the bottom of how good psychedelics are just by conceptualizing. Go and try it. Then you will see.

Psychedelics will be really productive and effective for some personality types but not others. While I've only tried psychedelics 3 times, i can already feel its very effective for me. Because im the sort of person who cant meditate for 1 hour everyday, just doesnt excite me. Im one of those people that contemplate whenever can(most of the day). Because i contemplate and do it most of the day, integrating psychedelics fits perfectly into what i already do. For those who segregate meditation vs life(sits down for 1 hour or 2 a day to meditate then act like nothing happened) could possibly not get far because integration wouldnt suit their lifestyle.

You need to also consider times change. New technology replaces the old. Old was horse and cart, now its cars. Psychedelics is new, or are now more publicised due to the internet. You cant rely on the past to predict the future.

 

I have a hunch that psychedelics work best with Jnana types because inquiry determines level of stuff you take back from the trip. Also energetic kriya types would do well with them too because psychedelics open chakras.

Edited February 29, 2020 by electroBeam

[Gneh Onebar]

@LfcCharlie4  Have a look at Bache's book "LSD and the mind of the universe", where he describes his journey of 70+ high doses LSD over 20 years. You will find a lot of useful informations there about the psychedelic path. Aside from his psychedelic explorations he had to do some traditional spiritual practices to ground himself and to get along with energy the LSD awakend in his body during the trips.