The mental breakdown

[Shaun]

If absolute truth will cause a complete mental breakdown and utterly destroy my life as Leo puts it, why are enlightened people so happy and at peace? 

[MusicalPotato]

Not all enlightened people are at peace. You can know the truth, but the truth can be so radical that you don't want to share it with family, friends, lovers, or anyone else at all unless you are okay with the social implications of sounding crazy. I am god though, I know that if I proclaimed it publicly (not on a forum, or in any other way than as anonymous), people would disagree with me and it wouldn't be a fun experience.

God is here to party.

I also have bad depression at times and the only reason I won't kill myself is that I know it never will end. My experience of being will just change and I'll probably come back. Might as well enjoy the ride.

In my opinion, if you can read and say the words "I am" (in regards to anything, even reading fantasy in a book), then you are that as well.

 

[Eu Sint]

They appear happy and at peace for you, because you project that happiness created by you on them. How do you know they are happy? Happiness and unhappiness are not relative? Absolute truth does not destroy your life, because you do not have a life ,but You are Life. What the Absolute Truth does is dissolve your false belief that you have a life, and remove the barriers between “you “and “they “. “They “just are. Stop believing that you are separate from something. As long as you are not separated, are still exist they and you ,happiness and unhappiness, mine or yours?

[Aeris]

1 hour ago, Shaun said:

If absolute truth will cause a complete mental breakdown and utterly destroy my life as Leo puts it, why are enlightened people so happy and at peace? 

I m enlightened from the mind ego, it will depend what you call "enlightened", probably an imaginary construct inside your head.

sure you can have so much growth that your states could be call'd enlightened.

but as there is multiple definition and interpretation... you'll have to find.

if you mean transcend all your human survival pattern, that is not possible from what I experienced so far, and what I've heard and see so far,

you can only aknowledge their force into your system, mix them in others places, tame them, but not supress.

there is many ways to live after detachment from the mind. You can still use mind to serv, it just doesn't own your perspective, you know that all is a perspective ( on a scale bigger than myself )

life that's low & high, mostly high (  ), the low are very rare for me. The low are here to makes you enjoy the high.

But I worked on a life and a vision that suit up my butt for now.
 

You can shape a life of misery or good, based on your own values.

 

"when you 'die' in ego, all seam meaningless, baseless, but then you come back and choose."

Edited October 29, 2019 by Aeris

[mandyjw]

In many cases they've done a lot of "work" to embody that realization. Seeing things you can't unsee... even if those things are interpreted as a blissful rather than negative experience... makes you realize the full extent to which thought and logic fail to explain the truth. So you stop seeking the truth in thought. You realize how much pain it causes yourself and others to seek ground in thought and you become peace. 

[Aeris]

2 minutes ago, mandyjw said:

In many cases they've done a lot of "work" to embody that realization. Seeing things you can't unsee... even if those things are interpreted as a blissful rather than negative experience... makes you realize the full extent to which thought and logic fail to explain the truth. So you stop seeking the truth in thought. You realize how much pain it causes yourself and others to seek ground in thought and you become peace. 

you're deluded, god is answerable, it's not about denying the questions because you can't answer them, that's a total total failing delusion, that's the best way to deluded yourself not finding truth.

and by truth I mean something you can hold.

unless you attribute values to truth.

[Scruffy Pacifist]

Hi Shaun,

"Absolute Truth" is what you are in your essence, another way to put it it's the internal silence within.

This is not a conceptual truth but an experiential truth that is realised in consistent silence.

The idea of absolute truth is an idea (a concept) requiring more words to describe words which defies the true art of meditation (staying in internal silence).

So - when you stay in internal silence you will realise experientially what you are beyond words. It's being/silence itself. A feeling of oneness occurs, you are the entire universe but it's not felt through words. It's always there, internal silence/stillness is always there.

The "ego" won't accept this so will go on "chasing its own tail" so to speak. Attempting to create vast amount of concepts/information to describe this. Not accepting the simple truth of silence.

Truth/Absolute truth is activity in mind's eye, the true purpose of meditation is to stay in the silence. Or the silence from where the thoughts pop in and out of experientially.

The more you stay in silence, you feel more peaceful. Because this internal silence is peace itself! It's a blissful peace - it's knowing that you are the silence and whether there is life or death this silence (YOU) will remain. It's staying in the silence and stillness at all times. It is not a thought it is experience itself!

And the best kind of happiness if the peace of simply existing beyond words.

[Synchronicity]

1 hour ago, Shaun said:

If absolute truth will cause a complete mental breakdown and utterly destroy my life as Leo puts it, why are enlightened people so happy and at peace? 

@ShaunI respect your skepticism and search for honest truth, so I’ll be frank with you and tell you that not all Enlightened people are perfectly happy. Some are, yes. But not all. Some are - rather than happy - narcissistic, bitter, aloof, sarcastic etc. 
There’s Enlightenment and then there’s application of it. Those who apply it in a way that helps them find happiness are the happy ones. 

[cetus]

6 minutes ago, Aeris said:

you're deluded, god is answerable, it's not about denying the questions because you can't answer themhat's the best way to deluded yourself not finding truth.

@Aeris Please be mindful of your tone.

[mandyjw]

6 minutes ago, Aeris said:

you're deluded, god is answerable, it's not about denying the questions because you can't answer them, that's a total total failing delusion, that's the best way to deluded yourself not finding truth.

and by truth I mean something you can hold.

unless you attribute values to truth.

You make an important point that asking questions and receiving answers and insights is a necessary part of the journey. But unless that process is happening this instant, it's all part of an illusion and is just as much a fiction as Santa Claus. 

The entire journey and notion of enlightenment is one big story or collection of stories within stories, and you are the center of it. 

The trick is embracing that story and letting it go at the same time, then you realize both those actions are illusory non-actions. 

[Aeris]

3 minutes ago, cetus56 said:

@Aeris Please be mindful of your tone.

how would you know I wasn't.

I m in pure love, radical honesty given on a plate.

almost quoting leo last video sentences, but I tryied to be more peaceful while doing it.

check up your guru.

[Aeris]

12 minutes ago, mandyjw said:

You make an important point that asking questions and receiving answers and insights is a necessary part of the journey. But unless that process is happening this instant, it's all part of an illusion and is just as much a fiction as Santa Claus. 

The entire journey and notion of enlightenment is one big story or collection of stories within stories, and you are the center of it. 

The trick is embracing that story and letting it go at the same time, then you realize both those actions are illusory non-actions. 

I guess you know what you know, You're not really deluded, I was just jumping on my interpretation of words, I don't know what you truly knows in your direct experience, I was just reflecting in pure flow.

 

 

__
whatever if the flow that is in me, push me to be banned from here, whatever, what should be should be.

 

Edited October 29, 2019 by Aeris

[Shaun]

2 hours ago, Eu Sint said:

They appear happy and at peace for you, because you project that happiness created by you on them. How do you know they are happy? Happiness and unhappiness are not relative? Absolute truth does not destroy your life, because you do not have a life ,but You are Life. What the Absolute Truth does is dissolve your false belief that you have a life, and remove the barriers between “you “and “they “. “They “just are. Stop believing that you are separate from something. As long as you are not separated, are still exist they and you ,happiness and unhappiness, mine or yours?

I do not believe that I'm separate from anyone. Separation is my undeniable direct experience. If I chuck the sandwich I'm eating right now at my friend, I don't feel it hitting her. There is separation of some form or another at play. 

[Eu Sint]

1 hour ago, Shaun said:

I do not believe that I'm separate from anyone. Separation is my undeniable direct experience. If I chuck the sandwich I'm eating right now at my friend, I don't feel it hitting her. There is separation of some form or another at play. 

Then if you are not separated from anyone and nothing, it means that you are happy and enlightened in peace. Enlightenment means “we “are One.So who is enlightened and who is not? Who is happy  and who is not.?Absolute Truth = Oneness.?

[Nahm]

5 hours ago, Shaun said:

If absolute truth will cause a complete mental breakdown and utterly destroy my life as Leo puts it, why are enlightened people so happy and at peace? 

The happiness & peace are the truth. There is no mental breakdown to fear, that is conditioning talking. The significant nuance in the “my life” is the my.  Life continues, but life is not ‘yours’, you are what life is. 

2 hours ago, Shaun said:

I do not believe that I'm separate from anyone. Separation is my undeniable direct experience. If I chuck the sandwich I'm eating right now at my friend, I don't feel it hitting her. There is separation of some form or another at play. 

A thought about perception isn’t direct experience of perception. It’s perception and a thought about perception. 

Would you rather be the one hit with the sandwhich, or the one who threw it? Notice there is some connection there with regard to feeling. It might be subtle, or undetectable currently. Meditation, every morning, and it won’t be too subtle for too long. 

There is the movie, or appearance level of the sensation of the sand which hitting the body, and there is the screen, being, sensation for having thrown something at someone. 

[Nahm]

@Nickyy I’m not sure if you’re just sharing that or there is an implied question or something...? 

[Surfingthewave]

@Shaun I think at times you could be taking Leo's words too literally. Why don't you compare and contrast with other teachers/people/gurus pursuing the path and formulate your own experiences. 

A good way to compare and contrast is to let go of your concepts, language and perceptions and start experiencing, directly and continually. As @Nahm states if you meditate twice a day you won't need to ask these questions. You'll have an experience of knowing. 

[Nahm]

@Nickyy I’m with you in sentiment for sure. However, there is a duality present in life living by itself, with me as the observer. Life being separate from potential ‘interference from the egoic identity”. There is a collapse of the duality of personal & impersonal. 

[Nahm]

24 minutes ago, Nickyy said:

Duality is a consequence of identification with the mind.

We might be saying the same thing here really. This sounded like a duality....

 

38 minutes ago, Nickyy said:

life is living by itself while being observed

You as the observer, life as the object which you as the subject, are observing. Or observer (subject), life (object). 

Once identification has ceased and life reveals itself as impersonal and therefore benign that is enlightenment. To say that there is duality inherent in that state is a misunderstanding of duality.

The comment wasn’t in regards to a state. Again, we might be saying the same thing here, and this might be linguistic. 

Perhaps because actual duality has not been seen and transcended? ?

Actual duality can’t be seen or transcended ultimately, because duality is not actual. 

It's easy to speculate what enlightenment would be like, but until you have had an actual experience of what reality really is, then you could be mistakenly assume that duality is actually real. 

Nor can one actually experience what reality really is. That again would be subject (you) and experience of object (reality).

It's very simple, all that has to happen is disidentification, then duality is no longer the case. 

Just saying again, this could be ‘talking over each other’ / linguistic, but there isn’t a subject which disidentifys with an object.  

 

[Inliytened1]

@ShaunDuring some awakenings - for me - there was a window after awakening or a non-dual state in which i lingered between perspectives.  Between your Egos perspective and the universal or God's perspective.  I drifted between a non-dual state and duality for a few days because consciousness was elevated through the roof.  It did feel like i was going insane for a while.  I had to really work to focus on something of form because i would still be between states and defaulting to a formless or non-dual state. (Which was complete bliss)

So for me there was a window or period of time like this.  Also following days of total bliss there was some depression.  The ego has died and was reborn so to speak so there is some backlash.

Mysticism is serious business.  But i will say that it completely passes.  At least for me.  Consciousness returns to a human level after a time.  That time may be different for everyone.  I wouldn't trade being awake for anything.   Some people may not experience these things at all i can only speak from direct experience.

Edited October 29, 2019 by Inliytened1