What is sleep

[Inliytened1]

The concept of sleep, just like death, is itself imaginary.   Let me try to explain further.  

Consciousness is ever present.  In fact there is just Consciousness.   Zoom out for a second from your finite self.

Now the key is to realize it is both in a particular finite form (small self for example)  and pure infinite formlessless the "I AM" simultaneously.   The "I Am" is nothing and everything - in its purest form which as you said is pure void.  But don't mistake that for an idea of nothing or non-existence.   

So the key is realizing (through an enlightenment exp for example) that you are not only this particular finite consciousness but that simultaneously you are infinite Consciousness, which is then imagining it is a finite being that in turn imagines it goes to "sleep" or that it can "die"  or that it "has" consciousness that it can lose.  Not the case.

So there is no on and off switch for Consciousness.  In fact an on/off switch would only be something it imagines!   It just IS.  It can shapeshift into different finite forms and then imagine it is that form.  When the idea of that form ceases it collapses back into its formless nature - but note that even in form it is still formless. (And it is still imagining it is that form)

So nothing really happened or changed -  Its always present. 

 

 

 

[LfcCharlie4]

@Inliytened1 well said.

Consciousness is ever present, no matter what state you are in. 
 

Therefore, from a relative perspective you could say the body is sleeping/ resting, yet Consciousness is ever present during this experience, I think it was Leo who said notice when you’re dreaming and you die there is still an experience of Nothingness, key is there is still an experience. 
 

Without Consciousness, no experience would ever be possible. This experience is simply All consciousness through the many forms of finite life. 
 

[Bennn]

9 hours ago, LfcCharlie4 said:

@Inliytened1 well said.

Consciousness is ever present, no matter what state you are in. 
 

Therefore, from a relative perspective you could say the body is sleeping/ resting, yet Consciousness is ever present during this experience, I think it was Leo who said notice when you’re dreaming and you die there is still an experience of Nothingness, key is there is still an experience. 
 

Without Consciousness, no experience would ever be possible. This experience is simply All consciousness through the many forms of finite life. 
 

No - I'm saying that sleep is the absence of experience. I only know of this experience in consciousness. 

[Inliytened1]

@Bennn i know what you are saying but all there is is experience.  The absence of experience is a concept or an idea within experience.  Thats what we are saying.  It sure seems like there is though..its very tricky.  I'm not talking about dreaming i mean when you said you were out like a brick or unconscious.  

 

 

 

[LfcCharlie4]

@Bennn absence of experience is impossible, without experience NOTHING would ever exist, and by that I mean there would literally be no existence possible, all there is is experience. Just like all there is is consciousness. 
 

 

[Shin]

11 hours ago, Bennn said:

No - I'm saying that sleep is the absence of experience. I only know of this experience in consciousness. 

Why do you think that ?

In my experience, I am either Shin, or dreaming.

What you call deep sleep or no experience doesn't happen, it's instantaneous between the two.

You only think there is nothing because here you experience time, and in your dreams you don't really, so it seems quick compared to the hours you sleep, so your mind fill the blank that it imagine by believing there is such a thing as non experience.

 

Edited January 8, 2020 by Shin

[Inliytened1]

7 minutes ago, Shin said:

 

What you call deep sleep or no experience doesn't happen, it's instantaneous between the two.

 

Bingo...

[InfinitePotential]

Sleep exists because it’s so exhausting to contract into a separate self that every life form needs to let go of being an ego for a while 

[Bennn]

On 1/7/2020 at 10:14 AM, Inliytened1 said:

The concept of sleep, just like death, is itself imaginary.   Let me try to explain further.  

Consciousness is ever present.  In fact there is just Consciousness.   Zoom out for a second from your finite self.

Now the key is to realize it is both in a particular finite form (small self for example)  and pure infinite formlessless the "I AM" simultaneously.   The "I Am" is nothing and everything - in its purest form which as you said is pure void.  But don't mistake that for an idea of nothing or non-existence.   

So the key is realizing (through an enlightenment exp for example) that you are not only this particular finite consciousness but that simultaneously you are infinite Consciousness, which is then imagining it is a finite being that in turn imagines it goes to "sleep" or that it can "die"  or that it "has" consciousness that it can lose.  Not the case.

So there is no on and off switch for Consciousness.  In fact an on/off switch would only be something it imagines!   It just IS.  It can shapeshift into different finite forms and then imagine it is that form.  When the idea of that form ceases it collapses back into its formless nature - but note that even in form it is still formless. (And it is still imagining it is that form)

So nothing really happened or changed -  Its always present. 

 

 

 

How is consciousness ever-present if I can cite moments where I am unconscious (Sleep)?

 

If the "I AM's" purest form is void than is their an experience or an observer in that void?

 

How is there no "on/off" switch for consciousness. When I go to sleep "I AM" is no longer there - only complete nothingness. The only reason that I can describe the experience is because I come back to consciousness.

 

 

Thanks - appreciate your answers - this has been eating my brain :-)

[Inliytened1]

 

Quote

How is there no "on/off" switch for consciousness. When I go to sleep "I AM" is no longer there - only complete nothingness. The only reason that I can describe the experience is because I come back to consciousness.

 

Whats this complete nothingness that you describe? That's something you can only imagine right?  And maybe its not because you are coming back to consciousness - maybe its because consciousness never left.  Where would it go when its already everywhere and nowhere?  To imply that it came back would mean there was somewhere it wasn't.   But consider it is infinite. 

Don't take any of our words for it though it is something You have to discover.  (You capitalized)  and to discover is the collapse of knowing into Being.  The collapse of the relative into the Absolute.  The finite into the Infinite.

[Bennn]

The "nothingness" is without description. It is the absence of me as the observer. Consciousness (from the "I AM" that is with me now) leaves. The only reason that point to it is because of the gap that I notice in time when consciousness returns to me.

 

I think there are two ways of thinking about this. "Consciousness" either exists inside "Nothingness" or "Nothingness" exists inside "Consciousness."

[Inliytened1]

27 minutes ago, Bennn said:

The "nothingness" is without description. It is the absence of me as the observer. Consciousness (from the "I AM" that is with me now) leaves. The only reason that point to it is because of the gap that I notice in time when consciousness returns to me.

 

I think there are two ways of thinking about this. "Consciousness" either exists inside "Nothingness" or "Nothingness" exists inside "Consciousness."

Or consider that when we say Consciousness we are also saying Infinity. And Infinity is nothing.  So Consciousness is nothing.   It is nothing because it is everything.   Everything must include nothing.  Then consider that perhaps your true nature is not a human but it is Consciousness.   So that would make your whole life and all of reality imaginary, including the gap in time.  Time itself is imaginary.  But you can't grasp this from the human perspective it has to be as the Absolute.

[Bennn]

I can see that everything includes nothing - that makes sense to me. I can't see how nothing includes everything - that does not make sense to me (yet). If you have any other insights I'll listen - otherwise I'll meditate on it.

[Shin]

3 minutes ago, Bennn said:

I can see that everything includes nothing - that makes sense to me. I can't see how nothing includes everything - that does not make sense to me (yet). If you have any other insights I'll listen - otherwise I'll meditate on it.

If you are everything, then what are you ?

Not a thing.

No thing.

Nothing.

Edited January 10, 2020 by Shin

[Inliytened1]

 

1 hour ago, Bennn said:

The "nothingness" is without description. It is the absence of me as the observer. Consciousness (from the "I AM" that is with me now) leaves. The only reason that i point to it

 

 

cool - i was just going to add that yeah - i get what you mean about the "nothingness" is without description, because what you are pointing to is Absolute Infinity - and anything that you imagine it to be isn't it.   It would just be another finite thing or an idea.  It wouldn't be actually IT.    So yeah Being or Infinity or Isness is prior to knowing, but the amazing thing is that You are Being/Issing right now, and it never goes anywhere because it has nowhere to go.

[Inliytened1]

4 hours ago, Bennn said:

I can see that everything includes nothing - that makes sense to me. I can't see how nothing includes everything - 

Infinity is a loop.  Because its One singularity.

 

[Bennn]

Still struggling. What's to say that what occurs after death isn't similar to that sleep state (where there is a total "nothingess" and lack of "I AMNESS"

 

[Shin]

22 minutes ago, Bennn said:

Still struggling. What's to say that what occurs after death isn't similar to that sleep state (where there is a total "nothingess" and lack of "I AMNESS"

 

Even if it's the case, what's the problem ?

You wouldn't be here to experience anything, there wouldn't be an ego to have a problem with it.

Edited January 12, 2020 by Shin

[Bennn]

The only "problem" would be the one that I make for myself now under that belief. So there really wouldn't be one.

 

Not saying that there is one. Just a question.

[Bennn]

Slowly lifting a veil. There is nothing outside of everything. "Nothing" exists - but "I" can only point to it in the moment that I come back to "something."

 

Outside of that there is no "I" to point to or "experience" "nothing." Ultimately the world can be divided onto "nothing" and "something." I'm not sure how to decipher what happens after death - but it is very interesting that sleep gives "me" a window into "nothing."