The Problem With Believing

[Vlad Ropotica]

hey guys ,for the last 2 months i've been experiencing some uncomfortable senzations,sometimes i keep asking myself ''how do i know that all that i know as a strategy on meditating is true?'' i said to myself that even that is jut another belief,but it doesn't help at all,if i say to myself ,'' i am doing meditation properly'' i am also questioning ''how do i know'' ,and every time these obsesive thoughts come,i go into ''survival mode'' frustration,anger,i know that some of you guys will ask me,''is there anyone to get frustrated?'' or '' is there anyone who has obsesive thoughts?'' but if i realise that that everything is a projection of my mind i say to myself that even that is an illusion(and it is),so i can't really thrust it,i came to the conclusion that you need a smaller belief (''everything is a projection of your mind'') where you need to put the other complex beliefs. So ,can you please help me with this? I know that other beliefs wont help me too much but maybe i will get an insight to help me with this

[Nathalie]

@Vlad Ropotica

Hi Vlad,

I'm not sure I understand you rightly..

Are you trying to get rid of a belief with another one?

If so, why don't you rather try to quit every single one and just look and feel what is in you and around you? Just live and be present?

Everything else seems to be a brain product: interpretations which lead you far from reality..

Nothing confusing there, just simple aliveness

 

[Vlad Ropotica]

@MartineF does counciousnes really exist? lets say a belief like: ''i am a human'' and then you realise: ''that's just a belief'' ,but ''that's just another belief'' is just another belief,i dont know really why i make such a drama about this things...but sometimes i fear that if i allow myself to think about this things i wont do meditation anymore...

[Nathalie]

I don't know what I can recommend you.. For me it doesn't really matter if I am someone or something.. It seems to change constantly.. When I'm ill for example, I really can't ignore my body, so I am at least partly this body.. But often I have the impression that a kind af awareness uses my senses to experience what ever is around me.

However for the moment I stoped trying to label it and just do the things I like. I keep all my senses as open as I can, each time I remember it and enjoy, even the pain.

Consciousness means to me being aware of what is: the warmth of the sun, the birds singing in the trees, the beauty of each single tree, the eye contact with a stranger, the closeness of my partner.. even "bad" feelings like pain in my chest change and become energy by acknowledging it.. Can you understand it?

26 minutes ago, Vlad Ropotica said:

i fear that if i allow myself to think about this things i wont do meditation anymore...

Why do you meditate?

If you need a motivation, maybe you haven't choose the right one?

[Leo Gura]

@Vlad Ropotica That's what happens when you try to grasp the un-graspable with the mind. You will NEVER grasp Truth with the mind. It is not possible! All that can happen is the mind can spin its wheels until the tires wear out, the mind collapses in exhaustion, and Lo-&-Behold, Truth remains!

The problem is that you're not letting go. You still think you can win this battle through mental trickery. You think you can outsmart yourself, but your self is much smarter than you!

[Vlad Ropotica]

@MartineF Thanks for the advice

@Leo Gura ....so what should i do?should i let go of those beliefs?

[Leo Gura]

@Vlad Ropotica Sit and just focus on the fact that awareness is occurring. Don't think about it. Just focus on it.

[Vlad Ropotica]

@Leo Gura thank you Leo,i realised that i focused on thoughts instead of focus on meditation,is it ok if i try to meditate all the time?i mean,from the time i wake up to the time i go to sleep? or is it too exhausting?

[Vlad Ropotica]

On 29.05.2016 at 10:47 PM, MartineF said:

Are you trying to get rid of a belief with another one?

If so, why don't you rather try to quit every single one and just look and feel what is in you and around you?

@MartineF yeah :)) , now i really read this for real :))

[Steven]

@Vlad Ropotica '' i am doing meditation properly''

Thoughts are NOT reality. You can easily check this. Even from conventional point of view. Wherever you are right now, if you look around, you don’t get a screen in your mind with a stream of thoughts with name of all the objects present, like some kind of robot. If you focus on a object a thought may arise with the name of the object, purely out of habit, but after seeing the object... ie experience. 

You only have thoughts about PAST and FUTURE... Try thinking of now. You can’t. You can not scan your presence with thoughts. Thoughts only appear in your consciousness, and consciousness does not need thoughts in order to exist. You can not experience past and the future... your experience can only take place in the NOW.

Consciousness and mind are not the same thing – and in some languages it is not clearly separated. A  lot of people think about the concepts of being aware and consciousness as presence of thinking process. Wrong. It is just a state. In fact thinking can be compared to dreaming.

One way of think of meditation sessions is the time you allocate in order to immerse yourself into reality fully (or at least to give it a chance to happen). Making it a habbit helps to tear down all this conditioning we acquired over our lives plus all the beliefs we tend to develop with our thinking.

Check out this section of Shinzen Young explaining what to do if you start thinking '' i am doing meditation properly'':

https://youtu.be/cZ6cdIaUZCA?t=245

 

 

 

 

[Nathalie]

@Vlad Ropotica I don't know what Leo thinks, but if you allow I give you my opinion:

I think the most effective is to include meditation in your whole life, of course not sitting there and do nothing all the time, but to take a step aside and observe yourself each time you remember to do so, e.g. what you do, how you react in special situations and why you do so, observe the thoughts that come up, the inner dialog you have with whom ever, concentrate on your breath, does it change from one moment to another? Do you feel your energy field when you're together with friends, if not why not? etc..

It seems much more natural to me than "only" meditate once a day in order to have the things done..

[Vlad Ropotica]

@Steven thank you for your support

@MartineF i started for a long time ago to meditate everywhere,anywhere:sitting,walking ,even speaking :)) its like having an energy field around me :))