Oh The Paradoxical Nature Of Human Interactions

[Emerald]

12 minutes ago, Heart of Space said:

I know in my case I'm very attached to the idea that I am an intelligent person.  And when I can "beat" other people in a debate with "superior" use of logic and reason it props up my concept of self-worth.   This is especially bad when I meet someone like me in this way and we have a disagreement.  It's like gasoline to a fire.  I've gotten better about it though and try my best to be more open minded and admit when I'm wrong.  It doesn't always work out though as you can *cough* see here. 

I was genuinely trying to be nice and cordial and certain points though, but I just get sucked right back into the ego black hole.  A great example was the last post you quoted where I was responding to Mal.  I have to be incredibly careful in self-awareness work because minds like mine tend to bloat themselves with self-aggrandizing ego stroking thoughts.  It's easy to want to wank your ego off with the idea of how much more self-aware you are then "normal" people.  I don't even like admitting it, but it is true. 

That's totally me in a nutshell. I think that when I was little I was indoctrinated to think some pretty neurotic things. 1. I'm intelligent 2. Intelligence has more value than any other trait. 3. Intelligence equals good character. 4. People who are more intelligent are better and more deserving of love than unintelligent people.

There are probably many other taken for granted beliefs in this mess too. But it has caused me to obsess over my intellect and be constantly unsatisfied with how much know-how that I have. But during my experiences that I mentioned earlier on the thread, these were the only times that I had no craving to pump up my intelligence in any way. It was truly liberating. I was finally satisfied.

Edited June 25, 2016 by Emerald Wilkins

[Mal]

4 minutes ago, Heart of Space said:

I know in my case I'm very attached to the idea that I am an intelligent person.  And when I can "beat" other people in a debate with "superior" use of logic and reason it props up my concept of self-worth.   This is especially bad when I meet someone like me in this way and we have a disagreement.  It's like gasoline to a fire.  I've gotten better about it though and try my best to be more open minded and admit when I'm wrong.  It doesn't always work out though as you can *cough* see here. 

I was genuinely trying to be nice and cordial and certain points though, but I just get sucked right back into the ego black hole.  A great example was the last post you quoted where I was responding to Mal.  I have to be incredibly careful in self-awareness work because minds like mine tend to bloat themselves with self-aggrandizing ego stroking thoughts.  It's easy to want to wank your ego off with the idea of how much more self-aware you are then "normal" people.  I don't even like admitting it, but it is true. 

@Emerald Wilkins

Im not sure where you guys get your information from.  People at my stage of development get angry, feel superior, and do all the normal things everybody else does.

The difference isn't awareness, its complexity.  I genuinely don't like smutty offensive behaviour, not because I'm a prude, but because there are other things in the grand scheme of things to consider, and shallow self expression on a forum where people can sometimes be trying to open up, there shame here etc, can be difficult if they feel threatened.  It's about responsibility.

Yes, limbic resonance.  That's the words I use because I hand out in Integral forums too and that's the language we use.  I was illustrating while I'm in a place of hardly any ego manifesting that there is still feelings based on my ego development and they get triggered.  No self doesn't mean no feelings.

The way you have made meaning from this event is the degree to which you are developed.  The meaning making I make from this event you will not understand because you simply have not done the work, and your meaning making conveys that.

This is not my fault, this is just the way it is.

I can't really say much more to you guys because I know now you're just going to process what you are able to according to your own minds.

But, I'll ask again, can you calm down with the childish excessive profanity and nonsense about taking a dump please, because it might appeal to twenty somethings who have found their spiritual mentors on youtube, but it doesn't appeal to everybody.  We ideally want more people here sharing their issues rather than flaunting them and pretending they have some kind of awareness or handle over their bullshit.

Thanks

[Emerald]

4 minutes ago, Mal said:

@Emerald Wilkins

Im not sure where you guys get your information from.  People at my stage of development get angry, feel superior, and do all the normal things everybody else does.

The difference isn't awareness, its complexity.  I genuinely don't like smutty offensive behaviour, not because I'm a prude, but because there are other things in the grand scheme of things to consider, and shallow self expression on a forum where people can sometimes be trying to open up, there shame here etc, can be difficult if they feel threatened.  It's about responsibility.

Yes, limbic resonance.  That's the words I use because I hand out in Integral forums too and that's the language we use.  I was illustrating while I'm in a place of hardly any ego manifesting that there is still feelings based on my ego development and they get triggered.  No self doesn't mean no feelings.

The way you have made meaning from this event is the degree to which you are developed.  The meaning making I make from this event you will not understand because you simply have not done the work, and your meaning making conveys that.

This is not my fault, this is just the way it is.

I can't really say much more to you guys because I know now you're just going to process what you are able to according to your own minds.

But, I'll ask again, can you calm down with the childish excessive profanity and nonsense about taking a dump please, because it might appeal to twenty somethings who have found their spiritual mentors on youtube, but it doesn't appeal to everybody.  We ideally want more people here sharing their issues rather than flaunting them and pretending they have some kind of awareness or handle over their bullshit.

Thanks

I apologize for the profanity. I don't usually curse, but I thought that it would have a better effect for what I was trying to convey. I meant no offense by what I said. I basically said that you guys were both using various tactics to 'win' the interaction, and that it's a trap that I fall into a lot. But I apologize if it offended you. I was trying to make light by highlighting my own shortcomings.

[Heart of Space]

17 minutes ago, Mal said:

@Emerald Wilkins

Im not sure where you guys get your information from.  People at my stage of development get angry, feel superior, and do all the normal things everybody else does.

The difference isn't awareness, its complexity.  I genuinely don't like smutty offensive behaviour, not because I'm a prude, but because there are other things in the grand scheme of things to consider, and shallow self expression on a forum where people can sometimes be trying to open up, there shame here etc, can be difficult if they feel threatened.  It's about responsibility.

Yes, limbic resonance.  That's the words I use because I hand out in Integral forums too and that's the language we use.  I was illustrating while I'm in a place of hardly any ego manifesting that there is still feelings based on my ego development and they get triggered.  No self doesn't mean no feelings.

The way you have made meaning from this event is the degree to which you are developed.  The meaning making I make from this event you will not understand because you simply have not done the work, and your meaning making conveys that.

This is not my fault, this is just the way it is.

I can't really say much more to you guys because I know now you're just going to process what you are able to according to your own minds.

But, I'll ask again, can you calm down with the childish excessive profanity and nonsense about taking a dump please, because it might appeal to twenty somethings who have found their spiritual mentors on youtube, but it doesn't appeal to everybody.  We ideally want more people here sharing their issues rather than flaunting them and pretending they have some kind of awareness or handle over their bullshit.

Thanks

Great post, glad we can calm down a little.

Part of my strategy on the internet has always been to provoke a response using a mix of intelligence with a bit of childish humor.  It's always worked for me before in terms of getting people to respond.  It is childish, but I learned about you and myself in the process.  In retrospect and in fairness probably not the best way to go about it.  Especially on a forum like this. 

You make a really good point in regards to respecting others in showing their vulnerability in seeking self-improvement.  Point taken and I will make a concerted effort to be much more respectful on these boards, truly.  I will say though you did misinterpret some fairly benign humor as malicious, though.  It's not your fault really, because text fails to convey context and I think if you interacted with me in person you'd be pleasantly surprised. 

Edited June 25, 2016 by Heart of Space

[Mal]

2 minutes ago, Heart of Space said:

I will say though you did misinterpret some fairly benign humor as malicious, though.  

Perhaps.

Or how about we do a little shadow work and I'll suggest you didn't grasp when your "humour" was unwelcome and an inappropriate response to certain requests being made of you, or questions being asked of you?

How bout you take responsibility off of me for YOUR lack of social graces, and take 100% responsibility for your issues it instead?

That's "self awareness" in a nugget sized nutshell that I think somebody like you would be able to handle.

[Heart of Space]

12 minutes ago, Mal said:

Perhaps.

Or how about we do a little shadow work and I'll suggest you didn't grasp when your "humour" was unwelcome and an inappropriate response to certain requests being made of you, or questions being asked of you?

How bout you take responsibility off of me for YOUR lack of social graces, and take 100% responsibility for your issues it instead?

That's "self awareness" in a nugget sized nutshell that I think somebody like you would be able to handle.

Woah there, Mal, you're dangerously skirting another pissing contest, mate.  I already did take responsibility for my assholish behavior if you read my post.  I only suggested that you, just maybe, played a part in our argument by misinterpreting my intentions and responding in a manner that was completely disproportionate to the entire situation.  You are incredibly passive aggressive you know that? 

And you continue on with this idea that you can act like an egoic maniac and still talk down to me as if you are on some higher plane of existence.  I don't think anyone is buying it, dawg. 

Edited June 25, 2016 by Heart of Space

[Mal]

@Mal Dont play mind games with me.  I'm more than passive aggressive, I'm openly aggressive, especailly to fuck wits who try to use concepts they know nothing of to shame me or others for their own screw ups.

If you think I'm some kind of passive new age type who will take being walked over or had a problem with conflict, think again.

Here is the tread where your nightclub drunken asshole behaviour got the better of you.  You've already been suspended from here for posting nonsense.  I will happily hound your ass to get you banned from this site if you pull any more disrespect.

 

[Heart of Space]

15 minutes ago, Mal said:

@Mal Dont play mind games with me.  I'm more than passive aggressive, I'm openly aggressive, especailly to fuck wits who try to use concepts they know nothing of to shame me or others for their own screw ups.

If you think I'm some kind of passive new age type who will take being walked over or had a problem with conflict, think again.

Here is the tread where your nightclub drunken asshole behaviour got the better of you.  You've already been suspended from here for posting nonsense.  I will happily hound your ass to get you banned from this site if you pull any more disrespect.

 

Nah, you're pretty passive aggressive and only now are you really becoming openly aggressive now that I pointed it out.  Anyone can go read your posts and see how you were putting on your holier than thou mask on when talking to me.  I poked holes in your mask and you became more and more aggressive and openly angry the more I did it. 

Who said you're a passive hippy?  I actually think you're pretty smart, you are just letting your anger towards me get the better of you. 

In terms of the thread you quoted.  Yea, I kind of spontaneously said that and it was out of lack of self-awareness that I said that.  I fully admit.  100% my own fault and no one else.  I should have just said:  "The elevation which one practices self awareness does not make ones perspective any more valid and I would like to hear the actual content of what is being said."  I made an error there.   But hey, I can take responsibility for myself.  Seems you struggle with that a bit as much as you like to make passing comments about how incredibly mentally developed you are.

And I have a question.  This is not an attack.  Are you kind of old?  Cause that would explain a lot. 

Edited June 25, 2016 by Heart of Space

[jjer94]

53 minutes ago, Mal said:

But, I'll ask again, can you calm down with the childish excessive profanity and nonsense about taking a dump please

 

12 minutes ago, Mal said:

I'm more than passive aggressive, I'm openly aggressive, especailly to fuck wits

 

12 minutes ago, Mal said:

Here is the tread where your nightclub drunken asshole behaviour got the better of you.

 

12 minutes ago, Mal said:

 I will happily hound your ass to get you banned from this site if you pull any more disrespect.

[Mal]

7 hours ago, Heart of Space said:

Don't delete them, Ayla.  It's fine.  Topic resumed. 

[Heart of Space]

@Mal Not sure what your point is.  That I changed my mind? 

Edited June 26, 2016 by Heart of Space

[Mal]

Again, I don't know where you get the idea that there are people walking around without a social persona, and that they don't respond negatively when their values are being direrespected? 

Perhaps in comic books you may find people like that. 

But, besides all that, what I see is a person in you who enjoys making people upset. That to me is narcissism. Going by the rest of your illogical behaviour too I would hasten my assessment of you is correct..

Now, it needent have been this way, as most mature and developed people don't test people for reliability to "see if their advice is worth listening to". That is a bit binary, most have something decent to share. 

Anyway, I am no longer going to keep you in your supply by feeding you more attention. 

Warmly

Mal 

[Heart of Space]

8 minutes ago, Mal said:

Again, I don't know where you get the idea that there are people walking around without a social persona, and that they don't respond negatively when their values are being direrespected? 

Perhaps in comic books you may find people like that. 

But, besides all that, what I see is a person in you who enjoys making people upset. That to me is narcissism. Going by the rest of your illogical behaviour too I would hasten my assessment of you is correct..

Now, it needent have been this way, as most mature and developed people don't test people for reliability to "see if their advice is worth listening to". That is a bit binary, most have something decent to share. 

Anyway, I am no longer going to keep you in your supply by feeding you more attention. 

Warmly

Mal 

I don't think there are people who lack a social persona.  It's just someone who heavily implies that they are "awakened" would have greater self-control over thoughts and feelings and not let it cause them to lash out in such a childish way as you did.  What did you call it again?  Oh yea, stuck in the development stage of the "terrible two's?"

And to be fair, you kind of sought this argument out after I annoyed you by constantly responding to me and acting childish in my threads.  I was ready to end this cordially several times, but you kept it going.  Did you get what you wanted out of this?  I hope so. 

Man I just flung so much poop with this post.  I'll be impressed if you don't respond.

Edited June 26, 2016 by Heart of Space

[Mal]

@Heart of Space 

It's fine that you think high development is about control when ones values are being disrespected. 

Development is about a widening of perspective.. You don't just get angry for the self, you get angry for all selves.  I've felt sorrow for you, anger, regret. All sorts. 

There's more emotion and values going on here, plus moments of no self, shadow work and coming to terms with disowned parts of myself too. 

There is a lot going on.  And I feel lots of emotions reading people posts. 

I'm not a paper person who sits on emotions. I'm developing myself. I'm sorry if that doesn't fit in with your schema. You might want to re-consider aborting development because you will feel MORE pain and sometimes lose it with all this going on. 

Sorry to disappoint.  The real goodies are I can feel more pain, but also at the same time transcend it.  But I'm no doormat, that's part of the territory of growing up, you don't let teenagers who know nothing of what you're trying to do walk over you.  

Mal

[Mal]

@Heart of Space

Another problem of what you're doing here is in my view you are destroying something.  You could have my help, but nobody who understands themselves will help a person who disrespects them. I still make this mistake today. I did it with Charlie because some of his words created strong reactions in me.  But he also helped me have an awakening a few days ago, I'm so grateful and also regretful. 

He may not help me out, that's a pill I have to swallow.  But on here I post my own experience and use it to journal, so what people are getting from me is genuine things from my moment to moment experience. That's high development and awakening.  Awakening is a process for me, it unfolds in stages.

The more I go over you messages the more I sense your rancour and belittling nature. I'm fine now, I talk from my heart and I'm at peace.  But of you think you can poke then brand on certain reactions then youre pretty clueless.  

Edited June 26, 2016 by Mal

[Heart of Space]

3 minutes ago, Mal said:

The more I go over you messages the more I sense your rancour and belittling nature. I'm fine now, I talk from my heart and I'm at peace.  But of you think you can poke then brand on certain reactions then youre pretty clueless.  

Nah, I'm done doing that.  Your last posts spoke from your heart and I can appreciate the honesty about your experience a lot actually. 

Can we stop being at each other now?  I'd prefer that. 

[key]

Can I just inappropriately tack on here and give you @Heart of Space & @Mal a round of applause *clap* *clap* 

Wonderful exchange of words, It was woefully beautiful, ultimatley meaningless, nevertheless entertaining, much mind goo.

Just again my highly inappropriate butting in, but Mal you're sounding more and more like Charlie lately. Heart, oh dear boy you are very very sneaky. It's wonderful! 

Yes my post is meaningless, no I don't expect a response, but language is such fun!

Regards

Another mind 

[Mal]

@Kenya Go away

[Heart of Space]

29 minutes ago, Kenya said:

Can I just inappropriately tack on here and give you @Heart of Space & @Mal a round of applause *clap* *clap* 

Wonderful exchange of words, It was woefully beautiful, ultimatley meaningless, nevertheless entertaining, much mind goo.

Just again my highly inappropriate butting in, but Mal you're sounding more and more like Charlie lately. Heart, oh dear boy you are very very sneaky. It's wonderful! 

Yes my post is meaningless, no I don't expect a response, but language is such fun!

Regards

Another mind 

I get the eerie feeling that everyone who visits this forum was reading this thread with a full bag of popcorn.  Glad me and Mal could create a little entertainment in your life. <3