Another Critique on Actualized.org

[Key Elements]

@VeganAwake hey, this sounds like an excellent video. I'm going to listen to it later when I find some time. I listened to the first 3:20.

But, there's something I have to say there that caught my attention. The guy on the right is explaining it to the guy on the left. The guy on the left said that it sounds "crazy." Well, of course.  How can most ppl relate to it without becoming it? The teacher will have to tell it in the way that fits into his/her life. How was this teacher convinced that life is but a dream? Certainly, someone did not just tell him and he believed it. It never works this way. A person doesn't become a teacher by believing in it. Something in the teacher's life had to have happened in order for the teacher to realize that the absolute is real, and that we are all one. It's more convincing to the audience if the teacher explains it in this way. See, the absolute may have happened in a teacher's life, but initially, the teacher passed it off as a dream. He/she wasn't convinced. You wonder, what else must have happened in order to convince this teacher?

[VeganAwake]

23 minutes ago, Key Elements said:

@VeganAwake hey, this sounds like an excellent video. I'm going to listen to it later when I find some time. I listened to the first 3:20.

But, there's something I have to say there that caught my attention. The guy on the right is explaining it to the guy on the left. The guy on the left said that it sounds "crazy." Well, of course.  How can most ppl relate to it without becoming it? The teacher will have to tell it in the way that fits into his/her life. How was this teacher convinced that life is but a dream? Certainly, someone did not just tell him and he believed it. It never works this way. A person doesn't become a teacher by believing in it. Something in the teacher's life had to have happened in order for the teacher to realize that it is real. It's more convincing to the audience if the teacher explains it in this way.

Yeah I totally agree with what you're saying...❤

He basically mentions in other videos that's the only thing that needs to be done is realizing the false sense of self is an illusion( waking up) and that THIS is all there IS.

The Unknowing...

 

Edited December 8, 2019 by VeganAwake

[Leo Gura]

1 hour ago, VeganAwake said:

PS  me and Leo are going to Burning Man together in a few years so take that....

You should disclose such fantasies as your fantasies.

[Proactive]

@electroBeam thanks for the reminder 

 

 

even though I try to derive shit by myself I do admit that these videos effect me subconsciously.

 

[VeganAwake]

40 minutes ago, Leo Gura said:

You should disclose such fantasies as your fantasies.

That's true yeah I don't want anyone else to know wink ?

I will bring the Brazilian kabenzi's and I want I to bring the 5MeoDMT...

It's set then ❤

[VeganAwake]

Here is the total truth everyone:

Pizza

[Nak Khid]

4 hours ago, electroBeam said:

Sure, if you want to believe that I made this critique because I just mentally masturbated all day, or because I hate Leo, that's fine, you can believe whatever you want. 

As I said in the original post, this isn't me attacking Leo, "this is an authentic account of me purging the actualized.org belief system built up over time, along with all of the errors and shortcomings of this particular perspective". Don't get too caught up in such an account, it's just a perspective. Of course Leo has great teachings(as said at the bottom of my post).

Of course, most people on here don't resonate with the critique and so they jump to the conclusion that mental masturbation is at play. If only they know meditation doesn't rid you of the paradigm. If you're chasing enlightenment, or are trying to be more spiritual, because you believe something special about it, you're in the paradigm, you just don't know it. Even if you do the work, your mind will twist the interpretations of the insights, awakenings to fit it. And thats why I said at the bottom that I'm now looking to live in a place without spiritual words and concepts for a while. 

And I do listen to other teachers of course, what I forgot to mention was this really wasn't a critique of actualized.org alone, it was a critique of the new age movement as a whole, specialising in Leo's videos. I'm critiquing the west's complete bastardisation of spirituality to make it it's own little island in the sea of life, because the West are a bunch of over enthusiastic, over excited, content driven, dramatic bunch of people. Even if they have insights, people don't get/are not aware of how much their belief system shapes those insights and awakenings - clearly.

But again, I'm just saying what I see, and what makes me feel a lot better and relieved, if you disagree with me you have every right to.

What do you think of  this forum

Meditation, Consciousness, Enlightenment, Spirituality

as compared to the

Serious Emotional Problems

forum?

The later doesn't have nearly as much mystical or "New Age" tone as the former

 

 

 

[Nak Khid]

12 minutes ago, VeganAwake said:

Here is the total truth everyone:

Pizza

would you put pineapple on it or are you a purist?

[Galyna]

@Leo Gura Just done with my class this week. I took Multidisciplinary Studies this semester . The funniest thing is that everything I learned from that class was not knew to me because I heard every single concept from you prior taking that class. Thank you, Leo. I don’t want to sound like fan but it is really up to us how to use the information you give in the videos. Personally, your information helped me a lot, and I applied some of it for the university. Really loved that  video you posted about Chomsky. There is so much to learn from Actualized.org. Hate when people are bitching about it. 
hell, it does not have to be all about Enlightenment at the end! 

Edited December 8, 2019 by Galyna
Mistake

[VeganAwake]

1 hour ago, Nak Khid said:

would you put pineapple on it or are you a purist?

There is just THIS!!

[Nak Khid]

On 12/6/2019 at 10:28 PM, electroBeam said:

Dogmas and Collective Spiritual Ego is Reinforced by Repetitively Using Terminology, Sometimes in a Corrupt way.

Words that Leo preach in his preachings are repetitively used in actualized.org to reinforce the dogmas of the group. Its important to note that most, if any, of actualized.org followers have not experienced what the words are pointing to, and so repeating these words in the forum creates a dogmatic belief system. A lot of the words Leo uses are unique to this belief system, and are not found outside of it. 

Some words that are used.....

3. devilry

 

I wonder if there are other spiritual teachers using this word "devilry"

and what words particular teachers use  use that are synonymous

Edited December 8, 2019 by Nak Khid

[abundance]

Actualized.org has served me well. It has completely changed my life by introducing me to new concepts. For this I have immense gratitude. However, I do notice how many people get so caught up in concept and have a rather rigid understanding of spirituality. I would like to see more conversation on actual spiritual practice. I don't think this is any fault of Actualized.org or Leo though. 

[Lento]

After reading through all of the comments here, I would like to point out to the people who are blaming @electroBeam for his lack of results, that they are probably wrong.

The thing is that I think it's actually the other way around. He's lacking results not because he hasn't applied Leo's teachings correctly, but rather the exact opposite.

Notice that the majority of Leo's content probably for the last two years or so has been more directed at enlightenment, and specifically at deconstructing the ego.

Self-actualization is about both construction and deconstruction. However, the construction part of Leo's teachings is paid, i.e. LP course and booklist. I'm not saying this is intended by Leo as a strategy (like RationalWiki likes to think), but I think it's fair to point that out.

Now, I don't know whether you guys have bought anything, or whether electroBeam hasn't. But I don't think it's fair to place the blame on him for the lack of results. In my case, I haven't bought anything because I didn't have the money, and since I started following Leo, my life started declining until I'd hit a rock-bottom, and then I started experiencing the positives. So, maybe electroBeam needs to be more patient. Maybe he needs to deconstruct himself fully like I did, and then start constructing again from ground zero. I mean I can sense how he still has some unresolved ego issues, but that does not mean he should stop in my opinion, but rather to give his best shot at deconstructing his ego and then constructing it all over again.

Just my thoughts.

[zeroISinfinity]

God wants every one to be God. To be One. 

This is what Leo is doing. Accepted responsability (always say big balls because you sound like nutcase, not like you shy kiddo) and he brings pure Truth. There is no reconstructing ego. No one really awake will do that to you. 

[electroBeam]

1 minute ago, Lento said:

After reading through all of the comments here, I would like to point out to the people who are blaming @electroBeam for his lack of results, that they are probably wrong.

The thing is that I think it's actually the other way around. He's lacking results not because he hasn't applied Leo's teachings correctly, but rather the exact opposite.

Notice that the majority of Leo's content probably for the last two years or so has been more directed at enlightenment, and specifically at deconstructing the ego.

Self-actualization is about both construction and deconstruction. However, the construction part of Leo's teachings is paid, i.e. LP course and booklist. I'm not saying this is intended by Leo as a strategy (like RationalWiki likes to think), but I think it's fair to point that out.

Now, I don't know whether you guys have bought anything, or whether electroBeam hasn't. But I don't think it's fair to place the blame on him for the lack of results. In my case, I haven't bought anything because I didn't have the money, and since I started following Leo, my life started declining until I'd hit a rock-bottom, and then I started experiencing the positives. So, maybe electroBeam needs to be more patient. Maybe he needs to deconstruct himself fully like I did, and then start constructing again from ground zero. I mean I can sense how he still has some unresolved ego issues, but that does not mean he should stop in my opinion, but rather to give his best shot at deconstructing his ego and then constructing it all over again.

Just my thoughts.

maybe, or maybe electroBeam's problems have nothing to do with the ego at all. Maybe electroBeam's ego is completely irrelevant.

maybe electroBeam was just commenting on the structure of the new age + actualized.org itself, as seen through his erroneous, incorrect, wrong perspective, just outlining what he authentically saw.

maybe he saw that the very act of calling an experience/the truth something, immediately made the psyche misinterpret that experience, and believe that belief, instead of remembering the experience, while unknowingly believing its remembering the experience. 

Maybe he saw that there is no correlation between a word and an experience, and any belief in one causes devilry/illusion. Maybe he saw that calling the truth a cow, is just as close to the truth as calling it one. Maybe he saw calling the truth as blue, is as close to the truth as calling it Love. And believing that this is not the case is the very thing that perpetuates a completely made up, imaginary, delusional, spiritual paradigm, while deluding yourself into thinking anyone who disagrees just hasn't done the work.

Maybe he saw that its impossible to make a pointer, because you cannot point to the truth. Maybe he saw what people point to doesn't exist. 

Maybe he saw that the new age movement is essentially applying western science principles. Having an awakening experience, then labelling it, and effectively making a belief about it and getting sucked into it without knowing. Just like how western scientists misinterpret their experiments and make a belief about it. 

Maybe he just sees this, from his very limited perspective, happening on the forum, in new age videos, in any talk about spirituality, and so he just wants to abandon the whole thing for a while. 

Maybe electroBeam sees insights, awakening experiences, enlightenment, trying to get to the truth, truth itself, literally everything being talked about on here AND everything being pointed to, as being completely bullshit. 

 

In electroBeam's current perspective, there is no ego, LP course, no such thing as results, no such thing as a distraction, Leo's teachings, from the point of truth, its just all made up, all of it. Nothing to do with the truth electroBeam is looking for, or cares about. electroBeam doesn't care about spirituality anymore, electroBeam just cares about the NOW, the THIS, and all of this site, and every other new age site, is not talking about THIS, they are talking about their paradigm, while believing they are talking about THIS, when that's not true at all.

 

That's all electroBeam is saying, if this doesn't clear up the misinterpretations of his original post, nothing will. And it doesn't matter, it doesn't change anything. 

[Sage]

I don't often post on the forum. The reason is that when we're talking about matters of consciousness, nothing is going to be brought into the light on an online forum. If we're going for direct consciousness, which I'm hoping we all get by now is the point - running around the endless merry-go-round of the mind on a forum is just a wild goose chase. 

Throughout this 'journey', if you want to call it that - you will run into a fucking batshit crazy amount of cul-de-sacs and dead-ends. Just when you think you've got it all figured out it'll hit you that you actually just deluded yourself. 

If you're 'serious' about this work you will read countless books, watch thousands of videos and listen to hundreds of people spewing their conceptual version of the truth. At the end of the day, only one thing is true in regard to waking up, and it's a quote from Jed McKenna:

 

"Sit down, shut up and ask yourself what's true until you know."

 

The truth must be the truth now, it must be the truth right here. For all things and at all times. If you can't find it right here and now you ain't gonna find it anywhere else. Forget the critiques. Forget the judgments. It's all a waste of time. You'll find, in the end, that it's all you anyway. The dream is the point. It's all good. You're already home. 

[Consept]

I would say the criticisms from @electroBeamare fair but also at the sane time not necessarily Leo's fault. 

I've always thought the idea of enlightenment as presented on the forum is potentially unhealthy and almost anti-enlightnement, as it sets it up as a goal and is taken very seriously, this leads to comments like 'I'm going to get enlightened and then work on a career', as if it's the same as getting a college degree. It's only here where I've heard it discussed in such terms, most good nondual teachers have a fun, I can't believe people take this serious outlook, which is very counter to Leo's. Personally I believe Leo is just not awakened at least not to their extent, I think he's had profound experiences but to me he doesn't embody it in the same way, but there's absolutely nothing wrong with that, he's still on his journey. If you want nondual teachings there's a ton of teachers who completely embody it, one of my favourites is Paul Hedderman, who often says the subject of non duality doesn't interest him at all, which might sound ridiculous to us but if you were really awakened why would it interest you? I

Having said that I think the value of actualized.org is that it breaks down complex and not really talked about topics in a relatively easy way to understand and I can't express how valuable that is, things like the SD series were honestly amazing. 

The problem is when people take Leo as a guru and not a Gura lol. In that they hang on every word and start making life decisions based on what he says. To be fair he has always said do your own research and have your own sources. The teachings here (and anywhere) are tools and that's it, use them but don't add dogma or any kind of sacredness to them, don't assume Leo is right and work from there, do your own thing. 

 

[VeganAwake]

Oh my goodness this deep talk is pointless it is THIS!! ❤

[Conscious life]

@Leo Gura

14 hours ago, Leo Gura said:

How do you know I haven't?

You guys make a lot of assumptions bout me.

For those of you who think Leo is under guru his above them

He is exploring real scientific Sprituality, most mystic and scientists don't do. 

It's rare in the world to find a teacher like Leo. 

 

[inFlow]

@Nak Khid if you awaken enough you understand that you were the guru all along.