Innate value

[Corpus]

On ‎03‎/‎02‎/‎2020 at 4:08 PM, Buba said:

My mind does not understand it. Is not there any practice to reach it? I have seen people who even dont know what is meditation, but feel valuable. They are not compelled to do anything to feel valuable. The value is always there.

When somebody succeeds he feels valuable. But it is temporary, and fades quickly. You should always do something to feel valuable. But some people feel innate value, they dont feel compelled to do something, to succeed to feel worthy. The value is always there.

A thought experiment- how do you know the non-meditator feels valuable? Could you possibly be assigning a notion of self-value to them, on the basis of what you observe?

A narcissist will display value, as will one who makes their value contingent on being successful. The notion that one must always do something to feel valuable is also contingent. Most of these people will strive to display value to cover up a deep sense of inadequacy within.

Awakening reveals that your True Self has no value, not less value, and that is what liberates . Value is something applied and not inherent, and yet until its appreciated as IT is, it will seem something valuable, and worth having. Paradox is your friend.

 

[Buba]

21 hours ago, Leo Gura said:

@Buba Just do the work.

What kind of work?

20 hours ago, WelcometoReality said:

You don't need to awaken to realize this. What you need to do is see that the thoughts of unworthiness are just thoughts. No need give them any attention.

When I stopped giving them attention these thoughts became less and less frequent to then completely stop arising.

I have been meditating for more than 2 years and I am still the same.

11 hours ago, Nahm said:

@Buba When you resume the habitual thinking of old, that is suffering. Read this thread a few times...notice the tendency to go back to that old thought pattern. In becoming conscious of this, you become conscious, of “going unconscious”...and that is the beginning, of the end, of this suffering.

 

I be in the now and ignore thoughts, but at some point I get tired and give up and return to thoughts.

[Buba]

11 hours ago, Corpus said:

A thought experiment- how do you know the non-meditator feels valuable? Could you possibly be assigning a notion of self-value to them, on the basis of what you observe?

A narcissist will display value, as will one who makes their value contingent on being successful. The notion that one must always do something to feel valuable is also contingent. Most of these people will strive to display value to cover up a deep sense of inadequacy within.

Awakening reveals that your True Self has no value, not less value, and that is what liberates . Value is something applied and not inherent, and yet until its appreciated as IT is, it will seem something valuable, and worth having. Paradox is your friend.

 

I ask them and they say they are happy. I have seen people who don't try to be the best or succeed in order to feel valuable.

[WelcometoReality]

30 minutes ago, Buba said:

have been meditating for more than 2 years and I am still the same.

Then maybe meditation is not the answer.

I didn't meditate to stop the thoughts. I broke the habit of listening to these thoughts and instead did something else.

[Nahm]

@Buba Inspect beliefs, and writing about feelings. 

[Buba]

On ‎2‎/‎5‎/‎2020 at 10:08 AM, WelcometoReality said:

Then maybe meditation is not the answer.

I didn't meditate to stop the thoughts. I broke the habit of listening to these thoughts and instead did something else.

After some time I give up and listen to the thoughts ))

21 hours ago, Nahm said:

@Buba Inspect beliefs, and writing about feelings. 

John Bradshaw talks about "False self" which will be destroyed and "True Self" will appear, if repressed emotions are released. And then human does not feel incomplete. The parent inside the mind dies. And human becomes free. What is your opinion about it? Is it nonsense?

[Nahm]

@Buba The ‘false self’ is just ideas & beliefs, not a a self or object which is destroyed, but yes, as falsity is seen through, there are emotional releases which are wonderful. Also, I wouldn’t say ‘true self appears’, it’s always there, the awareness aware of the false ideas & beliefs. 

[Buba]

1 minute ago, Nahm said:

@Buba The ‘false self’ is just ideas & beliefs, not a a self or object which is destroyed, but yes, as falsity is seen through, there are emotional releases which are wonderful. Also, I wouldn’t say ‘true self appears’, it’s always there, the awareness aware of the false ideas & beliefs. 

I think "false self" and "true self" in psychotherapy are different from "false self" and "true self" in spirituality. He claims, once your true self reveals itself, you will feel happy and complete. Similar reports I have seen from people who have released repressed emotions under drugs - feeling fearless, complete, ready to die.

[Nahm]

@Buba You are already the true self. Like I said, do some inspection of any arising thought or belief which feels less that awesome, by writing about it on a pad of paper.   Don’t fall for the pattern of distraction from doing this...such as continuing to talk about doing this. Actually do it. 

[Buba]

15 hours ago, Nahm said:

@Buba You are already the true self. Like I said, do some inspection of any arising thought or belief which feels less that awesome, by writing about it on a pad of paper.   Don’t fall for the pattern of distraction from doing this...such as continuing to talk about doing this. Actually do it. 

Thank you, Nahm. So far my search for happiness fails. This last being gay issue was the hardest one. I don't plan to commit suicide, but all my passion for life disappeared.

[Nahm]

@Buba By inspection work, I didn’t mean a ‘search for happiness’. I meant, inspect these thoughts & beliefs, see what is uncovered in the process.  ♥️ There are thoughts about you at play, which simply are not true. 

[Nahm]

@Buba The feeling, that terrible feeling...is love, telling you that those thoughts about yourself are not true, at all. In continuing to believe the thoughts, you continue to feel terrible. The instant you let the thought which does not feel good to you go, you see what I’m saying. You instantly feel relief. Continue as such, and that relief becomes a release. Cry it out, punch a pillow, pound the clay, whatever, but express it. Continue as such, and you’re on your way to the real, actual discovery, that you are the greatest possible being that could ever be. You can not think about yourself in a way which does not feel good, while being surprised you do not feel good. Wisest words ever uttered...”maybe I’m wrong about this”.

[Derek White]

@Buba This video explains what is value very well. Doesn’t get more explicit than that. Value is an illusion, there’s nothing inherently valuable. You create “value”. Once you realize that then you can consciously live in the relative domain. ?

 

40 minutes ago, Nahm said:

In continuing to believe the thoughts, you continue to feel terrible. The instant you let the thought which does not feel good to you go, you see what I’m saying.

@Nahm Yes, and after you have stopped believing them you can even think the same thoughts again but not feel “bad emotions”. The key is to be conscious of beliefs, assumptions, and labels. You can even “feel bad emotions” but not “feel bad” at a deeper level. Hope I’m not getting too ahead of myself here.

But that would be too advanced, to get started you need to be conscious of beliefs.

Investigate “why you are feeling worthless?” Write down your thoughts to get to those implicit and subconscious beliefs. Observe the thoughts that make you feel worthless, they will lead you to the implicit assumption.

Like, you may have a belief, “money makes people valuable”. Notice that and realize that’s an illusion you made up. So now, you won’t feel “bad” if someone has more money than you.