Why I can't get laid just behaving authentically? Why I have to follow the rules?

[Javfly33]

 

My point is, I started to learn about pickup and all of this "mating-theory" stuff that I'm still very suspicious if it's bs, about 5-6 years ago. 

Yeah I met some women but I by that time I didn't love myself one bit, well I loved myself but in a fake way, in an egotistical grandeur way but then I would get anxious with a girl for the most stupid thing

At one point I realized all of this theory, jerarchy, "you have to behave this way", "don't be needy", "don't be this", "be that", "interpret social cues"...etc was making me GREATLY ANXIOUS. I was wtf im done with this shit.

But recently I realized I'll have to start meeting women of I'll get sick, I'm sooo sick of porn I could die. So I started talking to women recently, but totally in an opposite sense (although still ego tries to protect its image) I'm just being totally vulnerable, if I can behave like a needy bitch I will, if in that moment I want to be like a cute loser I will, I feel totally free and trying to accept myself 100% fully, basically doing the opposite of what a pick up book would tell you.

The result? Ive only got started and already met two very attractive girls, and I feel almost 0 anxious around them, very confident. Because I don't have to protect any image, I have nothing to lose and I'll end up meeting more women this way if I try to behave like X.

So you might say now, yeah but what about getting laid? Well I am not still sure about that lmao, did I just fucked up by behaving in an authentic way (even if its needy) with this women? What I know if that I haven't changed my approach I would be paralyzed to do anything. And I'm basically tired as hell of destructive behaviour like porn addiction and overall not loving yourself. 

Advice will be very appreciated. Don't mind if you crush my ego since this stage of my life my evolution is all about this..lol. but please don't tell me I gotta do pick up again, that I have to behave "confidently" even if in the inside in this moment of my life I AM NOT. Let me be authentic. Please tell me I can make it this way, God. For one time it does feel alright .

Edited November 6, 2019 by Javfly33

[TrynaBeTurquoise]

Sounds like you are evolving. Throwing in the towel on trying to be a certain way to pick up girls is healthy for you. Still, don't go out of your way to try to act needy though. Just go in to the situation with nothing to lose. Don't need to get laid, just be authentic, and if it doesnt happen, move on to the next, and eventually you will get success if you are persistent and keep building experience. 

[LordFall]

The point of game and pickup shouldn't be to neurotically learn and remember all the tactics and lines but to get a deeper picture of seduction and understand the underlying reasons why these things work so that you can integrate them fully into your behavior. That's why Leo has books like The Red Queen and Sperm Wars on his book list, studying the biology and psychology is what you're after so that you don't have to parrot the tactics and can end up being authentically yourself while still being wildly attractive to the opposite sex. 

You're on the right path. Studying the tactics and blindly applying them is only step 1. Take your learning further and you'll really start to have fun when it clicks. When you start to understand why stuff like dominance and confidence works, you can have fun with it. You can be a dominant/confident anime nerd and have girls watch anime with you and have them be crazily into you and have great times filled with sex and intimacy. Anime is just an example, change it to self-development or whatever niche hobby you're into and it still fits the same. 

Just like self-development, don't follow any seduction teacher like dogma. Learn at the start, integrate it and make it your own. 

Have fun young one.

Edited November 6, 2019 by LordFall

[Lento]

Sounds great! I hope I could reach similar levels of confidence.

If I were you right now, I would immediately start dropping hints with the ladies I meet about getting laid. Hell! I would possibly even say it directly. Women, generally speaking, love a bold guy and they become more agreeable in his presence (kind of like hypnosis lol). However, if you don't feel comfortable saying it directly, you can still go with the hints. Those hints usually turn on most women, so they will start sending you back more hints and eventually they might even ask you to sleep with them but don't place much hope on that, hunt for yourself as well. With trial and error it's possible to perfect this approach, and from what you have written, it seems like the best position for training. Good luck!

Edited November 7, 2019 by Lento

[Leo Gura]

Pickup is a lot like Zen. The harder your try to act how you should, the less you will succeed.

It's very counter-intuitive.

Ultimately all that good pickup is teaching you is:

1) Go talk to lots of girls!
2) Be authentic, don't be a dancing monkey, and be willing to get rejected for who you are. This will look different for each guy because authenticity is relative.
3) Don't be socially awkward or creepy.

But to really learn these lessons you gotta go out a lot and fail a lot. You will try to impress girls a 1000 different creepy ways until you learn it.

95% of your results from pickup simply come from you going out every night and approaching. The theory only accounts for the other 5%. So don't waste too much time worrying about the theory. You learn by going out and talking to females. The theory will tend to put you inside your head, doubting yourself.

The reason you've been having success is simply because you've been going out. If you go out long enough, sex will randomly fall on your lap. Some nights you will get laid for no good reason whatsoever, simply because you happened to be in the right place at the right time.

[Vercingetorix]

be aware when you are authentic and when it's your childhood defense mechanism that are "being authentic" - don't expect that girls would love your neurosis. it's good to be authentic, it shows you where you have more work do to, what direction to grow. if you would be very authentic, in the long run you will become very attractive guy, buy only if you work hard on your neurosis in the meanwhile.

Edited November 7, 2019 by Vercingetorix

[Leo Gura]

Also remember that girls are not saints. Fundamentally mating is about survival for both man and women alike. So of course you will be judged by how well you fit into the other's survival needs.

Girls are not obligated to love you no matter how you are. If your authentic way of acting is to be serial killer or some creeper, girls will rightfully reject you.

Being authentic does not guarantee any level of results. Usually when we say "be authentic" we assume you will be acting within certain norms and criteria which girls find valuable and attractive.

It can be easy to fool oneself into thinking that one's neuroses, bad habits, lack of socialization, and egotistical quirks are "authentic".

Ex: Farting when you feel like it might be authentic, but don't expect it to attract girls off the street.

[LoveandPurpose]

On 7.11.2019 at 0:29 PM, Leo Gura said:

It can be easy to fool oneself into thinking that one's neuroses, bad habits, lack of socialization, and egotistical quirks are "authentic".

How do you differenciate between what's really authentic and what's not?

[universe]

By being vulnerable with girls you already show that you are confident and comfortable with them.

And you can feel confident right now. Just accept every outcome and be ok with that. Kinda like what you are doing right now. 

[Knock]

@LoveandPurpose I like to think of it more as; "Am I acting neurotically or not?"

If you are actually neurotic, it's not your higher authentic self. 

More specifically, if I didn't care what other people thought, how could I express my highest self without fear of judgement.

[Nickyy]

1 hour ago, LoveandPurpose said:

How do you differenciate between what's really authentic and what's not?

Being authentic means not being identified with body or mind, but being completely integrated, in the present moment, acting from a place of wakefulness rather than conditioning / identification. 

You observe all social norms but are also not bound by them. You are fluid, non attached, receptive, curious, interested in right now and how it appears. You're impartial and meet experience head on. This means not reflecting on the past or worrying about what might happen in the future.

That is your natural state and that's what people respond positively to because they are meeting their deepest self.  

 

[YLayla27]

Hm, well what is your true goal? You sound more concerned about your self / self image than these "women" you meet. They are just random "females to potentially have sex with" it sounds like. That will get boring with each one of them eventually. Try to meet a soulmate to share your experience of life with, someone on the same wavelength...but you need to meet your own soul first or that wont be possible. Thats really the key I think. Find yourself. What are your values? What do you believe in? What makes you inspired, passionate in life? What are you against? Start with simple things like a favorite colour, favourite place to be, go to for vacation...do you prefer nature or cities? All kinds of things. Once you are fully aware of yourself which can take a while...months...years... it gets easier to identify others who are like you including women. Things will move on naturally from that point...try to find out the same about the people you meet, woman or man, regardless. Try to just really deeply get to know people, be interested, listen to them and forget yourself while you do.

Edited November 9, 2019 by YLayla27

[Leo Gura]

7 hours ago, LoveandPurpose said:

How do you differenciate between what's really authentic and what's not?

Consciousness & lots of awakening.

Psychedelics help a lot.

You have many, many layers of inauthenticity to shed. It's difficult to see how deep your inauthenticity goes without psychedelics.

Deep authenticity is impossible so long as you are dominated by fear and survival -- and the ego is all about fear and survival.

[CreamCat]

On 11/7/2019 at 3:04 PM, Leo Gura said:

You will try to impress girls a 1000 different creepy ways until you learn it.

95% of your results from pickup simply come from you going out every night and approaching. The theory only accounts for the other 5%. So don't waste too much time worrying about the theory. You learn by going out and talking to females. The theory will tend to put you inside your head, doubting yourself.

I resonate with this in terms of my experiences with building a software system.

You got to fail a few thousand times to build a mostly working software system.

On 11/7/2019 at 3:04 PM, Leo Gura said:

be willing to get rejected for who you are.

 

On 11/7/2019 at 8:29 PM, Leo Gura said:

Being authentic does not guarantee any level of results. Usually when we say "be authentic" we assume you will be acting within certain norms and criteria which girls find valuable and attractive.

So, what's your general advice for authenticity? Should I just express myself and be authentic in any situation regardless of whether I want to attract a girl?

Who I am often conflicts with survival of other human beings. Conflicts of interest are inevitable.

[petar8p]

@Javfly33 You're still viewing it as a big deal, and women can sense that really well. The trick is not trying to force yourself to not view it as a big deal, but questioning why are you doing so in the first place. Why is sex the end goal? Why does it matter if you have sex with the 5th girl or with 168th? 

Basically after you let go of needing to have sex, because you feel great either way, this will naturally make you drop your neediness, anxiety, getting too atached, acting socially creepy etc. There will be a natural aura and vibe around you that girls will like and then you just move the interaction where you feel it should go, but don't try to push it because of your agenda or hating the part of yourself that doesn't know how to have sex with girls. 

It's true that the outer game is important to learn of course, but if you don't address your internal stuff your game will always be coming from an "insufficient" place and you won't even be able to enjoy the sex that much, because you'll be too wrapped up in your head. 

[Preety_India]

@Javfly33 try not to follow the rules too blindly. . because you can't totally change who you're. You can always change a little bit at a time. 

Be as much authentic as you can because dishonesty is a bad trait .

Focus more on relationship Dynamics rather than what you should do or what you shouldn't do. 

For example what you do in a particular relationship may not be the best idea in another. Different relationships have different Dynamics depending on you and mostly the other person involved..

It all comes down to your real goal in a relationship and how driven you are to make it work 

The pickup books might help you a bit with realizing general dos and donts but not much more. In the end whatever happens within a relationship is dictated largely by both your and your partner's behaviors..here you'll have to be intuitive in sensing what needs to be done and what needs to be fixed. Because nobody truly knows what's going wrong in a relationship more than you and the other person. Here it's all your working. You gotta do your own research and see what will help you in a specific context ..

I wouldn't say pickup books are bad or worthless. General relationship advice always comes handy. In fact the more you learn the better because it helps to weed out potentially harmful relationships early on in your life. 

Often a relationship situation doesn't work out because it is intrinsically unhealthy as it is ,that is you are in an unhelpful unhealthy impossible dynamic and this is where self-help pickup gurus are very beneficial because they can relate to your situation and at least let you know that it's an impossible dynamic you're trying to work your way through.

But once you are in a healthy relationship dynamic, don't ruin it with relationship advice or general trends. Don't rely too much on social norms. Try making your own salad. Open up with your partner and see how you both can resolve the situation rather than looking for outside advice. It's a process of self growth unique to you.