Forum Hierarchy

[allislove]

I wasn't kidding about the Chrome extension.

1. Install https://chrome.google.com/webstore/detail/custom-javascript-for-web/poakhlngfciodnhlhhgnaaelnpjljija?hl=en
2. Paste 

document.querySelectorAll("span[style='color:#cc3300'] strong").forEach(e => { e.style.color = "black"; e.style['font-weight'] = "normal" })
document.querySelectorAll("span[style='color: #66cc00'] strong").forEach(e => { e.style.color = "black"; e.style['font-weight'] = "normal" })

Then, you will have:

Moderators:



Leo:




Enjoy 

[M4sti]

It is unbeliavable for me that this """"""issue"""" can arise in such a place, and people spend time with this instead of real work or something more important. 

 

You really need to have big personal issues to decide to rant about the forum hierarchy, thread starter and @remember are projecting a lot of insecurities and false realities towards the moderators , and as every other topic i read it is always clear to me that the mods deserve their place and i guess Leo chose them wisely. Their intent is clear, and it is to push our orange asses forward , only that they put it more kindly and sophisticated and this is how it has greater chanse of making an impact. 

[remember]

9 hours ago, Key Elements said:

McDonald's, Toyota, Honda, Lamborghini, Starbucks, Google, IBM, etc. You know what I'm talking about, right?

yes - if i mention absolutism or marie antoinette, you know what i mean?

9 hours ago, Key Elements said:

Eckhart Tolle, Shinzen Young, Leo Gura, Thich Nhat Hanh, you will probably know who I'm talking about because we do talk about these ppl sometimes.

yes - although i can mention and know them even if i was in blue or maybe even further down in red. knowing and mentioning them and quoting them does not mean a person is spiritually developed. a lot of people who seem to be in green still are emotionally and spiritually in red.

and there is a reason why i started to be more upfront and less compassionate in this forum even though enlightenment is also my life purpose, even though i have my own understanding of it without ever following a spiritual guide except my mother and some people i met in my life who really made a difference and i look up to representatives of budhism, not as supperiors but as a child. you see the forum might not be the endgoal but it is a place to learn, also from each other, and until now that might be exactly why some topics in the hirarchical structural dimmension came up - because it`s hirarchically built and leo tries to rule problems out with the weekly videos. some problems indeed adjust themselfs through at least being reflected a little bit. but it doesn`t change the fact that lemons are not always yellow and oranges sometimes look green before they turn orange. and it doesn`t change that some people here have to take on and work through more karma than others and it`s too much expected to take a leo preselection on that because of wrong choices that also seem to be based on physical preferences.

and yes that`s spiritual, too. i don`t have to swallow everything down to be spiritual, i don`t have to accept if someone places ego driven moderators in front of my nose who let me down in destabilizing situations where i actually need their help because they are too much preoccupied with their physical appearance. i don`t want to be in a situation where i ask for help in a moderator and because the person is ego wise so instable attacks me while i am already under preassure to help someone with their problems, i can`t fix their massive ego along with it. but the hirarchical structure of this forum asks me to do so.

and yes this forum is a place where people with problems ask for help. people with a real life.

Edited November 26, 2019 by remember

[Lento]

@dimitri You're the absolute awesome!

[remember]

@dimitri is there also a method to put moderators on the ignore list?

[allislove]

@remember everything is possible, doesn't mean I am going to do it. The easiest way is to start your own forum.  

Have a good day.

[Key Elements]

@remember it's your choice. Good luck on your LP. Those ppl and companies I've listed are only for examples. I'm only saying that it's not easy to pass onto the world what is awakening to enlightenment, if you're going to include it in your LP. Forum is good practice for communication.

 

[petar8p]

7 hours ago, Keyhole said:

He keeps a lot of mods here because if there weren't, this place would turn into an incel warehouse or a place for trolls to pretend being spiritual for laughs.

I'm not saying anything about the mods whatsoever. They have to be here, and I respect that.

[petar8p]

4 hours ago, Tanz said:

Problems only exist if we look for them.  Im just happy that there is a forum for people to learn from each other and share ideas.  

This is classic spiritual bypassing.

 

3 hours ago, dimitri said:

I wasn't kidding about the Chrome extension.

1. Install https://chrome.google.com/webstore/detail/custom-javascript-for-web/poakhlngfciodnhlhhgnaaelnpjljija?hl=en
2. Paste 

document.querySelectorAll("span[style='color:#cc3300'] strong").forEach(e => { e.style.color = "black"; e.style['font-weight'] = "normal" })
document.querySelectorAll("span[style='color: #66cc00'] strong").forEach(e => { e.style.color = "black"; e.style['font-weight'] = "normal" })

Then, you will have:

Moderators:



Leo:




Enjoy 

You don't see what I'm talking about, you're just happy that you've stubmled upon some basic knowledge of front-end programming and you can share now how we can solve this without Leo intervening. That's not the point mate.

[allislove]

Quote

You don't see what I'm talking about, you're just happy that you've stubmled upon some basic knowledge of front-end programming and you can share now how we can solve this without Leo intervening. That's not the point mate.

Sorry, didn't mean to trigger you. 

[petar8p]

I will get back to this thread with a big reply to try and break some things down. 

 

I will try to cover each objection but in a systematic approach. Would be appreciated if no further replies are made until then. If you have something to write, you can write it and not post, one of the beautiful features of this forum is that what you write somewhere stays saved so you can always get back and post.

Thanks.

[petar8p]

Ok, let's try to do this. 

First of all, I don't get it why so many are upset about this kind of feedback, it really made disappointed. I think it's the best indicator of how attached many people are to Leo's opinion and spiral dynamics hierarchy in general. Many of you don't have necessary "survival" skills in place but are striving to achieve the most advanced insight a human can have. This simply doesn't work. We have to have the grounds covered first in order to build an Eiffel Tower. Trying to skip the steps wil only lead to having unintegated parts that we will eventually have to get back to if we want to become a "fully complete" individuals. Otherwise, spiritual bypassing will take place as it can be clearly seen in many of the posts on this forum.

I see the common thread where if there is more than 2 pages of discussion, you can be sure it all went to shit. This is just the symptom of unstability of the people here. No one is able to read and think about what is being said. Everybody is jumping to conclusions and telling others where they're wrong, how are they "projecting" and why they should just do the work, while ironically typing it on a forum while not being "enlightened" and clearly not doing the work themselves.

Can you observe that many people on this thread didn't acknowledge what I said at all, they just spit out their belief system onto what I said. If someone would've actually considered it, the response would be along the lines of "Good that you brought this up, it's an interesting thought. However, I think this and this" or "I think it should be a concern to the forum definitely based on.." Do you see? You can agree with me or disagree with me by not taking a stance. By being open and exploring this issue together. Sorry, but I admit I'm a bit frustrated and sad to see all this, especially by the fans of a guy who is supossedly valuing radical honesty, open-mindedness and insights about how hierarchies ultimately corrupt people and they are so hard to arrange. 

Well, if they are so hard to arrange, why not discussing about potential improvements, and if the propositions don't seem to would have been an actual improvements, then elaborately and simply giving feedback on why you think the OP is wrong, but with respect and temper. 

I think we have to have a better communication quality here, otherwise it's just a mass of people throwing their shadows back and forth. 

I don't say I'm right on this. I don't say I'm not. I believe I'm not and that's why I opened a new thread. I care about this community a lot and I would like to take part in suggesting some potential changes that Leo might consider valuable long-term. 

Thank you, and be careful how you continue to communicate. 
Appreciate you guys..
 

Edited November 27, 2019 by petar8p

[electroBeam]

I have personally inferred/observed a lot of 'structural garbage' or devilry in how this forum is setup. This forum is a system like any other system: political systems, corporate systems, household unit, etc. And as with most systems, the system itself is designed to mislead the people within the system for the sake of keeping the system going, rather than making people happy and expanding their consciousness. This system's lifeblood is people's misunderstanding of the system itself.

The issue of the mods having a hierarchy stems much deeper than just people subconsciously valuing the words of mods over the others. It also indoctrinates actualized.org followers into thinking that such a system even exists in all of spirituality. There are certain personas being subconsciously implied: 1) that there are people 'more developed' or 'above' others, and those people are valued by a group(be it actualized.org) and then there are people 'below' and these people are not valued. Therefore it implies that your spiritual development is based on the approval of this group. 2) The ones that are above take on a supportive role, rather then a learning role, and as a corollary the ones that are 'below' take on a learning role rather than a supportive role, implying that the ones that are above do not need to be taught and are fool proof, and the ones below need to be taught 3) the ones that are 'above' are above spiritually and mentally(through spiral dynamics)  and therefore their words are of higher value and are more accurate than the words of others in this group. 

There is also a persona to this entire group, which was artificially created by Leo as part of his branding and company. This persona is very deep and is learnt or indoctrinated through the values and concepts/statements he makes in his videos. This persona is a direct reflection of the karmic patterns of his ego/psyche. For example 'working your ass off and hard work', deep valuing of 'insights' and 'wisdom', 'thinking for yourself and the maverick approach', 'precision', 'masculine compassion' etc. This is just a persona, it has nothing to do with truth. The moderators have embodied this persona, and Leo picks moderators who best fit this persona. This is how he maintains the persona in this group, and maintains his entire branding. He indoctrinates people into thinking that this persona is not simply a persona but Truth itself. And he reinforces this by giving them moderator status. 

 

You really need to give Leo credit, because if every person on this forum actually practised his work seriously, they would deconstruct this forum to the point that they would no longer get indoctrinated and act according to this made up persona. But people on here don't really, they absorb his persona in his videos like a wet sponge, and in doing so serve Leo's persona and branding, maintaining it as a system, an entity with a collective ego. Leo probably knows this and that's why he has the balls to share the very thing that would destroy his business. 

Just removing the moderator vs non moderator hierarchy isn't going to do much for misleading people. As said, people are being mislead on this forum well beyond that hierarchical system. 

While people are being brainwashed by this forum, how could it be any way? for you to "kill the buddha" there needs to be a buddha in the first place. Do you really think Leo's work could really function without it brainwashing/misleading his followers?

All practices, teachings, schools, etc that have large bodies of people following and learning from them mislead their students . Its part of a greater functioning/wisdom of the universe. Highly advanced teachers that teach very small sets of highly advanced students CAN mislead their students much less because the system is much smaller, has less people in it and the students are advanced.

 

Strangely while I see devilry in how this forum is setup, if it wasn't for this devilry I wouldn't have seen this forum as devilry. It was thanks to the teachings that I could see it. A strange loop/snake that eats its tail. 

[Lento]

@petar8p @electroBeam

Really insightful and eye-opening observations guys! Thank you so much ?

And electroBeam, it's ironic that these insights come from someone whose avatar is a copycat of Leo's ?

[petar8p]

@electroBeam Thank you for expanding so beautifully, brother.

@Lento No problem, glad I could play a part in opening your eyes  

[electroBeam]

12 minutes ago, Lento said:

@petar8p @electroBeam

Really insightful and eye-opening observations guys! Thank you so much ?

And electroBeam, it's ironic that these insights come from someone whose avatar is a copycat of Leo's ?

Oh im the biggest fool in this forum, I probably follow leo more religiously than 90% here haha. Dont get fooled.

@petar8pNo probs, we went a bit of this in our meet i think. 

[TRUTHWITHCAPITALT]

On 11/25/2019 at 7:45 AM, petar8p said:

I have a question. Why are mods of this forum, and yourself, Leo Gura colored differently than other members? 
Doesn't that indicate a sort of a hierarchy and subconsciously implies authority? Didn't you say that we should only trust ourselves? 
 

Do you see for your self how you are moralizing for no reason.  I don't see any form of authority being dictated here. As a matter of fact Leo has done awesome work in letting people browse and follow whomever they want. This forum was not built overnight and it has evolved to serve the need of it's users.

I am not here to be overcritical over you but it looks like you have put yourself in the rabit hole of confabulation. 

 

Cut that. it won't serve you.  It is going to lead you to even more should statements and more neurosis. Watch leo's video about how we are neuritic.

 

  

[tenta]

On 11/25/2019 at 3:03 PM, Leo Gura said:

That's right. Because we have a hierarchy here. Welcome to society.