People living in hell - Why cant they start-over? (suicide)

[WHO IS]

Hello, I really need to get some answers to this question, because I contemplate a lot and still not sure what the answer is.

Question: If as we see the earth is a giant multiplayer-open-world-game, there WILL be people who would be dealt with bad cards in life and live in total misery. My question is if there is no death why cant these people who are trapped in very-hellish/painful lives, why can't they just commit suicide and be reborn as someone else? What does a person who`s life is total misery have to lose? Why not just start-over?

 

I know suicide is a "taboo" topic, but I can see that this question is relevant for a good amount of people on earth. So please dont take this question as some sort of "trolling", I'm genuinely interested in an answer as to why this cannot be used as a "respawn" as we see in video-games?

 

 

Edited November 16, 2019 by WHO IS

[Leo Gura]

It happens all the time. Tens of thousands of times per year.

But don't assume the "respawn" is free and clear. There is very likely an enormous karmic debt that comes with suicide. So avoid it if you can.

[Shroomdoctor]

Don't assume things can't get better. No matter how fucked you are, there is ALWAYS a pathway forward. Trust me, I've been to hell. 

Maybe there is a reason you are going through shit, maybe you have accumilated a lot of dead wood that needs to be burned off. Cleansing fire is rarely a nice thing, but it is in many ways necessary. Sometimes, however, we have accumilated so much dead wood, that that fire just completely shuts us down for a time. You feel completely hopeless and you just want it to end. And if you give into that impulse, you might commit suicide.

What do you have to loose giving it one more try? and then one more? 

Maybe in one year your life would take a 180 and you would live the rest of it in heaven. You don't know that. Killing yourself ends that possibility. It robs the world of what you could have been, of what you could have provided. It's clearly morally wrong. 

Everyone wants to live, the only reason someone wants to kill himself is to end the pain. He still would like a good life, but he feels like the pain is unbearable and neverending, which it isnt. So killing yourself ALWAYS goes against your own wishes. Its like throwing your game against a wall and breaking it. 

So, thats just my two cents. 

[Nirvanalight]

6 minutes ago, Leo Gura said:

It happens all the time. Tens of thousands of times per year.

But don't assume the "respawn" is free and clear. There is very likely an enormous karmic debt that comes with suicide. So avoid it if you can.

Could you explain why exactly? Karmic debt is something that most religions use as a weapon of fear mongering to keep people in control. I myself do not believe in such a thing. It would also mean that we do have free will as human beings, which I also serious doubt. But, I' am open to new suggestion. 

[Grateful Dead]

I could imagine it to be traumatic for the soul or whatever

[Leo Gura]

11 minutes ago, Nirvanalight said:

Could you explain why exactly? Karmic debt is something that most religions use as a weapon of fear mongering to keep people in control. I myself do not believe in such a thing. It would also mean that we do have free will as human beings, which I also serious doubt. But, I' am open to new suggestion. 

Karma is much more than fear mongering.

This topic is too complex and advanced to discuss on a forum. You'd need decades of advanced spiritual practice to begin to understand such things and I'm nowhere near understanding all that.

If you violently disrupt consciousness (via suicide), it's not unreasonable to expect a ripple effect which cascades from such an event, disrupting the evolution of consciousness. Don't think of it as a punishment, think of it as a natural consequence of self-rejection and self-hatred. How can consciousness continue its evolution if it hates itself so much it cannot even finish out one human life?

[WHO IS]

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8 minutes ago, Leo Gura said:

How can consciousness continue its evolution if it hates itself so much it cannot even finish out one human life?

Leo, however people suicide not always because they hate themselves and cannot finish a human life. People also commit suicide because they feel a lot of pain in very long periods of time and the future just holds more of the pain and even bigger. What then has this person to look forward to?

Like for example if someone has some degenerative disease which turns his/her body into a 24/7 torture chamber and there is no cure so they can only look forward to more of the pain and worse. What can I say to them to their face if they ask me "But there is no death, I'll be just reborn so why can't I put to stop to this, living in constant pain is also not good for the well being of my mind/psyche"

What do I say to them? That they just "just live with it?" Of course, I have the luxury of saying it while my body is not in the same mess as theirs. But if I put myself into their shoes, wouldn't it make sense for them to euthanize their current body?

 

 

Edited November 16, 2019 by WHO IS

[tenta]

Just now, Leo Gura said:

There is very likely an enormous karmic debt that comes with suicide.

 

Why? And how are your karma points kept track of?

[Leo Gura]

10 minutes ago, WHO IS said:

Like for example if someone has some degenerative disease which turns his/her body into a 24/7 torture chamber and there is no cure

This does not accurately describe why most people commit suicide.

[Nirvanalight]

19 minutes ago, Leo Gura said:

How can consciousness continue its evolution if it hates itself so much it cannot even finish out one human life?

Like " WHO IS" said. There are also other reasons to kill yourself. There are situations where people kill themself to save others. 

[Leo Gura]

4 minutes ago, Nirvanalight said:

Like " WHO IS" said. There are also other reasons to kill yourself. There are situations where people kill themself to save others. 

Look, you can do whatever you want. Just don't forget that all actions have natural consequences.

When you piss into the wind don't be surprised when it lands on your shoes.

[mandyjw]

If your computer messes up do you turn it off and on again or do you smash the entire thing to bits? 

[Barna]

Karma is a scary concept only from the point of view of the ego. Karma means "doing", and it's a self-chosen doing. 

What many people don't like to admit is that deep down (on the soul level) we like difficulty more than comfort. We like constant change more than a predictable life. 

Karma is not an outside force, Karma is what the soul chooses to do. 

If you have a difficult life then in that life there's a very important and profound lesson that the soul wants to learn. If the ego terminates this life then the "karmic consequence" is that the soul might skip this lesson now, and she might retry to learn this lesson later when she's more developed. But a more developed soul will play the same game on a higher level which will result in an even more extraordinary life. 

When we have suicidal thoughts, we're trying to move towards comfort by escaping the pain. What we don't realize is that the goal of the soul is never comfort. 

[WHO IS]

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If your computer messes up do you turn it off and on again or do you smash the entire thing to bits? 

But the thing is The Mind is not the body, not at all, the body is just an imagined "vessel" the Mind is attached too. Just like the bodies you have in your dreams, where you can be another person entirely. The Mind is not made of the body.

[Leo Gura]

@WHO IS Hence the concept of a "soul" was invented.

[tenta]

Just now, Leo Gura said:

it's not unreasonable to expect a ripple effect which cascades from such an event, disrupting the evolution of consciousness.

So this directly ties back to collective consciousness? (the video you posted on the blog)

[WHO IS]

Leo, therefore I ponder why make a big deal out of destroying something which is imaginary/the body, whereas your Mind which is real Youll have with you for eternity?

It's not like the only way to exist is by being attached to an animal host, in our case it is being the homo-sapien bodies. It is like people have no confidence in their being and they rely upon an animal-host to exist, no matter how much pain/suffering this animal host gives to the Mind. Especially when your Mind advanced enough to not be "content" with whatever pleasures the animal host can provide, be it sexual, food, any other forms of carnal entertainment. 

 

Edited November 16, 2019 by WHO IS

[remember]

21 minutes ago, WHO IS said:

But the thing is The Mind is not the body, not at all, the body is just an imagined "vessel" the Mind is attached too. Just like the bodies you have in your dreams, where you can be another person entirely. The Mind is not made of the body.

says who? be very attentive about who is saying that.

[Anton Rogachevski]

@Leo Gura

Is it true to say that if many have committed suicide, it was indeed god's plan? How can anything go against god's will? If he gave us free choice, why should any choice be wrong?

If death is imaginary, is suicide also imaginary?

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Look, you can do whatever you want. Just don't forget that all actions have natural consequences.

When you piss into the wind don't be surprised when it lands on your shoes.

 

Isn't it arrogant to assume that that we can affect the way of nature with our actions?

Edited November 16, 2019 by Anton Rogachevski

[Nickyy]

@WHO IS Total misery is not is consequence of external circumstances, but rather a product of perception.