Online Dating

[Leo Gura]

@mandyjw In practice the mating game is a lot more brutal than your ideals.

Nice guys and socially awkward guys aren't necessary fake. But you girls still don't like them.

Attraction is not based on ideals or unconditional love. It is blind survival and there's nothing "fair" or "honest" about it.

But hey, don't take my word for it. Discover for yourselves how mating works.

If you observe it carefully you should see that it's pure selfishness on both sides. It can be quite disgusting when you really look into it. After all, you would not be mating at all if not for survival needs.

Notice, you don't mate with your vacuum cleaner. Why not?

Or maybe some of you do? But again, that would also be purely to satisfy your survival needs.

For this reason the male and female perspectives on mating when never be fully reconcilable because they are not interested in truth or fairness, they are interested in maximizing survival while justifying it as truth. So the key here is to notice the self-bias of both sides. You and your partner are both biased and in denial about it.

[mandyjw]

@Leo Gura I have one lifetime, you cannot separate the evils of self survival with the opportunity of having one life to make an impact. Inspired life purpose and survival are two ends of the same stick. I could list out my own tips and tricks for women to lock down a good, honest, reliable man, which I successfully figured out at 16 years old, but that wouldn't serve anyone. People will call upon different life experiences to teach them the lessons they came here to learn. You can opt out of plenty of them without any suffering when you know what you really want in life. 

[mandyjw]

27 minutes ago, Leo Gura said:

For this reason the male and female perspectives on mating when never be fully reconcilable because they are not interested in truth or fairness, they are interested in maximizing survival while justifying it as truth. So the key here is to notice the self-bias of both sides. You and your partner are both biased and in denial about it.

Denial isn't necessary, just because you went into something with some unconscious selfish motives doesn't mean that you can't deepen the relationship and see through them at the same time. 

If you simply reminded young men here to see through their own survival needs, like you're reminding me here, that would be fair. But you're not, you are teaching them ways to act on their instincts, get what they want and perpetuate the self bias.  

[Lento]

1 hour ago, Leo Gura said:

Notice, you don't mate with your vacuum cleaner. Why not?

Or maybe some of you do? But again, that would also be purely to satisfy your survival needs.

LMFAO ? You're the devil ?

[remember]

@mandyjw  there is a thin line between stupidity and intelligence, if people still don`t learn to discern between a vacuum cleaner and a human they will hopfully eradicate themselves from this earth by mating with a vacuum cleaner. actually there is a reason why sex toys exist - didn`t look into it for a while but i see more vibrators than vacuum cleaners on their websites. the real problem though is the self bias indeed. that`s why so much bullshit and sexual violence still happens.

by the way maybe a vacuum cleaner with some learning effect would be nice, thinking about small electro shocks or so. men who use that will probably have a lot of sex.

attractive men have a lot of sex.

Edited November 7, 2019 by remember

[mandyjw]

 

[remember]

@mandyjw yes you are right unfortunately they are oftentimes gay.

[DnoReally]

6 hours ago, mandyjw said:

If you simply reminded young men here to see through their own survival needs, like you're reminding me here, that would be fair. But you're not

Yeah he should really do that sometime...

 

 

[MsNobody]

@mandyjw thank you for your words. 

@Leo Gura I love you to death, but whenever I post something on the forum you either don't respond or (like in my last two posts) recommends rewatching  your videos. 

But when men post about getting girls they always get your full attention, and I respect that, I know you started your path as a PUA and you learned / gained a lot from it but I feel like your advices are favoring men mostly, and I dont feel like you are doing that to help them deepen their relationships, seems like you focus on them burning out the sex part so they can be free to dive in the spiritual work, and the intention sucks. 

Maybe I’m mistaken, it’s all just my opinion and you can keep ignoring like you did with the others posts. 

Sometimes I see posts of you defending women and talking about them with such respect and warmth, your video about Love  so beautiful, but IMO this has been only words you tell yourself cause if you were really embodying what you say you wouldn’t teach men to treat women as objects, “10 per day” we are not numbers, no men and no women, we as human beings are better than animals because we have a heart who allows us to feel deeply for others around us, empathy, compassion, kindness are things we are aiming for. 

Just needed to say that, hope you are able to acknowledge your shadow. 

And thank you for the work you do on yourself, love you ❤️ 
 

[universe]

@MsNobody If you wouldnt objectify people you wouldnt have any concerns about someone spreading love and compassion to 10 others a day. No one is the property of someone else.

Dating as its is right now for the majority of people is very sefish. On both a conscious and unconscious level. Can we just agree that this makes it a struggle to people of all genders?

[Derek White]

@MsNobody When people talk they talk like that. Saying “10 per day” doesn’t mean he is making women look like animals. He is saying talk to 10 women per day so you can get good at attracting women, because for men attracting women is harder than it is for women to attract men,generally. He has also talked about sexism in the PUC many many times. Maybe you would understand his advice if you were a 25 year old virgin man who got rejected many times. Same wordings are used when helping people make friends.
 

Also, I’m just curious, would you consider bikini models, pornstars, and actresses to be objectifying women? What about men/women who admire their beauty? This ”objectifying”, get used a lot but in my judgement it is not properly defined. Both men and women “objectify” each other based on body parts (height, race, breasts, butt, muscles), mind (personality, IQ, EQ), and social standing (career, money) when finding a partner. 

Edited November 8, 2019 by Derek White

[Lento]

@MsNobody

The game isn't fair to neither of men or women. One of the inequalities is the hardships that men go through only to get laid i.e. only to fulfil their needs. And it's not men's fault that women ask for high standards. Do you know how painful it is to get rejected over and over again? Women in general don't have that problem. For women, getting laid is a piece of cake and they have the luxury to pick almost whomever they like or find attractive to have sex with. So that's one point for women.

On the other hand, there are certain loopholes in a lot of women's minds and they can be manipulated, whether the man or the woman are conscious of them or not. And there are some other loopholes in a lot of men's minds that women are always manipulating whether consciously or unconsciously, and women are generally inconsiderate of men's emotions.

So, as long as the game is unfair to men, I think it's fair to boost our chances with some psychological tricks. The game is so skewed to women's side, at least in the getting laid department. And I'm not blaming women, we're all victims to society's problems and to survival.

The point is that Leo is advocating to balance that problem out, that is through successfully getting men's needs met, while at the same time being responsible and not hurt women in the process. Or at least, that's how I see it.

Edited November 8, 2019 by Lento

[Derek White]

@mandyjw

17 hours ago, mandyjw said:

Denial isn't necessary, just because you went into something with some unconscious selfish motives doesn't mean that you can't deepen the relationship and see through them at the same time. 

If you simply reminded young men here to see through their own survival needs, like you're reminding me here, that would be fair. But you're not, you are teaching them ways to act on their instincts, get what they want and perpetuate the self bias.  

Living/breathing is itself an act of survival and instinctive. You believing you only have on life may not be true either. Yes, ideally men should have no sex drive, be super conscious sages but that’s not where everyone is right now. Why is it so wrong to teach men how to get women to have sex in a consensual, non-damaging way, and legal way with them? Maybe because if you’re a women (women generally prefer monogamies) you don’t want men to learn how to seduce women; maybe that way they would be forced to be monogamous. But know that women’s survival need of one partner and men’s survival need of many partners is at odds, so perhaps you need to see past the female self bias. 

Also, previously you only a male mind would come up with rules for attraction. But it is beneficial to come up with them. I’m sure you have them too (nice guys are assholes, etc.). Attraction is not at all mysterious, it can largely be explained logically to develop a strategy. Men with better strategy attract more women and vice versa. Best strategies are those that benefit both partners, creating a win-win situation.

Sorry if I come across as rude or mean but I don’t mean any offence.

 

[MsNobody]

lots of mansplaining here, I’m out ?

[Wonderer]

I’ll throw my 2 pennies in here.

I’ve got a lot of experience with online dating, serious amounts (not bragging, was a sex addict which made me depressed in the end)... slept with many girls from tinder and bumble.

It’s an easy way to meet girls, however Leo is right that it is superficial and looks are up there compared to normal bar pickup.

However this doesn’t mean to say that you can’t punch higher than your belt with girls on online dating, if your bio comes across funny (funny gets fanny) and confident then this will throw you in much better stead than a good looking guy with a mundane bio.

Also you need really strong text game.

And this is just the start really… you can charm them all you want online but you need to meet up in person and execute, where you need similar skills to bar pickup.

[Bridge to Infinity]

On 11/7/2019 at 7:17 AM, Leo Gura said:

You cannot invest in her at all until sex. And the guys who are best at that are total asshole players. So they get laid the most. It requires an almost sociopathic level of detachment. So ironically, the hottest girls reward sociopaths the most. And of course that makes perfect sense from the POV of survival. The more selfish the better, until it comes back to bite you in the ass. The problem with dating a sociopath is that he also doesn't give a damn about you.

Powerful stuff! In your video "Balancing Theory vs Practice" you talk about how you can pursue one thing and be doing something that contradicts it completely.

This is a perfect example of this: Being sociopathic is a very selfish, dishonest and ugly way to go about living life, but it must be done to create attraction and then that allows for deep intimate romance and love later on (the opposite of sociopathy).

Edited November 9, 2019 by Bridge to Infinity

[Beginner Mind]

On ‎2019‎-‎11‎-‎04 at 3:43 PM, Anna1 said:

@Beginner Mind I'd advise you not to chat with women that live too far from you. Make an acceptable range and stick to it, this way once you make a connection you can make a irl date so that you aren't just some pixels to her.

My sister had this rule and also would only chat for a week or two before saying she wanted to meet in real life. 

The other reason for this is that you might think your building something "real" with them when they may just think of you as someone online they can chat with when bored or lonely, because they like your personality, but really they never had any intentions of making it "real life" with you.

Yeah, ppl are assholes! (Men and women)

Thanks for the tip but I'd rather not limit myself to just girls in my area.  I've been told by two psychics that my future wife will be from a different country.  Obviously nothing a psychic says is set in stone, but it's enough to make me consider dating girls from different parts of the world.

[Ananta]

@Beginner Mind Gotcha, good luck! 

[Beginner Mind]

@Anna1 Thanks!

[Nickyy]

17 hours ago, modmyth said:

If you listened and watched carefully, you would see that in many many cases, there is the craving for emotional affirmation (and affirmation of the soul, in a sense), which is just as powerful, if not more powerful, than the simple urge to get off.  It is like the craving to be reminded that you are alive, that you exist, that you fucking matter. Is it being expressed in the most conscious and positive way? No, obviously not.

So even though I'm not in the same situation, empathy in this case is pretty simple, I think. Take something that you yourself crave emotional affirmation with, even if it's not with sex. Like, even just someone telling you that you're awesome. Now imagine that everyone 1) either ignores you. 2) tells you that you are shit. This gets to you eventually, even if no one owes you sex or affirmation. If you're young especially, this shapes you.

Saying that this thing shouldn't be sex.... not helpful. Some of us can't help it.

I have great compassion for the awkward, the late bloomers, and for those who are not naturals, and get no support/ guidance, etc., so all that is left is PUA, the best and the worst of it all.

In general, I wish everyone just got theirs, whether it was emotional satisfaction, sexual satisfaction, etc.... Honestly, it makes me sad...

WHY CAN'T EVERYONE LEARN HOW TO GET ALONG?!

Because the ultimate purpose of life is allow it to enlighten us. If the point of life was to gratify every ego then life wouldn't work. 

There is this mentality right through life that we should all be able to become totally fulfilled as a separate egoic entity. That's what social conditioning is. But it's this naieve thinking that is creating all of the misery on the planet. The fight for resources and the "pursuit of happiness" is nothing short of a delusion that creates a world of winners and losers.