When ego builds expectations from benefits of consciousness

[4201]

My ego is sold out with the benefits of a higher state consciousness of consciousness. Solves all your problem! Costs nothing! What a great deal! my ego says.

But then something, anything, happens and unconscious symptoms are noticed. (Any type of reaction or story by the ego is noticed, leading to the mind thinking it is under the influence of the ego.) Then ego is always looking for something to do to fix the unconsciousness or a way to find the source of unconsciousness. (i.e. What is the unconscious belief I've been falling for lately that is causing this?). It reduces unconsciousness to a problem that requires a solution, something needs to be figured out, a lack in understanding. This interpretation of Now is not the way which is aligned with consciousness as the problem is imaginary, it's an idea of the mind. "There's nothing to know" Reality is perfect as it is, including the ego. (If you think the ego is a problem, then that's your ego creating a story about how your ego is holding you back from being at peace right now, effectively succeeding at what its trying to do.)

But still, the ego who is a pro at solving all kinds of problems always want to have a go at this one too. The way to "solve" this problem is to let go of it. How do you do that? You do meditation the ego says. So the ego-controlled body sits down for 30 minutes and waits for the problem to be solved. Then it's frustrated because it has achieved nothing and still don't know what is the problem. "Is it just because I'm looking for a problem that there's a problem?" the ego asks. Maybe, but then why would I have been unconscious in the first place if it was only that? In my experience, it is often the case that the problem is looking for a problem. But is this always the case?

My ego wants consciousness and is frustrated when it doesn't have it. It has built expectations and misidentified the I with the idea of being a conscious person who has no problem in life. But then everytime a problem show up suffering follows. How do you let go of that? How do you sit down to do meditation without wanting to be conscious? If ego didn't care about being conscious, it wouldn't go through all this trouble!

Edited February 24, 2020 by 4201

[purerogue]

Is reality perfect as it is, or is it only perfect when you are at certain state? 

I do not want to pick on people, but just because something seems bad at one moment and perfect at other does not make everything perfect, I know it seems so real that everything is perfect , just as it seems so real that it is bad, it is what it is  in a way.

 

To your question to surrender ego , there are many ways how to get there, but ultimately you could say it is about attachment to whatever arises and not getting attached to whatever arises, ofc there are many things people to make it less clogged, that is why it is called surrender, because you do not really take action , it is like surrendering to whatever arises, but not in action way. 

That is just ego ofc, you are still attached to experience itself though, to transcend it, you will have to face insanity itself. 

 

Edited February 24, 2020 by purerogue

[Forestluv]

Ime, the awareness of "problem creation" is a major realization and has a lot of practical value. I've noticed my mind get into the dynamics you describe: create a problem and seek to resolve that problem. This can be a huge distraction and can cause a lot of inner turmoil. . . However, with this realization, I've also found it tempting to seek refuge in the opposite side of the duality: that everything is perfect as it is. This is true in an absolute sense, yet not in a relative sense. If the mind tries to convince itself that everything is relatively perfect, it's a recipe for more inner turmoil. . . I like to think of it as "It is Perfect as it is now, and it is a work in progress toward perfection". One of those pesky paradoxes. . . .  

[4201]

10 minutes ago, Serotoninluv said:

Ime, the awareness of "problem creation" is a major realization and has a lot of practical value. I've noticed my mind get into the dynamics you describe: create a problem and seek to resolve that problem. This can be a huge distraction and can cause a lot of inner turmoil. . . However, with this realization, I've also found it tempting to seek refuge in the opposite side of the duality: that everything is perfect as it is. This is true in an absolute sense, yet not in a relative sense. If the mind tries to convince itself that everything is relatively perfect, it's a recipe for more inner turmoil. . . I like to think of it as "It is Perfect as it is now, and it is a work in progress toward perfection". One of those pesky paradoxes. . . .  

I think from now on this idea of "problem creation" will no longer just be an idea in the back of my mind but something I'm actively trying to notice within my own ego. The awareness of that may come slowly and gradually, but I'll keep this idea in mind for sure.

 

I'm not quite sure I understand the distinction you @Serotoninluv and @purerogue are trying to make. I don't quite get the distinction between "It is perfect as it is Now" and "everything is perfect". Isn't everything in the Now? Of course "Everything is perfect" shouldn't mean "I am forcing myself to believe everything is good for me as an ego" but "I drop any judgement of the Now, I stop reacting to the Now as it being a good or bad scenario".

If I "seek refuge" in the idea that everything is perect, what's the problem? If a meteorite falls on my house, isn't that a perfect opportunity to let go of my attachment to my belongings and move on? If someone gets harassed in the street, isn't that a perfect opportunity to try and conquer my fears to do the actions that resonate most with me? And if I fail to intervene, isn't that a perfect opportunity to let go of my attachment to being brave and notice my fears? 

[purerogue]

There isn't even such thing as Now.

Only for ego there is perfect and all other dualities,you could say that is a way how ego perceives world, for no ego there is no dualities, you could say it is a way how it perceives world. 

So to sum this up for you , if you want to see what no ego means, at least try to get your tick skull to accept that maybe there is something else ,stop questioning and try to surrender. 

Edited February 24, 2020 by purerogue

[Forestluv]

3 minutes ago, 4201 said:

I don't quite get the distinction between "It is perfect as it is Now" and "everything is perfect". Isn't everything in the Now? 

I wasn't making a distinction between those two. The distinction I'm making is between unconditional perfection and conditional perfection.

5 minutes ago, 4201 said:

If a meteorite falls on my house, isn't that a perfect opportunity to let go of my attachment to my belongings and move on? If someone gets harassed in the street, isn't that a perfect opportunity to try and conquer my fears to do the actions that resonate most with me? 

In a practical sense, these constructs can be helpful to a person. What I am referring to is conflating unconditional and conditional perfection. 

If a meteorite falls on someone's house, that is unconditionally perfect. Adding in the "to" part adds in a condition. From an unconditionally perfect perspective, if a meteorite falls on someone's house and they become even more attached to their belongings and suffer the loss of their belongings, it's still perfect. 

Similarly, it someone gets harassed on the street, it is unconditionally perfect, without the "to" add in. The harassment itself is perfect. If the harassment leads to one conquering their fears, it's perfect. If the harassment involves a physical fight - it's perfect. If the harassment leads to a murder and life in prison - it's perfect. Unconditional perfection does not depend on circumstances or outcomes - since any circumstance or outcome is unconditionally perfect.

The "to" part you added in is relative perfection. I.e. This is occurrence is perfect because of "xyz" - that is a conditional perfection. That's fine too - it can be very practical in life. 

[4201]

9 minutes ago, Serotoninluv said:

I wasn't making a distinction between those two. The distinction I'm making is between unconditional perfection and conditional perfection.

In a practical sense, these constructs can be helpful to a person. What I am referring to is conflating unconditional and conditional perfection. 

If a meteorite falls on someone's house, that is unconditionally perfect. Adding in the "to" part adds in a condition. From an unconditionally perfect perspective, if a meteorite falls on someone's house and they become even more attached to their belongings and suffer the loss of their belongings, it's still perfect. 

Similarly, it someone gets harassed on the street, it is unconditionally perfect, without the "to" add in. The harassment itself is perfect. If the harassment leads to one conquering their fears, it's perfect. If the harassment involves a physical fight - it's perfect. If the harassment leads to a murder and life in prison - it's perfect. Unconditional perfection does not depend on circumstances or outcomes - since any circumstance or outcome is unconditionally perfect.

The "to" part you added in is relative perfection. I.e. This is occurrence is perfect because of "xyz" - that is a conditional perfection. That's fine too - it can be very practical in life. 

Isn't conditional perfection in relation to an ego which identifies things as good or bad, perfect or terrible, for the sake of pursuing the good or perfect things and maintain its survival? I was under the impression that I didn't want to care about what's good or perfect for me, that I could just follow my heart to know which is the best solution and avoid comparing alternatives. If I clear my mind the best thing to do just manifests through me, (well sometimes, not often lol). But then perhaps I am simply repressing or hiding the process in which I compare and select alternatives.

[Forestluv]

8 minutes ago, 4201 said:

Isn't conditional perfection in relation to an ego which identifies things as good or bad, perfect or terrible, for the sake of pursuing the good or perfect things and maintain its survival? 

Sure, that is a form of conditional perfection. 

The test for conditional perfection is very simple: "is it dependent on any condition?".

I'm not saying conditional perfection is "good" or "bad", I'm saying conditional perfection is relative on conditions - whether those conditions are perfect or not. I could say that it would be perfect if the Uruguay soccer team added some green into their jerseys. My ego couldn't care less about the Uruguay soccer team jerseys and it has no impact on my wellbeing or survival. Yet it is still conditional perfection, since the perfection is dependent on a condition (the jerseys are currently imperfect because they don't have enough green and will be perfect when more green is added). 

14 minutes ago, 4201 said:

I was under the impression that I didn't want to care about what's good or perfect for me, that I could just follow my heart to know which is the best solution and avoid comparing alternatives. If I clear my mind the best thing to do just manifests through me, (well sometimes, not often lol). But then perhaps I am simply repressing or hiding the process in which I compare and select alternatives.

My mind has a habit of over-analyzing things and it's been very healthy for my mind and body to let go of thinking/analysis and to allow a natural unfolding of heart and intuition. It's beautiful. . . Adding in the "best solution" and "best thing to do" adds in relative conditions - and there is nothing wrong with that. It can be very practical and healthy for the mind and body. . . Yet absolute, unconditional perfection is much more radical - there are no conditions. There is no good, better and best. There just is. If someone does yoga - perfect. If someone drinks arsenic - perfect. If someone acts kindly to another - perfect. If someone punches another - perfect. Absolute, unconditional perfection is prior to "good, better, best".

To me, it sounds like you are asking about states of mind that can allow for wellbeing of the mind and body. Nothing wrong with that - it's very loving to the mind and body. 

[4201]

24 minutes ago, Serotoninluv said:

Sure, that is a form of conditional perfection. 

The test for conditional perfection is very simple: "is it dependent on any condition?".

I'm not saying conditional perfection is "good" or "bad", I'm saying conditional perfection is relative on conditions - whether those conditions are perfect or not. I could say that it would be perfect if the Uruguay soccer team added some green into their jerseys. My ego couldn't care less about the Uruguay soccer team jerseys and it has no impact on my wellbeing or survival. Yet it is still conditional perfection, since the perfection is dependent on a condition (the jerseys are currently imperfect because they don't have enough green and will be perfect when more green is added). 

My mind has a habit of over-analyzing things and it's been very healthy for my mind and body to let go of thinking/analysis and to allow a natural unfolding of heart and intuition. It's beautiful. . . Adding in the "best solution" and "best thing to do" adds in relative conditions - and there is nothing wrong with that. It can be very practical and healthy for the mind and body. . . Yet absolute, unconditional perfection is much more radical - there are no conditions. There is no good, better and best. There just is. If someone does yoga - perfect. If someone drinks arsenic - perfect. If someone acts kindly to another - perfect. If someone punches another - perfect. Absolute, unconditional perfection is prior to "good, better, best".

To me, it sounds like you are asking about states of mind that can allow for wellbeing of the mind and body. Nothing wrong with that - it's very loving to the mind and body. 

I see now you simply hinted me to keep that distinction in mind but not necessarily to act from it. Things make sense for me now. Thank you for the great advice as always 

Edited February 24, 2020 by 4201