What has happened to Leo?

[UDT]

21 minutes ago, Salvijus said:

@Rasheed Okey then maybe it's just me then. Good that there are still some people who get uplifted by his work

Point of his work is not being uplifting, but to give the most true Metaphysical and Epistemological Philosophy out there. 
 

[Rasheed]

2 minutes ago, UDT said:

But thats the exact thing!! 
As Leo, you will look back at everything and realize that you have been the only one giving all of this meaning in the first place, so youre gonna be back at Square 1. 
It is like you take a 1600s Church Laymen and Catapult his Ass to Tier 2 Spiral Dynamics. What will happen is that your young fellow layman will sit on the side of the road for a week mumbling while his brain is exploding and integrating everything his new knowledge and perspective is giving him, but it doesnt change him sitting on the side of the road in the dirt. 

 

My post was not about Leo giving meanings, it was about seeing how inspiring is it to see person grow...

[Rasheed]

7 minutes ago, UDT said:

Point of his work is not being uplifting, but to give the most true Metaphysical and Epistemological Philosophy out there. 
 

Yes. That is the one point, but also point of his work is to inspire others. And by uplifting me, he inspires me. Point accomplished. Tadaaaa.

 

[Forestluv]

@Moreira The ego wants to protect it’s own survival and will resist ego transcendence. Ime, there are many ways for the ego to resist. One way is to set up unpleasant consequences. For example, the mind may think “Wait a minute. . . If I’m not around to control things, I may end up unhappy like this guy on YouTube who is awakened. That’s not good”. . . My mind set up scenarios in which I would go mentally insane or that I would harm others if ego transcendence occurred. Yet with transcendence there is awareness of these stories as stories. A new freedom emerges. Yet it can be a bumpy ride at times. 

[Rebecca Kalamata]

I have noticed many of your points and had similar thoughts. I was happy to see his blogs, the videos must take hours upon hours to organize the lectures. and to film. Leo often says that he will address something further in a future video. I know that he keeps lists and lists so I am confident that he has material.

But hey dudes! It's the holidays! Anybody go skiing?  Anybody fly someplace? Anybody take a break from their work or school? 

Thanks everybody for considering your beingness. May this year prove to be not only enlightening but prosperous as well. God is great. God is huge. God is all. God is me. I am in God. God is in me. May the force be with you!

 

[4201]

3 hours ago, Serotoninluv said:

@Moreira The ego wants to protect it’s own survival and will resist ego transcendence. Ime, there are many ways for the ego to resist. One way is to set up unpleasant consequences. For example, the mind may think “Wait a minute. . . If I’m not around to control things, I may end up unhappy like this guy on YouTube who is awakened. That’s not good”. . . My mind set up scenarios in which I would go mentally insane or that I would harm others if ego transcendence occurred. Yet with transcendence there is awareness of these stories as stories. A new freedom emerges. Yet it can be a bumpy ride at times. 

Yes, there's an ego which wants to get better and is worried when their teacher, which has helped it a lot in the past years, starts showing obvious signs of unawareness and unhappiness.

But should we just use the awareness of that story to stay blind to the content of this post? There's definitely a problem. Without doubt, complaining about it here is probably a worse solution that distancing ourselves from the teacher and finding more sources of information, new teachers and practicing ourselves. Yet it is painful to think of Leo in his current state, especially when it's Leo who taught me to avoid the traps he seems, from my limited judgemental point of view, to be falling into.

Edited January 6, 2020 by 4201

[Moreira]

12 minutes ago, 4201 said:

Yes, there's an ego which wants to get better and is worried when their teacher, which has helped it a lot in the past years, starts showing obvious signs of unawareness and unhappiness.

But should we just use the awareness of that story to stay blind to the content of this post? There's definitely a problem. Without doubt, complaining about it here is probably a worse solution that distancing ourselves from the teacher and finding more sources of information, new teachers and practicing ourselves. Yet it is painful to think of Leo in his current state, especially when it's Leo who taught me to avoid the traps he seems, from my limited judgemental point of view, to be falling into.

I would like to deal with this easily like you describe. We all have our referents or gurus we admire and build our lives and belief system aroun their teachings. I used to like a lot the old version of Elliot hulse, before being obsessed with his strenght camp, he treated lots of fascinating topics like bioenergetics which he learned from Paul chek and shamanic knowledge. It helped me a lot!

Today Elliot version is packed with toxic masculinity and red stage stuff which in my opinion is downwards.

Maybe I'm a nostalgic, but I feel sad when my idols or masters in life change, not always for the better.

[Forestluv]

1 hour ago, 4201 said:

Yes, there's an ego which wants to get better and is worried when their teacher, which has helped it a lot in the past years, starts showing obvious signs of unawareness and unhappiness.

But should we just use the awareness of that story to stay blind to the content of this post? There's definitely a problem. Without doubt, complaining about it here is probably a worse solution that distancing ourselves from the teacher and finding more sources of information, new teachers and practicing ourselves. Yet it is painful to think of Leo in his current state, especially when it's Leo who taught me to avoid the traps he seems, from my limited judgemental point of view, to be falling into.

This is still immersed in self content. I am pointing to the transcendence of this.

The creation of a teacher called “Leo” and the creation of “problems” this “Leo” teacher has are imaginations appearing in the mind. Another mind could create imaginations of a “Leo” teacher that has expanded/deepened his consciousness and is now radiating profound Wisdom. If one can let go of their attachment/identification to these imaginations, there can be awareness of structural mental  mechanism. There can be awareness of the underlying conditioning and karma related to these imaginations that are appearing in the mind. 

It seems like your mind is immersed in the content of the thought story it is creating. The mind can create imaginations so compelling that the mind no longer is aware of what it is doing. It is like you have created a movie so convincing that you had forgotten it’s a movie that you are creating. There is transcendence of this, yet the ego will resist because it means “game over” for the movie character. The self wants to continue as the self, so it does things like create characters and problems to engage in. Notice how your mind thought “There is *definitely*” a problem” and “Without doubt. . .”.  This is reflective of a mind that wants to regain control of the internal narrative. A self that feels a little light coming it’s way and doesn’t want to be discovered, so it ties to double down on the story such that it is “definitive” and “without doubt”. . . . The self is sooo sneaky. You just aren’t conscious enough to observe self-maintenance dynamics happening in the mind.

 

[4201]

26 minutes ago, Serotoninluv said:

This is still immersed in self content. I am pointing to the transcendence of this.

The creation of a teacher called “Leo” and the creation of “problems” this “Leo” teacher has are imaginations appearing in the mind. The mind could just as easily create imaginations of a “Leo” teacher that is now radiating Love and Wisdom that is a gift to us all. If one can let go of their attachment/identification to these imaginations, there can be awareness of the structural mechanism. Awareness of the underlying conditioning and karma related to these imaginations.

It seems like your mind is immersed in the content of the thought story you are creating. The mind can create imaginations so compelling that the mind no longer is aware of what it is doing. It is like you have created a movie so convincing that you had forgotten it’s a movie you are creating. There is transcendence of this, yet the ego will resist because it means “game over” for the movie character. The self wants to continue as the self, so it does things like create characters and problems to engage in. You just aren’t conscious enough to observe this happening in the mind.

I know exactly what you are pointing too, yet I don't want us to be using this as a distraction mechanism from a specific topic. Can this well-crafted explanation be used anytime a problem is seen? "My room is not dirty, that's just my imagination!" I know the value of letting go of such imaginations and I practice my attempts at letting go of that everyday when meditating. Being aware of the movie doesn't mean stopping the movie. It's not a proper justification to not talk about a topic.

Now wether I am totally delusional when I say Leo is unwell is probably the real question there. If instead we were discussing something more objective, let's say science, you would have no problem at all talking about the effects of psychedelics on the brain, neuro plasticity and all that (as we did before). Although these explanations and facts are indeed imagination, this statement is irrelevant to the discussion of psychedelics. The difference between the 2 discussions, imo, is your willingness to enter it.

The mind really sees what it want to see. We all have blind spots and we keep looking at the blind spots of others to distract ourselves from our own blind spots. Your mind see my mind not being willing to see the story is it creating. My mind sees your mind voluntarily distracting itself from a topic by looking at the blind spots of my mind. My point is that this is a discussion board, and we are here talking about something. Using Truth as an argument for everything doesn't help creating a story where Truth can be achieved. 

Sure, all I did is give my own subjective opinion. Should we reject everything that is not totally objective? Up to you.

Yes this entire post is a whole "Do you notice it too" poll, where we try to see if we are noticing the same thing from Leo's energy. Yes this is a total distraction from looking at ourselves. Yet it is more significative, to me at least, to notice such a thing in the person teaching me that for anyone else.

Edited January 6, 2020 by 4201

[Nivsch]

Personally I feel very high resonance with the content Leo share, and some of it I experienced and tought for my experience even before I heard from it in any source (for example the system fights back after you start do behavioural therapy agaisnt anxiety). Still many things Leo give are new for me and enrichs me a lot!

Last couple of videos are less resonate with me. Maybe its just because of the content.

Only Leo knows what he really feels and I think as long as he takes into account many resources, not falling into the "feeling above" trap, and into the "pursuit more enlightenment" trap which transmits the subconscious mind that you are not good enough now - he will be Ok. Thats my opinion.

More traps in my opinion are:

Solipsism.

Isolation psychologically and physically from other human beings.

I dont know if Leo fell into it I just mention whats most potentially problematic from my point of view.

Edited January 6, 2020 by Nivsch

[Forestluv]

@4201 Very nice observations.

The evolution of consciousness involves self dissolution/ transcendence. This evolution involves resistance from the self. That dynamic commonly plays out in the forum. The self will resist the transcendence of itself. It is important to work through this dynamic. 

Notice the shift in narrative. . . . 

There has been a frame shift from “there is *definitely* a problem. Without doubt”. . .  to. . . “sure, all I did is give my own subjective opinion”. That is a major jump in consciousness, yet there is more. There is still attachment and identification. Consider the statements:

“Can this well-crafted explanation be used anytime a problem is seen?"

and

”I know exactly what you are pointing to”

There are assumptions here that serve as blocks to something deeper. There are multiple levels of a mind trying to control an internal narrative. 

You have essentially said that you are aware of the movie, know the structure of the movie and want to engage in the content of this movie without being distracted from the movie.

You are not aware of “exactly” what I am pointing to. “Definitely”, “Without doubt” and “I know exactly” are expressions of maintenance of an internal status quo. . . You have partial awareness of what I’m pointing to. Your strong adverse reaction is subconsciously telling me to “back off”, which I respect. . . .

You mentioned that you have been practicing spirituality in this area. I can tell you that there is a door in this area allowing further exploration and realization. You currently have an aversion to this, yet knowing it is nearby can be helpful. It can allow aversion to transform into curiosity. 

[4201]

1 hour ago, Serotoninluv said:

@4201 Very nice observations.

The evolution of consciousness involves self dissolution/ transcendence. This evolution involves resistance from the self. That dynamic commonly plays out in the forum. The self will resist the transcendence of itself. It is important to work through this dynamic. 

Notice the shift in narrative. . . . 

There has been a frame shift from “there is *definitely* a problem. Without doubt”. . .  to. . . “sure, all I did is give my own subjective opinion”. That is a major jump in consciousness, yet there is more. There is still attachment and identification. Consider the statements:

“Can this well-crafted explanation be used anytime a problem is seen?"

and

”I know exactly what you are pointing to”

There are assumptions here that serve as blocks to something deeper. There are multiple levels of a mind trying to control an internal narrative. 

You have essentially said that you are aware of the movie, know the structure of the movie and want to engage in the content of this movie without being distracted from the movie.

You are not aware of “exactly” what I am pointing to. “Definitely”, “Without doubt” and “I know exactly” are expressions of maintenance of an internal status quo. . . You have partial awareness of what I’m pointing to. Your strong adverse reaction is subconsciously telling me to “back off”, which I respect. . . .

You mentioned that you have been practicing spirituality in this area. I can tell you that there is a door in this area allowing further exploration and realization. You currently have an aversion to this, yet knowing it is nearby can be helpful. It can allow aversion to transform into curiosity. 

Thank you for all these insights and thank you for focusing on my case so much. Thanks for pointing out the unconscious, hidden meaning of the idioms I use. While the content of your explanation (or movie) is great, I can't stress enough that the reason you are engaging into your movie (of focusing on my movie) is to distract yourself from something. Each of these threads are movies, and we are all engaging in them, yet I don't see you try to dispel all those conversations by pointing at fact they are playing a movie. Did you engage in this one purely to ask people to disengage in it?

 

[lmfao]

@Moreira When one looks at his entire career on YouTube, I'd say he changed slowly over the years. But in addition to that, there was his first 30 day retreat he did which he technically failed but changed a lot after. And then he changed a lot as well after his successful 30 day retreat, where he had "13 insights".Not to mention the multitude of blog posts he's made which I found interesting in observing him more closely. 

To be honest, I have no idea if he's deluded or not. My view has always been that he makes claims and beliefs about things he can't possibly have knowledge of, but I stay reserved/open. Not about this love or god stuff (since I have had some taste of them), but just this very notion that one can get conceptual knowledge/insight. 

Like Leo has himself said, he's not achieved emotional mastery and embodiment, but has had high peak states. I reckon he's digging deep into deconstructing his ego, hence it's a form of dark knight that you're seeing from him. Perhaps the psychedelics and their interactions with him have scattered his energies into chaos and they haven't settled yet. 

https://www.actualized.org/insights/nothing-i-say-can-be-trusted

 

[Forestluv]

@4201  You initiated contact with me in this thread and asked me a question. My answer and observations to you seem to be unsatisfying and unhelpful to you. As I said, my impression is that you have personally communicated to me to back off with the dynamics I am observing. I respect that and will not continue offering observations to you that you are personally adverse to. 

I gave you my observations as honestly as I could. You are free to do as you wish with them. Throw them in the trash if you want. 

[SgtPepper]

I don't know guys. We do not know Leo the way we know ourselves.

We watch his videos and yeah his personality leaks, but Leo has a private life and could greatly be grateful for it. 

And I have to agree with his core message of getting us to experience spirituality directly. 

[Byun Sean]

i dont know what your talking about he seems more joyful than ever

[Dryas]

@Salvijus

Whatever "Light" is, is completely subjective.

I really don't see the Light in any teacher. I only look at the quality of the teaching (I guess that's how I'm defining light for myself).

Honestly, Leo is like the only teacher out there that I can listen to for hours. Someone like Eckhart Tolle would bore the shit out of me 

 

[bejapuskas]

14 minutes ago, Dryas said:

Honestly, Leo is like the only teacher out there that I can listen to for hours. Someone like Eckhart Tolle would bore the shit out of me 

Maybe you cannot stand his calmness  

[tsuki]

Stock response #237: Stop worrying about Leo and start doing the practices. ?

[Derek White]

No one can possibly look into anyone’s head and know what they feel. A lot of you might be judging his calmness for sadness, and may use vague terms to hide that you don’t like his personality.

It’s like when people say at an interview “You’re just not the right fit”, when what they really mean is “we’re not hiring you because of your race, sex , etc.” Or when people don’t like someone because they have tattoos but come up with some other story to hate them. Obviously many egos will not admit this. We must not make assumptions in this work, if Leo helps you see clearly then it’s all good. Be conscious of your assumptions.