Stoicism & Positive Psychology Vs Enlightenment

[ChimpBrain]

Coming at the whole self improvement project from an orange/green level of development, I've squeezed a lot of juice from both stoicism and positive psychology by reading the books relating to each from Leo's book list. I've gained not much more than confusion from my foray into enlightenment research. I guess it's made me more open minded which is an obvious positive for moving up the ladder to the next stage. Am I the only one who thinks people considering themselves to be green or below could get a lot more from 100 hours of effort focused on creating their own happiness than chasing enlightenment? Frankly, to me, full blown permanent enlightenment seems like a complete pipe dream for the vast majority of us living in the 21st century West. Look at Leo, if he can spend years chasing it and not achieve it with his intellect, resources and level of open mindedness what chance do I stand? Enlightenment is a very sexy idea that people love to research, speculate on and imagine, but that is unattainable for most of us, but any average Joe can improve their life greatly by implementing principles of stoicism and positive psychology. 

 

With all that said obviously this is just my opinion and I fully realize I'm far below a lot (maybe most) of the posters here in regards to my level of development. If you've already mastered your emotions, psychology, relationships, discipline, income, etc, etc then of course moving to the next step makes sense, but it seems like a lot of people are putting the cart before the horse because of the allure of enlightenment.

 

Please tell me what I'm overlooking here  

[charlie2dogs]

59 minutes ago, ChimpBrain said:

Coming at the whole self improvement project from an orange/green level of development, I've squeezed a lot of juice from both stoicism and positive psychology by reading the books relating to each from Leo's book list. I've gained not much more than confusion from my foray into enlightenment research. I guess it's made me more open minded which is an obvious positive for moving up the ladder to the next stage. Am I the only one who thinks people considering themselves to be green or below could get a lot more from 100 hours of effort focused on creating their own happiness than chasing enlightenment? Frankly, to me, full blown permanent enlightenment seems like a complete pipe dream for the vast majority of us living in the 21st century West. Look at Leo, if he can spend years chasing it and not achieve it with his intellect, resources and level of open mindedness what chance do I stand? Enlightenment is a very sexy idea that people love to research, speculate on and imagine, but that is unattainable for most of us, but any average Joe can improve their life greatly by implementing principles of stoicism and positive psychology. 

 

With all that said obviously this is just my opinion and I fully realize I'm far below a lot (maybe most) of the posters here in regards to my level of development. If you've already mastered your emotions, psychology, relationships, discipline, income, etc, etc then of course moving to the next step makes sense, but it seems like a lot of people are putting the cart before the horse because of the allure of enlightenment.

 

Please tell me what I'm overlooking here  

you are missing the experience of your core being. when you experience that you will be self realized, the study of many books is a weariness of the mind, and a huge distraction.  up until now you have been working at personal growth like most others, personal growth has many meanings and i suspect  that by working on personal growth as a means to enlightenment will fail most.  Most have no idea what enlightenment is or how it functions.  everything you belief about it came from someone else.

its a pipe dream cause you are following someone else's pipe dream, books, videos, teachings of any kind, religions, philosophies wont make you enlightened.

now some questions why are you seeking this enlightenment?

what does enlightenment look like to you at this point,?

what do you think one does who is enlightened?

How are they different from you?

what do you think you will be like if you become enlightened?

[ChimpBrain]

I am not seeking enlightenment. Only trying to learn about it because Leo seems sold on it and I trust his judgment. And since it's been the primary goal of buddhism and Hinduism (to the best of my knowledge) for thousands of years I have to believe there is immense benefits to it if you can actually achieve it. 

 

What does enlightenment look like to me? I've never met an enlightened person so my idea is just a caricature. I just envision someone who's truly happy and fulfilled, who truly loves his fellow man, and sees reality as it really is. Whatever that means. How are they different from me? I'm none of the things described above. 

What would I be like if I became enlightened? Not a clue, but I'm sure it would require renouncing my current life altogether. I think I'd be compelled to move to a cabin in a remote wilderness, or possibly to a developing nation. I can't imagine becoming enlightened and continuing to work 60hr weeks behind a computer at a job I don't like surrounded by people and culture I don't like. 

[abrakamowse]

35 minutes ago, ChimpBrain said:

What would I be like if I became enlightened? Not a clue, but I'm sure it would require renouncing my current life altogether. I think I'd be compelled to move to a cabin in a remote wilderness, or possibly to a developing nation. I can't imagine becoming enlightened and continuing to work 60hr weeks behind a computer at a job I don't like surrounded by people and culture I don't like. 

You can do that. I am not enlightened, but I realized that those are fears from the idea of "me" that doesn't want to "die or disappear" so the ego come up with all those fears and questions about being enlightened and I am almost sure they are not at all true.

As the old saying goes:

Before Enlightenment
chop wood carry water,
after Enlightenment,
chop wood carry water.

 

Edited June 9, 2016 by abrakamowse

[ChimpBrain]

12 hours ago, abrakamowse said:

You can do that. I am not enlightened, but I realized that those are fears from the idea of "me" that doesn't want to "die or disappear" so the ego come up with all those fears and questions about being enlightened and I am almost sure they are not at all true.

 

Those aren't fears for me. Moving to a cabin in a remote wilderness sounds like a dream come true TBH, although I'm not sure my wife and daughter would come along which creates a problem or "resistance" for my ego I guess.

[abrakamowse]

@ChimpBrain Fear can take a lot of forms, maybe is not fear to the remote wilderness but fear of the reactions from your family.

Anyway it is not about going to a remote place. You can do it here if you want. I will advice you to check your inner voice, try to connect with it. That's what will guide you. You won't find guidance on other peoples opinions, they are pointers for you. You have to listen to everything and check what your inner voice says, the one that speaks very low and smoothly, and most of the time, doesn't talk to us with words. You know what I am talking about because I am sure you listen to it. This video can be helpful, I hope it helps.

 

 

Edited June 9, 2016 by abrakamowse

[vizual]

You can never know what will become of you when you become enlightened, just like a fallen leaf can't know which way the wind will blow him. But it also doesn't matter any more, because whatever you currently regard as 'your life' is really just a fantasy. Sure, there are events happening that are being interpreted as some person's life, but the narrative that is being attached to those events are just a story. It's not up to ego's how all the events play out, they just do.

 

[Raquel]

Defining enlightenment as a point of achievement is a linear construct of the mind, because what you percive as enlightenment is just another concept of the mind associeted with emotions..which makes it therefore unobtainable.

it is not "achieved" by thinking your way there but being your way there.