Suffocating Girl WIth Text Messages

[peqkno]

So I'm 20 and had my first sexual experiences (though not sex) with a girl from my class some months ago.
She had a boyfriend and I knew it. We still did come closer and I invited her on a date and took her home, she was very attracted.

Long story short, before that I had been involved in PUA/RedPill Ideology (out of insecurities and lack of experience) but through posts on this forum (from female members like @Emerald, ...) , Leo's videos and those of other YouTubers (and a few female friends) I came to more awareness to what dynamics those ideologies use and what the people in there feel. So *thank you*.

She's like the epitome of green in some regards (hehe, sexy witch even) and I was brutally honest about things (probably more like "some") from the beginning, even things that made me uncomfortable. Even going so far as to telling her about the RedPill/PUA(/Incel) things and depression (which we had in common at some point in time).

Shared some nice experiences, though some things were off, at least emotionally she wasn't invested that much. I was feeling dull after first encounters as well and I told her. Due to brutal honesty I even texted her at some point that I might be only in it for sex. She said she had her reasons for not going further. I respect her a lot for not having gone further.
I had a lot to learn and reflect on (sex won't make you happy, externals won't do, ...).

Well because of increasing distance lately and though I see her most days, a lot of emotions come up. Jealousy, thoughts that villify her, hurt.
I maintain awareness over them and feel the feelings (and let go of the thoughts, which works, they don't seem really true). So I work through those to a degree.

I got too attached... needy (watched the first of Leo's videos on depression where he points to not being fulfilled by oneself as the cause of neediness and failed relationships).

 

tl;dr

Anyways, I sent her this video I knew for some time. I noticed me falling into the patterns of "The Suffocator", Type No. 1 in the following video.
(She replied: "Then you know ? ?‍♀️)

Can you please share some perspective on that kind of behaviour. What it feels from the woman's pov, the dynamics.
I'd like to break this pattern... the current awareness I have over it doesn't seem to do the trick.

 

I asked her to block me, she said she'll do for some while.

Anyways, this post has a lot of tangents we could go on, but I'd like to focus on the texting part for now.

Thank you a lot for reading. 

[tenta]

Are you sending tons of messages, or are you sending regular messages but she's not replying much at all?

You are likely just the guy who isn't physically attractive enough to have sex with her so she isn't replying much or paying that much attention to you, women don't avoid dating men with bad personalities, but they do if they're genetically unattractive

You also do need to avoid looking needy so try only texting her as much as she texts you or a bit more.

Edited December 19, 2019 by tenta

[Chew211]

I would just reccomend you try talking to more girls, having more sexual experiences and relationships (not necessarily committed relationships). Don't get too focused on one chick, especially one you haven't had sex with. 

[Spiral]

Don't text aimlessly. You also don't need to reply if you don't have a good response, however, start a new thread one/a few days later if you do this. 

[peqkno]

7 hours ago, tenta said:

You also do need to avoid looking needy

I'd like to focus on actually being less needy.

7 hours ago, tenta said:

just the guy who isn't physically attractive enough to have sex with her so she isn't replying much or paying that much attention to you

Nah, that's not the case... and she's also very Green, so that's not the dynamic. She first "sensed a connection" and wanted to be close deep friends and then became sexually attracted.

8 hours ago, tenta said:

women don't avoid dating men with bad personalities, but they do if they're genetically unattractive

That really depends.

What I hear you say sounds like most RedPill/PUA ideas I got thus far (and that were many imo). I really don't want to think again in those terms, as I think it's really black-and-white and I'd feel repulsed if a woman were to think or behave that way because ... simply put it couldn't meet my need to be appreciated for more than just looks. Also it's playing into some behaviour I don't want to exhibit.

To me it sounds more like something many men in the RedPill/PUA realm would do...

 

5 hours ago, Chew211 said:

I would just reccomend you try talking to more girls, having more sexual experiences and relationships (not necessarily committed relationships). Don't get too focused on one chick, especially one you haven't had sex with. 

Yes. Sounds like something I could do.
The thing is that I went quite deep with her, I don't think she would reject me as a friend. She just didn't meet my intensity. And that's what I want to work on, being less needy.

 

1 hour ago, Spiral said:

Don't text aimlessly.

I agree.
I my eyes it wasn't aimlessly, at that time. There were some insecurities and emotions involved that led to the writing.

And I can't contact her, as she blocked me on IM (as I also told her to work on the attachment.)

 

Thank you for your replies!

 

What @Chew211 said is a step I want to take.

Are there other ways to adress the emotional neediness in a more focused manner?

(And I don't just mean trying to appear less needy over text. I think girls will smell that. And that doesn't feel like the relationship dynamic I'd like to have. It would mean lots of jealousy, insecurity, ... for me and I'd notice the rejection in her. <- So also care less what she thinks, right?)

Oh, and I probably sent her some texts in the manner of like this post.

[TrynaBeTurquoise]

Why are you texting her videos about "types of guys to avoid" and identifying yourself as one of them? Thats doing no good for you whatsoever. And asking her to block you? I'm baffled as fuck. 

[Lynnel]

13 hours ago, peqkno said:

So I'm 20 and had my first sexual experiences (though not sex) with a girl from my class some months ago.
She had a boyfriend and I knew it. We still did come closer and I invited her on a date and took her home, she was very attracted.

Long story short, before that I had been involved in PUA/RedPill Ideology (out of insecurities and lack of experience) but through posts on this forum (from female members like @Emerald, ...) , Leo's videos and those of other YouTubers (and a few female friends) I came to more awareness to what dynamics those ideologies use and what the people in there feel. So *thank you*.

She's like the epitome of green in some regards (hehe, sexy witch even) and I was brutally honest about things (probably more like "some") from the beginning, even things that made me uncomfortable. Even going so far as to telling her about the RedPill/PUA(/Incel) things and depression (which we had in common at some point in time).

Shared some nice experiences, though some things were off, at least emotionally she wasn't invested that much. I was feeling dull after first encounters as well and I told her. Due to brutal honesty I even texted her at some point that I might be only in it for sex.

Okay it's way more complex.

You need to understand that orange dating is better than blue dating on an individual level. It's obviously not perfect and obviously you should aim with experience to get to green.

For some context, arranged marriage, social hierarchy about who is marrying whom, no sex before marriage, the king/lord of the country being able to sexually exploit lower subjects is something orange does away with. Also the dumb myth of the prince getting the princess.

Basically until you have your fair share of experiences with dating at stage orange you will not be able to evolve to green.

You need rules for things that would be (I hope) automatic at stage green such as for instance not telling a girl you only want her for sex not because it's false but because that would make her uncomfortable. You also need to get a grasp of the more "markety"/survival aspects of dating at stage orange which can feel like a free market when before it was more of a diplomatic arrangement kind of stuff.

There is a tremendous danger in thinking that you're above pick up and criticising the whole mouvement is that you're never gonna do the work. if you're gonna be a good boy and stay where you're at waiting for your princess you're just gonna stay miserable. Obviously don't fall into the whole extreme ideology thing.

In short : get way more experience. You can't fix your neediness by thinking. Get way way way more experience. Get so much experience it becomes completely automatic and natural.

 

[assx95]

@peqkno Lol. This reminds me of some of my own neurotic behavior. 

You're manipulating her. Notice how being honest about your toxicity is a strategy for you to attract her. And you're not actually being honest. 

I'll break it down for you- 

You text her a message along the lines - "I am one of the guys you should avoid and block", and yet you would demonize her as a bitch, if she actually blocks you. It would hurt you emotionally. For, you didn't want to be blocked. There is an incongruency here about what you are saying and what you really feel. So, even you tricked yourself into thinking that it's honest, when it's not. 

Now, notice how it puts a social pressure on her to be nice to you, of how she is supposed to treat you with empathy and care now, for you are at an emotional low and in self-victimization. And then while she heals you, you would pounce on the opportunity to flirt with her, and then she'd be attracted to you. It's a strategy cause if you were honest that you are one of the guys she should avoid, then you would remove yourself from her life, and you don't want to. See? 

Also, when a girl pulls away ( withdraws her attention from you), then don't rush in to fill that vacuum, this will only push her away, for she will sense you need something her, you needing something from her does not put her at ease, but at a pressure to provide - be it care, love, or whatever. 
She has to be free in loving you, if she does. You look like the classic devil disguised as a nice guy who is honest. 

You have to be willing to lose her ( this is in regards to jealousy) for, she is the one who chooses who she wants to be with. It is hard to accept that she didn't choose you (if she ends up not choosing you), but then you would do the same with other girls if you had like 10 options. 

[tenta]

On 12/19/2019 at 7:10 PM, peqkno said:

That really depends.

What I hear you say sounds like most RedPill/PUA ideas I got thus far (and that were many imo). I really don't want to think again in those terms, as I think it's really black-and-white and I'd feel repulsed if a woman were to think or behave that way because ... simply put it couldn't meet my need to be appreciated for more than just looks. Also it's playing into some behaviour I don't want to exhibit.

 

PUA is about social skills and body language, which doesn't attract women unless you have the right genetics (which will also influence your ability to do PUA game).

You don't want a woman to only want your looks, but women don't perceive wanting someone because of looks the same way you would.

[peqkno]

@assx95 I'll leave a better reply later on after rereading and relfecting some more. I do think you hit some of the major issues going on.

 

How have you discovered those dynamics in yourself then and connected those dots? And what changed it?

Also:

On 21.12.2019 at 6:15 AM, assx95 said:

You look like the classic devil disguised as a nice guy who is honest. 

 Sounds familiar. Would you recommend reading "No more Mr. Nice Guy" or is there another recommendation you could make?

[peqkno]

On 19.12.2019 at 10:27 PM, Lynnel said:

You need to understand that orange dating is better than blue dating on an individual level.

Better is relative. What do you mean exactly?

 

Your reply did offer some insights too.

How did you come to talk about blue? I find that interesting.

 

Tbh I use to think I've been living under a rock for most times in my teens (Watching too many children TV shows) and do seem to not get most assumptions people make about usual stuff.

Or the plain obvious to them they do not even notice. So, I would have to ask questions as "what is dating" even?

[Lynnel]

On 22/12/2019 at 3:49 PM, peqkno said:

Better is relative. What do you mean exactly?

I mean at blue you sometimes only get what you're given by society while at orange you can hope to get an amazing relationship.

By better I mean that you have a higher chance of having an amazing relationship (defined by your own terms or common things such as loving) at orange than at blue. And obviously an even better one at green, yellow, etc.

I mentionned blue because blue is at the source of a lot of conditionning and you were most likely born to very blue parents. Most people nowadays even in the more developped countries are a mix of blue - orange - green. So blue is very important to understand.