Is Truth Absolutely Known or Absolutely Unknown?

[VeganAwake]

29 minutes ago, Anton Rogachevski said:

@Nahm

How else should one share insights? Keep playing Zen games?

Just tell them it's unknowable, which it is ❤

[Nahm]

@VeganAwake Easily spotted too. ?

[SOUL]

8 hours ago, Lento said:

Or, the obsession with 'being present' is just more ego fixation to distract from knowing.

?

Your ego fixates on being present? How do you know that if it's distracts from knowing?

[Lento]

Just now, SOUL said:

Your ego fixates on being present?

Yes, consider;

• Being dogmatic about being present.
• Being unable to deal with the illusion; i.e. Resisting the illusion.
• Being addicted to feeling good.

5 minutes ago, SOUL said:

How do you know that if it's distracts from knowing?

This question does not make sense to me.

[SOUL]

4 hours ago, Anton Rogachevski said:

How else should one share insights? Keep playing Zen games?

Any 'insights' we have are merely our own perception of our experience, it's not any type of universal 'map' that everyone can follow.

We can share our insights to find others who resonate with similar imagery and concepts but to suggest one perception is absolute truth and another is illusion can lead to people seeking the imagery of conceptualization instead of the experience of being present.

As we awaken to the experience of being present our imagery and conceptualization will evolve with it so to focus too much on just one marker of our own personal path and teaching it as an absolute truth isn't awakened to the oneness of all marks and all paths.

We don't all share the exact same perception in experience so don't share the exact same imagery, concepts or paths even though we share in the exact same oneness.

[SOUL]

31 minutes ago, Lento said:

Yes, consider;

• Being dogmatic about being present.
• Being unable to deal with the illusion; i.e. Resisting the illusion.
• Being addicted to feeling good.

What's the dogma of being present? There are no codes or tenets, it's just the natural state of our being.... we are a being that is present.

We can't leave the present but the ego's story telling is to distract from the present through contextualizing the past and imagining the future.

Those two other bullet points seem pointless, explain how they relate to what I am speaking about.

[Lento]

19 minutes ago, SOUL said:

We can't leave the present but the ego's story telling is to distract from the present through contextualizing the past and imagining the future.

Story ??

[Danioover9000]

   This is quite the interesting thread.

[Forestluv]

24 minutes ago, SOUL said:

What's the dogma of being present? 

A great question to contemplate, yet the mind will likely resist to maintain control of the mental narrative. A half-step would be “What’s the ideology of being present?” This can help reveal one’s attachment/ identification. 

[SOUL]

2 hours ago, Lento said:

Story ??

One that happens whether it's told or not.

[SOUL]

2 hours ago, Serotoninluv said:

A great question to contemplate, yet the mind will likely resist to maintain control of the mental narrative. A half-step would be “What’s the ideology of being present?” This can help reveal one’s attachment/ identification. 

Does being present even neex an ideology? Maybe we can ask the dog.

When is one not present? Even when distracted from it being is still present.

Does that make it attachment even if there is no identification?

Maybe the present is the consciousnesses' attachment and identification with the manifest.

[Anton Rogachevski]

@SOUL

While it's quite effective, reducing all to just being present is kind of boring, don't you think? 

[Shadowraix]

5 minutes ago, Anton Rogachevski said:

@SOUL

While it's quite effective, reducing all to just being present is kind of boring, don't you think? 

Did you come here to be entertained? Or to align yourself to what is? 

[Lento]

29 minutes ago, SOUL said:

One that happens whether it's told or not.

The past has happened whether it's told or not.

That being said; what makes the present moment special?

[SOUL]

19 minutes ago, Anton Rogachevski said:

@SOUL

While it's quite effective, reducing all to just being present is kind of boring, don't you think? 

From a perspective of the ego yes being present is kind of boring because it happens without its participation so doesn't feed it's identify.

Once one is liberated from existential yearning and has well being that transcends self suffering everything becomes an expression of that well being so isn't boring at all.

[Anton Rogachevski]

@SOUL

If so we don't need all the books and lectures or teachers. Just a sign that says "be present".

But I'm afraid it's not the case. There are many facets to Truth, and we should talk about them. 

[Danioover9000]

1 hour ago, Anton Rogachevski said:

@SOUL

If so we don't need all the books and lectures or teachers. Just a sign that says "be present".

But I'm afraid it's not the case. There are many facets to Truth, and we should talk about them. 

@Anton Rogachevski Yes, there's a lot to truth than the present moment. Despite how simple it is, you have to take into account language and the self/other duality. Non-duality and spiritual are a bit tricky for newbies than what Neo adviatens like to think.

   Furthermore, there's the paranormal to take into account. While expanding consciousness, you're bound to experience paranormal abilities and beings that have been told in myths and stories cultivated throughout history. There was an event with one of the Hollywood films, I don't remember the name, that during the making of the film they used some bones from the Egyptian crates as props for one of the scenes when the basement was flooded and the soil unearthed bone remains. Well, the crew Experienced a series of bad luck, accidents and some illnesses during film making because of that.

[Danioover9000]

1 hour ago, Lento said:

The past has happened whether it's told or not.

That being said; what makes the present moment special?

   It's kinda like taking two balls on each hand, and squeezing them together. One is called 'past' the other is called 'future', and the tension between them and on the boundary is called 'present'. The past feels very real while the possibilities of the future, will it's not factual, is still very real. Even if you let go of the balls, the force you've generated at them was so great that that part of the balls fuesed together, and now past and future are tied together at the present moment, containing all parts of time.

   Like if you imagined going for a walk, then you are walking, and before bed you reflect on your outdoor walk in the park, despite millions of moments have passed, those moments where you're imagining the walk while walking, and reflecting on a prior walk while walking, where past/present and future/present interact, that all can be illusory, yet is very real and beneficial. Without the present moment between the past/future, it's very easy to get lost.

[Forestluv]

3 hours ago, SOUL said:

Does being present even need an ideology? Maybe we can ask the dog. <= ideas

When is one not present? Even when distracted from it being is still present. <= ideas

Does that make it attachment even if there is no identification? <= idea

Maybe the present is the consciousnesses' attachment and identification with the manifest. <= ideas

Ideas + ideas + idea + ideas = ideology. 

The context in which I'm using the term "ideology" is a related set of ideas. I would consider a set of ideas about "being present" to be an ideology. 

This does not suggest I disagree with the ideas. 

I think one question you allude to has insight value. That is "can there be attachment even if there is no identification?". I would say yes. Attachment can be very subtle. In it's most subtle form, any word, thought, image or perception is a subtle attachment. 

[SOUL]

2 hours ago, Anton Rogachevski said:

@SOUL

If so we don't need all the books and lectures or teachers. Just a sign that says "be present".

But I'm afraid it's not the case. There are many facets to Truth, and we should talk about them. 

We don't need all them.... we don't need to say be present.... we can't be anything but present. There isn't even a need to tell someone to be because being just is.... to be or not to be is not even a question.

The ego desires all those other things to accomplish, to understand, to examine... to 'do'.. to identify with. All that other stuff are just stories... 'truth' is a story that we tell ourselves that we 'know' what really is.

As soon as you are done being afraid it's not the case you can let go of that yearning desire that you aren't complete, fulfilled and at peace..... so just be it.