My niece's behaviour

[remember]

1 hour ago, Buba said:

“Almost all people yell and insult their children, is not it normal”

no it is not normal - you can tell her it might be accepted in some places, but in a lot of places on the world it is not accepted. if i would encounter a woman openly scolding and gently hitting her child i would give her a really gentile look or tell her gently screaming that i think it`s not ok, because the majority in my country thinks it is low and weak to treat a child like that who is helpless and would probably support me if the woman would leash out against me.

depending on what future she wants for her child...she could realize that the majority in all rich countries in the world where successful people live condemn harsh attitude towards children. not that it never happened or happens in history or now but because they realized it is uneducated and unrefined cruelty. she also could think the other way round, how does she want to be treated when she is an old woman? making her aware that it could be that every harsh word she utters now will fall back onto her.

is your sister religious? maybe you could argument in that direction, too.

the thing about books is there are a looot of good books which go into the topic of good parenting, scolding is not part of one. there is not one successful book about how to scold your child. you could also tell her that.

unfortunately i don`t have any book recommendation. strongly recommending the rice experiment again for general awareness. everytime she wants to hurt her daughter she should hate the rice in the hate glass. if she will be not shocked and change i don`t know!

 

Edited November 27, 2019 by remember

[Nahm]

@Buba I feel for ya. Again though, the issue at hand is anger, imo. The remedy is consciousness of it, not parenting. There are ample parenting tips & resources online, but anger & fear won’t look. Without fear & anger, loving is the natural order, neither survives in the light and relief of self awareness. For you to focus on the issue being within a relationship is like her focusing on the issue being about her daughter. It’s just keeps it going generationally in relationships like an endless game of hot potato. It’s a one-off, individual issue. It’s anger / losing consciousness at play. Reconnecting with being is the call. Totally understandable that she might not be interested in talking with some forum guy. If that changes down the road, just say the word.

Also, if it’s helpful / useful, my wife went through the anger inspection & realization too, and she has a master’s degree in family therapeutic management. She’d love to help if possible as well. The best thing you can do imo, is “root it out” (understand it) within yourself, and liberate. Nothing speaks louder than nonviolence, non-engagement, non-blame, non-anger. True power is realizing there is no assertion. What is most “normal”, imo, is listening to the source within. Abiding by feeling. 

There are tons of books and resources for this online. 

2 hours ago, Buba said:

 I do not recommend meditation to her or anyone, because I do not think everybody can handle Dark Night of the Soul or other dark sides of meditation.

‘Nothing’ (♥️) can change everything. You are more powerful than you have ever imagined my friend. Such fear fuels such anger. If you believe meditation won’t help, ok. But switch the focus to what will. What have you tried? Yoga, therapy, etc? Diet, exercise? Etc. People more readily believe in themselves when they think...well, if he can do it...

[Buba]

On 11/27/2019 at 2:13 PM, remember said:

no it is not normal - you can tell her it might be accepted in some places, but in a lot of places on the world it is not accepted. if i would encounter a woman openly scolding and gently hitting her child i would give her a really gentile look or tell her gently screaming that i think it`s not ok, because the majority in my country thinks it is low and weak to treat a child like that who is helpless and would probably support me if the woman would leash out against me.

depending on what future she wants for her child...she could realize that the majority in all rich countries in the world where successful people live condemn harsh attitude towards children. not that it never happened or happens in history or now but because they realized it is uneducated and unrefined cruelty. she also could think the other way round, how does she want to be treated when she is an old woman? making her aware that it could be that every harsh word she utters now will fall back onto her.

is your sister religious? maybe you could argument in that direction, too.

the thing about books is there are a looot of good books which go into the topic of good parenting, scolding is not part of one. there is not one successful book about how to scold your child. you could also tell her that.

unfortunately i don`t have any book recommendation. strongly recommending the rice experiment again for general awareness. everytime she wants to hurt her daughter she should hate the rice in the hate glass. if she will be not shocked and change i don`t know!

 

It is not normal, but most of people consider it normal and in countries like mine, government does not interfere in scolding a child. Unless a child is severely harmed, government does not interfere. And even if they interfered and took the child from the family there would not be someone to take care of a child better than parents. I googled rice experiment, I doubt it will work.

23 hours ago, Nahm said:

@Buba I feel for ya. Again though, the issue at hand is anger, imo. The remedy is consciousness of it, not parenting. There are ample parenting tips & resources online, but anger & fear won’t look. Without fear & anger, loving is the natural order, neither survives in the light and relief of self awareness. For you to focus on the issue being within a relationship is like her focusing on the issue being about her daughter. It’s just keeps it going generationally in relationships like an endless game of hot potato. It’s a one-off, individual issue. It’s anger / losing consciousness at play. Reconnecting with being is the call. Totally understandable that she might not be interested in talking with some forum guy. If that changes down the road, just say the word.

Also, if it’s helpful / useful, my wife went through the anger inspection & realization too, and she has a master’s degree in family therapeutic management. She’d love to help if possible as well. The best thing you can do imo, is “root it out” (understand it) within yourself, and liberate. Nothing speaks louder than nonviolence, non-engagement, non-blame, non-anger. True power is realizing there is no assertion. What is most “normal”, imo, is listening to the source within. Abiding by feeling. 

There are tons of books and resources for this online. 

‘Nothing’ (♥️) can change everything. You are more powerful than you have ever imagined my friend. Such fear fuels such anger. If you believe meditation won’t help, ok. But switch the focus to what will. What have you tried? Yoga, therapy, etc? Diet, exercise? Etc. People more readily believe in themselves when they think...well, if he can do it...

She says "I have anger and anxiety issues, but I am not ready to go to my childhood. It is very terrifying for me to go to my childhood and face those moments again." She said she would take her daughter to psychotherapist and change her attitude for better towards her daughter. She was very nice to her daughter during the day but at night my niece did not want to sleep, she got angry again and started to scold her.

She also asked me not discuss this topic anymore, as this irritates her even more. She said she does not want to feel guilty or panic that something bad will happen to her daughter. She, also my parents say that I exaggerate my niece's state and overall situation.

Meditation may help, but until it starts to help, you go through the hell, which I doubt my sister will handle.

[Nahm]

@Buba

She’s thinking it’s her childhood, it’s her anger, it’s her anxiety. Right now, in this present moment, those are just abstractions, “things” she’s making up. But of course, she doesn’t realize she’s creating it. The Cosmic Joke is, there’s no subject & object relationship. She doesn’t have to “face” anything, nor do we have a time machine in which she could. It’s a matter of becoming more consciousness, present, mindful...not ‘facing’ or ‘figuring’ or overthinking more. “The only thing we have to fear, is fear itself”. I hear ya though. We each cause our own suffering, and nobody can let go for us. Godspeed my friend. You’re a good soul. Her too. If only she had an inclination how innocent she is.

 

 

 

[remember]

1 hour ago, Nahm said:

We each cause our own suffering, and nobody can let go for us. Godspeed my friend. You’re a good soul. Her too. If only she had an inclination how innocent she is.

 

 

 

that`s victim mindset. yes, victim produces victim, but she`s a grown up who refuses to take responsibility, by not looking for the fault in herself. the consequence is not innocence. not knowing does not prevent from doing, not wanting to know and still doing is knowing and still doing.

a child can`t reflect that, a grown up can, that`s the difference between her and her victim. and that`s what makes her a culprit. very hard to accept that if someone is so innocent.

Edited November 28, 2019 by remember
@nahm you play a very dangerous game of selfjustification there.

[Nahm]

@remember They know not what they do. 

[remember]

31 minutes ago, Nahm said:

@remember They know not what they do. 

what is not the definition for innocence. especially if it is not: they don`t know what they do. because they could know what they do.

Edited November 28, 2019 by remember
forgot punctuation.

[Nahm]

@remember Sure. But they don’t. I feel you’re underestimating unconsciousness. No body chooses anger. Feels terrible. 

Would you estimate that she knows her true being, prior to the thoughts, actions, behaviors, patterns (Duality)?

Can a finite mind in paradigm lock flip a duality, perspective, without transcendence of it?

 

[remember]

56 minutes ago, Nahm said:

@remember Sure. But they don’t. I feel you’re underestimating unconsciousness. No body chooses anger. Feels terrible. 

in some situation anger can feel pretty good - the question is always in what situation. if anger was not there how would that topic even pop up?

although i can see that ignorance does not protect from bypassing. even awareness oftentimes does not protect from bypassing. if i ignore the bypassing i make it worse. the same with the child, it is not that no consequence should be practiced if she dances on her mothers nose. hurting her sister for example must be stopped very early, but how should she understand that the older is not supposed to gently hurt her sister? some children can be really mean and even start hurting their parents physically, that`s also not ok, it`s also not ok if they play mind games. so it is important to stop them playing the mind game. but the way doing that is of course relevant.

maybe the mother could imagine for one day that she would be a public worker and her child was not hers - would she still hurt that child? and then if she was a public worker would she still hurt her own child while she wouldn`t hurt the child of someone else? so is her own child less worth than the child of someone else? or what exactly is the relationship to a child? i guess if she was a public worker she would loose her job if she would hurt someone elses child, that`s the consequence.

if a country is not able to protect children doesn`t mean we can`t learn to have better expectations of ourselfs. but in the long run it`s also the goal to change that about the country. if the country denies the responsibility to educate on that or intervene.

Edited November 28, 2019 by remember

[Nahm]

2 minutes ago, remember said:

if anger was not there how would that topic even pop up?

Right on. 

 

[Buba]

Thank you very much, for your responses. I love my sister and my niece very much. Unfortunately I cannot advise her to meditate to heal. I myself dont know if I will be able to digest the Truth, to accept it. As Leo said this path is not for everyone. Some people's state can even deteriorate after meditation. I am afraid she will get even worse after meditation. So that is why I am looking for other ways to heal (like psychoanalysis).

[Nahm]

@Buba I misunderstood, ?? I thought you’d ruled that out. 

It can of course be most helpful for someone who will more readily listen to another, in leu of their own feelings, there own inner being, their own suffering. There are lots of professionals who can help you reconnect those dots. A very powerful thing happens for her, when you aren’t interested in her anger, when you are no longer affected - when you’re off creating the life of your dream. There is no assertion, but such love & zest sure pushes the limits.