I almost died, but I chickened out.

[XYZ]

Maybe you can help me make sense of this. Was it my sympathetic nervous system system kicking into overdrive because it was frightened by ego death? 

Background: Over the past year I've experienced semi-mystical states while asleep sometime, documented here:

And I've hoped to recreate this state of "deep love vibration" and go deeper into it during conscious waking meditation activities. I went to a mantra, meditation and sound bath event, with a plethora of unique instruments and musicians leading it. I was already very relaxed before the sound bath part began, and I wanted to just let go, let go of thinking, and let it take me as deep as we could go, that was my intention at the beginning. Soon, it felt like my consciousness was expanding beyond my body, and then oscillating from side to side, and then I was flying sideways in one direction. This self like a similar sensation as I'd experienced in the hyperdreams, and started to feel more and more blissful, what little thinking was still happening was excited to consciously enter the vibration, to let myself dissolve into it. And sure enough, I turned into a whirlpool, at least that's how I'd describe it afterward. It felt really good, getting deeper and deeper. But at the same time, my heart beat shot up, pounding rapidly at a superhuman pace. I don't remember that happening in the trippy dreams I've had, but maybe I was just not aware of it. Even today it took a while for me to notice this, and by the time I did, it felt like I was going to die. To do so would have felt completely euphoric, I am sure, and if I was alone in bed while experiencing this, I may have kept letting go. But it wasn't death itself I was afraid of, but I was afraid of making a scene there, or suddenly waking up in a hospital, or scaring the other participants, musicians and teachers with my lifeless body lying there after the class. 

I listened to the video where Leo described his experience going through literal death on 2-CB, as well as other accounts of ego death where they say that in the moment is is indistinguishable from what feel like permanent physical death. I thought I could surrender to such experiences, and it was the rapid heartbeat that scared me, the way my heart was beating felt actually lethal, I was sure my body was going to die if I didn't bring my heart rate down fast. An additional factor was that today a wild fire erupted not far from where I live here in California, and while I had to go outside for a few things earlier, and on the way to the event, I was chocking on smoke and ash. Just earlier this month a man died of cardiac arrest from hosing down his house to prevent it from burning down (the irony, the house 'lived' but he didn't), and that also flashed in my mind as I was going down. So I decided to come back...

I began to breathe deeply into the diaphragm, still not fully in my body, most of me was in another dimension spinning around wildly, but still felt the heart beating out of control. While now breathing consciously, part of me still wanted to stop fighting it, go fully into the other dimension that was still gripping me, let my body do what it will, or cease completely. But I resisted this again and stayed present. The whirlpooling and heart pounding eventually gave way to a peaceful floating sensation, and then I opened my eyes, grateful to be alive, and enjoyed the rest of the sound bath breathing deeply, and present in my body.

There was a pleasant afterglow, but nothing like the deepest dream state I had where I partially dissolved into what I can only describe as a deep love vibration. Those hadn't happened in a while, maybe because I've been sleeping better, they usually occurred while I wake up early, sleep deprived, then take  a morning nap. My sensations of altered consciousness during the sound bath were definitely on the same track as during those dreams, so I wonder what went wrong, or different.

Maybe I wasn't breathing enough, one difference is that I sleep on my side, which allows deep breathing. So when on my back, maybe I forgot to breathe, or had a hard time breathing in such a stimulated state, plus the effect of the fires too.

Maybe I wasn't spiritually developed enough, and have much more ego that I could admit to myself, so when the ego starts to dissolve, and I am wide awake not tired and dreaming, I panic. Do the deepest meditators master their subconscious more before they experience ego death while in meditation posture? Do psychadelics shut off the part of the nervous system that overreacted? 

Anyways, I feel fine and have yet to see how this will change me, I sort of feel less nervous and afraid in general. I didn't think that I was nervous and fearful before, but this brink of death experience may help me let go more in everyday life, let go of things that now seem so petty, less attached to things, more calm open towards people. I'm about to a gentle breath meditation with the Apana Vayu Mudra just in case. It is said to strengthen the heart, and people have used it while actually having a heart attack, and it stopped, so certainly can't hurt to do now.

[zeroISinfinity]

Yes Self Realization feels exactly like death. But do not worry, stop resisting and accept death. Easier said then done I get it. 

Miracle happens you Will not go into oblivion or some non existance. Probably is most wonderful "experience" there is. ♥️

[XYZ]

I may have forgotten to breathe, and that is what caused the near-death experience, which certainly could have resulted in literal physical death if I did not stop it in time and consciously breathe deeply to bring life back into the body. Since then, while in a sound bath, yoga shavasana or meditating I focus on deep breathing, which itself brings plenty of mindfulness and healing. 

What has come back to memory since then is that there was a brief moment of "waking up" from the dream of life, and being between states of consciousness, being aware that I'm not the body, while also aware that the body was going into meltdown. Then it was a conscious choice to come back to the body, to resume playing the character of "me" in the dream world. Conceptually, I can no longer claim to be a victim of existence, since I could have used that opportunity to exit the dream, but voluntarily chose to stay longer. Most apparent change noticed in direct experience is that "no self" is more palpable in every waking moment now, like the seer has become the seen.

I have no clear mental memory of what happened between the deepest part of the transcendent experience starting and becoming aware of the sensation of my heart beating like a jackhammer, but there is a body memory of that, which could be interpreted as the ego being "disproven." There is deep inner peace, but also lots of thoughts and fantasies, which seems like ego trying to maintain control after being found out as an illusion. I wasn't trying to die, I was hoping to experience love. But it all makes sense now, when no longer attached to ego, there is a power vacuum left for unconditional love to take place. When there is no self to defend anymore, the void left by relinquishing selfishness is filled by love, since it is the default state of pure being. Expect it to be a slow and gradual process, not expecting to become "enlightened" but with a simple goal of allowing myself to become more loving.  

 

[Leo Gura]

@XYZ It would help a lot if you stopped feeding this narrative that death or you are a thing.

I, I, I....

Me, me, me....

This is the problem. All of that is fantasies and hysterics which maintain the illusory sense of you.

"OMG! I almost died!!!! OMG!" << Hysterics of a non-existent ego trying desperately to make itself feel important and substantial. A fictional character cannot really die because it was a fiction to begin with.

[arlin]

On 29/10/2019 at 7:36 AM, XYZ said:

listened to the video where Leo described his experience going through literal death on 2-CB,

Very interesting. Where can i find it? Can you give me a link? 

 

[XYZ]

@arlin Easy to find the video. 

@Leo Gura Part of the problem is the limitations of language itself. Even if English vocabulary evolved to include existentially neutral pronouns, language is all abstraction which can never accurately describe reality.

There was a transcendence of self, a glimpse of waking up from the dream, but the dream body was still barely there. Awareness picked up on the sensation of a 400 BPM? heartbeat as it was leaving the dream entirely. It was conscious that it was waking up from the dream, that it was just a dream, that thing called live never really happened, and no time had passed between entering the dream and returning from it. But nevertheless, it decided to return to the dream, to keep playing the human game.

Just a few hours ago, another perspective emerged. "I" had expressed before how suicide was no longer a desirable course of action due to sheer selfishness, to selfish to give up life until forced to, while at the same time, keeping the possibility of suicide open as a last resort to escape suffering. Wanting to have a mystical experience was also motivated at least subconsciously by a desire to escape from life, to feel special, to break out of the petty material world of "ordinary existence."

But upon the direct experience of both life and death being imaginary, there was nothing more to escape from, nowhere to go but right here and now. It was seen that the life dream is not separate from divinity, nor is there a self separate from reality. Easy to think how those who realized this are just being egomaniacs, but it's the most humbling thing ever. Since there was nothing to run from any more, the dream body started to breathe deep, and relax back into the dream.

Reading/listening to stories of other awakenings, and some like Adyashanti report the same experience of a heartbeat like they overdosed on meth, then literally dying all the way, had to let go and accept the end of life they knew as a human, completely dissolving into God. Then they came back into their bodies enlightened. That could have happened then, sure, and sure that from within the multiplayer physical reality simulator, other characters would think one of them had a seizure or heart attack, they would've called an ambulance and made a big hullabaloo of it.

There's not even a self to want to become enlightened, or not want it, is there really a choice, can it be avoided, why become enlightened when there is no one to become enlightened, why think there is any control over it, why think...

[Leo Gura]

@XYZ Sure, seeing the Truth can cause a terror response in the body.

"Shock and awe" is a good way to describe certain deep existential insights. But that's usually upon first glimpses. Once you have many awakenings the terror of it goes away and you're mostly just left with awe.

Die a few dozen times and you'll become comfortable with it. No big deal. It will be like, "Oh yeah... ego death. Cool."

[roar]

3 minutes ago, Leo Gura said:

Die a few dozen times and you'll become comfortable with it. No big deal. It will be like, "Oh yeah... ego death. Cool."

I'm confused..death occurs only once, no? Please stop fooling yourself, when the only awakening you've had is of your ego.  You have a long way to travel, kid

[Leo Gura]

@roar Lol

Awakening can happen an infinite number of times.

[XYZ]

The setting was also a factor, just like one would be hesitant to let out a huge fart during shavasana in a yoga class, it didn't feel like the place to head into a full on death with no breaks. Afterwards I told the teacher like holy shit, I meditated so hard I left my body and almost died but, stopped it in just time before having a heart attack.

After understanding/contextualizing it more in the following week, told her it was a first tiny glimpse into awakening, I'm not trying to do that again, but if it does happen, and I don't get in the way of myself this time, don't be afraid, everything's okay, just let it happen.

[roar]

@Leo Gura If you keep awakening all the time, it means you're falling asleep all the time.  Shouldn't you strive to stay awake?  My advice to you, not that you need one, would be to drop this American trash/cash-culture paradigm.  Drop the LP nagging.  Enlightenment is the only life purpose needed.  No need for searching anything.  The world needs less business, not more.  We need to drop the shackles of capitalism to save this earth.  It's urgent!  Your fear of missing out from the worldly riches is obviously slowing your travel, and its not helping your followers.  Go look for authenticity in your Russian roots.  Don't let your intelligence rot in the soup of US low consciousness.  I think you know this already.

[Leo Gura]

@roar There are degrees of awakening you cannot even imagine.

[NoSelfSelf]

@Leo Gura i have problems with that one day i come to a degree where i see that i was not even born(i become everything) another day i come into the void and another is ego with no mind other is i struggle to even think you get the point i dont know how to stay in highest degree where you are happy with no reason...

[molosku]

@roar

2 hours ago, roar said:

@Leo Gura  Enlightenment is the only life purpose needed.  

Life does not stop at awakening, rather it STARTS at awakening. The whole consept of life purpose will be radically recontextualized when you find out who you are. Drop your simplistic notions of how life should or should not be lived. 

[roar]

@molosku @Leo Gura Oh really?  Who am I, old sages? 

 

Maybe it's time for you to move on from the conceptual stage..

Edited November 5, 2019 by roar

[remember]

well sometimes it`s better to not imagine probably, as imagination would be to threatening to ones perception of what love really is. sometimes truth and love and the absence of that what we could still call conciousness are separable. sometimes we must admit that conciousness, even if everything seems to be conciousness and love, doesn`t mean that it can`t be absent from a space, then truth is the only way to keep us sane. then love=truth but love is not the absence of love. no thing is prior to nothing.

Edited November 5, 2019 by remember

[molosku]

2 hours ago, roar said:

@molosku @Leo Gura Oh really?  Who am I, old sages? 

 

Maybe it's time for you to move on from the conceptual stage..

Note your "old sage" projection onto people who are giving advice/insight. No one is putting you down but yourself. 

 

[roar]

@molosku I am not putting anyone down.  Just trying to give some pointers.  Take it as you wish, pikkuveli.  

 

There's absolutely nothing wrong with an "old sage".  What kind of useful projection would that be?  I was only teasing you with some irony, as I guess you're still a young man.  Correct me if I'm wrong.  

Edited November 5, 2019 by roar

[roar]

@Leo Gura Leo how do you know my degrees of imagination?  Are you more God than me?  Aren't we One?

On a side note, do you speak Russian?

Edited November 5, 2019 by roar

[ROOBIO]

So after my 4 aco dmt trip which I took after 10 day meditation retreat. It felt like the light of consciousness spilt my mind in two with glass. 

I became the void and saw how everything is arising out of me.

Biggest mind fuck. 

Now I see that there is nothing outside my direct experience, that my direct experience is floating within nothingness, existing in no particular location. It is like a bubble. Then when I look at another person I see nothing in side them. They don’t exist in any location. 

It is like the present moment is a bubble within a bubble within a bubble to infinity existing nowhere

Edited November 5, 2019 by ROOBIO