Psychedelics actually change the brain.

[Endangered-EGO]

Even though that's just a materialistic observation of the brain chemistry, perception change sober if you take lots of psychedelics. Is that a good thing? What if you cant differentiate between the different dimensions of hallucinations? Why consider brain changing psychedelics, and not artificial strokes that changes perception of reality? People who experience strokes have a radical change in consciousness. Would you do that? What risks are you willing to take to achieve enlightenment?

Why not commit suicide if you want to have no more attachments and want experience God? Because there is no way back into the hallucination? (the one you want to have no more attachments to).

Why not go the Hindu way and torture yourself so infinity shows up constantly?

I have experienced the dark night of the soul because Infinity showed up before smoking a blunt. Total detachment from reality, but not beautiful. True but dying (ego) every day is not something most people are looking for. Fortunately it went away after 6 months.

I talked to 2 enlightened people about that. One has said it is changing the brain and different from actual awakening because it is just a memory (whatever that is supposed to mean), and the other (who used about every drug from the market 20 years ago) said its not making the progress go faster, but you risk being trapped in it. Dark night of the soul and uncontrolled visual hallucinations.

I don't want to start a debate with this, I just want to know what risks you guys are willing to take. Is actual dying a faster way than Psychedelics to know the truth? If so why are most people not doing it? Because there is no way back I would assume. Being trapped in it is not the goal, or is it?

[AlphaAbundance]

It seems when you die you go nowhere but back here. 

[Endangered-EGO]

@AlphaAbundance I heard that too. So we are basically in a vicious circle controlled by karma. That thought gives me existential pain lol.

[Inliytened1]

God creates through form and loves form.  He has made himself forget what he is so that he can experience remembering who he is through form.  That is his greatest gift to himself.   If you walked off a cliff you would be pure Infinity and everthing and nothing all at once.  But you wouldn't be able to experience yourself and know yourself  through a linear fashion or experientially.

I use "him" loosely as God is all things and language is limited.

So when you die before you die (ego death) you discover that you are God in form and can live as that - embody it.

 

[Nahm]

@Endangered-EGO Have a peak at the sneakiness of thought. Own it, so to speak. How much of that is going on, now? What does the silence tell you about this?

[Forestluv]

46 minutes ago, Endangered-EGO said:

Even though that's just a materialistic observation of the brain chemistry, perception change sober if you take lots of psychedelics. Is that a good thing? What if you cant differentiate between the different dimensions of hallucinations? Why consider brain changing psychedelics, and not artificial strokes that changes perception of reality? People who experience strokes have a radical change in consciousness. Would you do that? What risks are you willing to take to achieve enlightenment?

This is creating relative categories of "good" and "bad". From a personal/human perspective, we could say that having a debilitating stroke in which cognition is lost is "bad". . . However, be mindful of the sneaky ego. The ego wants to control the narrative. The survival of the ego is about controlling the internal narrative. Loss of narrative control threatens the survival of the ego and it will resist in many ways. For example, psychedelics dissolve egoic control of the narrative. To resist that the ego may say "If that happens it would be like having a stroke. We can't have that!!!". . . Introducing the fear of cognition loss or insanity is a very common dynamic of resistance. 

We could flip your script and say "What if psychedelics reveal that there is no difference between what is real and imagined. What if this allows an immense mind expansion that allows letting go of attachment to what is "real" and allows creative explorations into what is "imagined". Yet, the ego won't respond like this, because it wants to run the show.

And of course, we don't want to use psychedelics in a way that would induce stroke-like consequences. 

[Endangered-EGO]

@Inliytened1 Okay, that answer convinces me. I heard Leo talk about God being so infinite that he can only experience himself by limiting himself into the forms.

I already had ego death experiences. So that's it? God is what comes after ego death? The nothingness? Everything seems unreal and there only exists what is perceived in the moment? Nothing outside of perception exists. I called that the nothingness, because I realised there is nothing there (No "ME" in my brain as what I thought previously). No perceiver in people. Really terrifying. Just pure consciousness/perception and nothing else.

I was okay with calling that the nothingness, but if people call that GOD, then it is kind of... weirdly disappointing. I heard about people post awakening being disappointed. I find it also hard to believe that the other formless thing I experiences was infinite consciousness, because that just overshadows everything during meditation, but there is no point in starting a religion from that realisation lol.

[Endangered-EGO]

@Nahm  Silence tells me to stop philosophizing about this stuff and shut up, there is nothing to do but silence. However if I listen to the silence there is no need to take action, try out any new meditation or even psychedelics, so maybe use the mind to find the silence?

[Nahm]

@Endangered-EGO Sit in it a bit longer. Thoughts go, yes. Feeling arises too. Sit in it a bit longer. If difficult, then write about those feelings which arose. Being “says” nothing in silence, what could be added to perfection? What needs be said? Nothing at all. What wants to be created? Some would say, that is the very voice of silence, arising in you, creation, creator, creating. 

[Inliytened1]

@Endangered-EGO i think there is still more to go if you are still asking the question on whether the formless or pure void is God.  There are still more realizations to be had through collapse of the ego.

And one is not better than the other - form or formless.  It is but the dance of Consciousness.

Love your name @Endangered-EGO though - sounds like it sure is in danger hehe.

 

[Endangered-EGO]

@Serotoninluv  Unfortunately we cannot flip the script if it has lasting consequences. We HAVE to have assumptions. Like for instance, that the Truth can be attained through consciousness/mysticism, and not through religion/materialism etc. And we can make the assumption that we don't hurt ourselves or other people physically doing the process. Some people draw the line before psychedelics, other draw the line after psychedelics, but without a line people will do evil stuff.

Imagine people believing they have to be open minded to every possibility and their intuition didn't tell them to do psychedelics but to kill people and by eliminating other peoples consciousness they would increase their own (Or any other weird shit insane people do out of delusion).

Radical open mindedness needs to be limited by actual actions, and needs assumptions too. I draw the line with not hurting conscious beings like animals or people. Taking psychedelics is risking to hurt yourself or other people.
That's why we also need to put faith in Mystics like Sadghuru, the Dalai Lama etc.

I have to clarify, that it s not the only reason why I am not taking psychedelics but because it is more than I could handle. 

[Endangered-EGO]

@Inliytened1  Don't worry, I am only stopping the path once there is nothing left to question, and nothing left to experience. Fortunately Leo s Video on the factettes of enlightenment showed me that I could experience infinite love. Apparently this is actually beautiful and not as terrifying as the nothingness.

But only out of curiosity: Can I now be arrogant around religious people and tell them that I saw that I am God? (Just kidding) I wouldn't call it Void, I prefer calling it the nothingness. Its not like empty space... Your green pseudo suggests that you probably know what I mean.
What makes me question the fact that the nothingness is not God is because people who experience God, apparently don't say "Oh the nothingness" or "oh buddha nature" but God. Nothingness is what I would call it. Infinity is also not distinguishable. There is no other word for it. 

Believe me, my Ego is fighting with fear as its main weapon. Back then when I experienced the nothingness it had no other choice, like the one second that was needed, Infinity ripped apart my ego by trapping me in infinite timelessness until it gave up. 

[Llight]

It;s called acute psychosis, here is a research paper among many many more describing the experience. Well this is what science people call it at least.

[Forestluv]

16 minutes ago, Endangered-EGO said:

@Serotoninluv  

Radical open mindedness needs to be limited by actual actions, and needs assumptions too. I draw the line with not hurting conscious beings like animals or people. Taking psychedelics is risking to hurt yourself or other people.
 

You are entering harm anxiety now. This was one of my biggest issues with psychedelics and I have a lot of experience with intense anxiety/panic spaces. Stuff that impacted me for weeks or months - and still returns at times. This isn't just an intellectual thing. There is a deep energetic component. Personally, this is something I take very seriously with my use of psychedelics. As I wrote above, there are psychedelic realms that can be traumatic to a mind and body. These realms can also be enlightening, yet I would be very careful. There are also loving, blissful realms.

If you are experiencing intense levels of anxiety associated with psychedelic-induced loss of control - such as harm anxiety and psychosis anxiety - I would be extra cautious when using psychedelics. Even if the risk of actually causing harm or having psychosis is tiny - it doesn't matter. What matters is the underlying energetics of the anxiety/panic. Quite often this anxiety/panic is irrational - yet it doesn't matter. For example, statistics showing low risks of psychedelic-induced harm and psychosis may help dissolve anxiety in some, but not others - because it isn't a logical/rational dynamic. 

They can still be very helpful, yet I would be extra cautious. When I was new with psychedelics, there were a lot of people that told me that anxiety is normal and I just needed to "let go and surrender". Looking back, they didn't understand the level of anxiety I was talking about. I had to learn from experience how I personally relate to psychedelics. How I use psychedelics now is very different than when I was a newbie.