Depersonalization and Enlightenment

[Red-White-Light]

Looking at some of the symptoms of depersonalization I can't help but to notice extreme similarities to enlightenment.

How could you differentiate between the two. What if enlightenment and derealization are the exact same thing, but for the "derealized" person the no-self and dream-like nature of reality gives them anxiety and they can't come to acceptance of their ego death or disillusion.

  

[kag101]

Yes, those two are commonly confused with each other.

Here are some excerpts from an article by someone who suffers from Depersonalization Disorder:

Quote

"At one point during my time with DP, I fully convinced myself that it must be some form of enlightenment.

Enlightenment seems to make sense because it’s was only interpretation that contains some sort of spiritual meaning, but that doesn’t make it any more valid.

What’s more likely — that 1 in 50 people are being struck down with unsolicited ‘enlightenment’ and that that number is increasing with time? Or that it’s a form of chronic anxiety that’s becoming more common because of drug use? All the evidence points to the latter.

As psychiatrist and depersonalization specialist Daphne Simeon writes: “People suffering from depersonalization disorder don’t appear at a doctor’s or psychiatrist’s office to explore mysticism, philosophy, or the deep blue sea. They make the appointment because they are in pain.”

Depersonalization disorder is caused by trauma, panic attacks and drug use (including psychedelics), and it’s becoming more and more common. We need to raise common-sense awareness of this crippling condition, and not ascribe to it a spiritual credence that it simply doesn’t warrant."

Read more at: https://psychcentral.com/lib/is-depersonalization-disorder-a-form-of-enlightenment/

A lot of people who are mentally unstable are drawn to spirituality as an attempt to justify their sick mental condition.

I think that a good rule-of-thumb is to meet with a good spiritual teacher--preferably face-to-face--on a frequent basis. He or she will quickly spot if you're on the wrong track.

The odds of falling into traps while doing spiritual work are VERY high. And a teacher can help you get unstuck. Otherwise, it might take years for you to realize you were on a dead-end.

Edited February 11, 2020 by kag101

[Red-White-Light]

@kag101 There's an inflection point in reality when you focus on actuality. In the beginning things are/feel real but as you begin to amplify conciousness, the solidity and realness of reality begins to slip away, like water in your hand. As you look in the mirror you even start to realise that you're not even human. Yes, there is a biological ape-like creature that has survival needs like eating, reproduction, drinking, sleeping etc, but it's not really you. 

Edited February 11, 2020 by Red-White-Light

[mandyjw]

The mind loves to create problems out of nothing. The dissolution of self is a very big problem... to the self. 

1 hour ago, kag101 said:

A lot of people who are mentally unstable are drawn to spirituality as an attempt to justify their sick mental condition.

Enlightenment require transcendence of all identity, including and especially the identity and of oneself as "sane" over "crazy."

[Red-White-Light]

@mandyjw I'm sure there are plenty of cases of people being enlightened and having an ailments with their brain. It must happen a lot to people who abuse drugs with phycedelics. The phycedelics give them enlightenment experiences and the drugs fuck them up, making then insane. And being insane and enlightened at the same time would be a true mindfuck. The enlightenment would reinforce the delusions of the insane person also, so it's tricky territory.

[mandyjw]

I'm beginning to appreciate the irony in how much education it takes to forget what you know and how much passionate desire it takes to transcend one's own wants.

Without nondual or religious teachings of some sort, or without having the notion is one's head of enlightenment being a "goal" to "achieve", an enlightenment experience is going to be interpreted as a very big problem.

We are so quick to say something is abnormal that we don't stop to consider that we have never experienced "normal" at all. 

[Inliytened1]

@Red-White-Light  Yeah when I had my awakening experiences I knew instantaneously that it was the same thing - i was like holy fuck this is Depersonalization!  however i believe it is lacking the Bliss and the Love and the realizations that come with enlightenment and the elevated consciousness levels.   Shinzen Young calls it enlightenment's evil twin because it's like only half the story.

[mandyjw]

1 minute ago, Red-White-Light said:

@mandyjw I'm sure there are plenty of cases of people being enlightened and having an ailments with their brain. It must happen a lot to people who abuse drugs with phycedelics. The phycedelics give them enlightenment experiences and the drugs fuck them up, making then insane. And being insane and enlightened at the same time would be a true mindfuck. The enlightenment would reinforce the delusions of the insane person also, so it's tricky territory.

You cannot be insane and enlightened at the same time. "Insane/sane is a duality", a fictional judgement of the mind. 

The way we judge if someone is sane or insane is by judging how proficient they are at survival. Paradoxically for most of us enlightenment requires balance, respect and acceptance for survival "concerns", but without fear. That's the concern with drug abuse, they are seeing truth without having access to the understanding and practices necessary for integration. 

[Red-White-Light]

@Inliytened1

40 minutes ago, Inliytened1 said:

@Red-White-Light  Yeah when I had my awakening experiences I knew instantaneously that it was the same thing - i was like holy fuck this is Depersonalization!  however i believe it is lacking the Bliss and the Love and the realizations that come with enlightenment and the elevated consciousness levels.   Shinzen Young calls it enlightenment's evil twin because it's like only half the story.

That's a really good way to explain it.

[Leo Gura]

2 hours ago, Red-White-Light said:

What if enlightenment and derealization are the exact same thing, but for the "derealized" person the no-self and dream-like nature of reality gives them anxiety and they can't come to acceptance of their ego death or disillusion.

That's like saying, what if a man and woman are the exactly same thing, expect the man has a dick.

That's a pretty important difference.

The awakened person realizes he is God. The derealized person does not.

There is no glass between the awakened person and the world, the awakened person IS the whole world. And the awakened person has surrendered to it.

[Red-White-Light]

@Leo Gura You cannot be God because there never was God, only Godliness. The only thing you can realize is the Godliness.

[Inliytened1]

52 minutes ago, Red-White-Light said:

@Inliytened1

That's a really good way to explain it.

Thanks. ?

[Matt23]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9zIKQCwDXsA 

Here's Shinzen Young talking about "Enlightenment, DP/DR & Falling Into the Pit of the Void"