The fear of being surpassed intellectually

[Commodent]

I had this insight a couple of days ago after watching "How Fear Works" part 1, and I figured someone in here might relate so I'm going to share it.

I was walking my dog, reflecting like I usually do, and I came up with the thought of monitoring my micro-fears like Leo had suggested. I did that for a while, and then I put my attention on the activity that I was doing in the moment, which was reflecting. Don't get me wrong, I find it a rather pleasant activity, but I do it all. the. time. That is, unless I'm gathering new info. So I started wondering why I'm never really taking a break from it. Why am I so addicted to thinking and generating new insights? And then it hit me.

I have a strong fear of being surpassed intellectually. It's very real. I can even recall abandoning certain ideas for the sole reason of them becoming mainstream. I feel very calm and relaxed when I'm reflecting, and I enjoy the places where it takes me. I feel like I'm growing. But when I stop doing it, the fear hits. If I still the mind, I will not grow. And what will eventually happen when my understanding is not growing? People will surpass me intellectually. People will see things clearer than I do. And thus, my value in the world will diminish. I will have nothing to show for. I will become boring. Dull. Unineresting. No value. And most frighteningly, I will be stuck at the place where I'm at now. No new insights, no growth. Just ... nothing.

I feel good about sharing this with you. I feel like it might help some people. I feel valuable. But I would not have been able to share this with you hadn't it been for reflection. I would not have been where I am today without it, not even close. That's what makes it so hard. Because the rewards of reflection are so obvious. For each new insight, I feel like I'm growing and seeing things more clearly. So I feel like I can never get enough. The hunger is insatiable. But at the same time, there's this fear of not doing it. And that makes me wonder what lies on the other side. It could be growth, or it could be stagnation. It seems like I just have to take the plunge in order to find out.

[TrynaBeTurquoise]

As someone who doesn't have this fear, maybe I can help shed some light on why I don't.

-Theres always going to be someone "smarter" than you, no matter how much intelligence you think you have

-Even if someone is more knowledgable than you in a particular area, or so it seems, they still won't have the same experiences and unique body of knowledge you have as a whole. 

-Even the person with the highest intellect in the world lets say, they still know relatively nothing in the grand scheme of themes. 

The ego wants to be identified as more intelligent but admitting to not knowing is more powerful, because its acceptance of your place in the universe as large. Your value goes on way more than your intellect. Nobody wants to be with a person that just spews their intellect all the time, saying things they might not be ready to understand themselves, they want someone who is empathetic and a great listener. A strong intellect won't hurt but its not the be all end all of providing value to others, far from it. 

[Forestluv]

@Commodent Curiosity and creativity can also be motivations for contemplation and conceptualization.

[enderx7]

On 9/27/2019 at 6:29 PM, Commodent said:

I have a strong fear of being surpassed intellectually. It's very real. I can even recall abandoning certain ideas for the sole reason of them becoming mainstream. I feel very calm and relaxed when I'm reflecting, and I enjoy the places where it takes me. I feel like I'm growing. But when I stop doing it, the fear hits. If I still the mind, I will not grow. And what will eventually happen when my understanding is not growing? People will surpass me intellectually. People will see things clearer than I do. And thus, my value in the world will diminish. I will have nothing to show for. I will become boring. Dull. Unineresting. No value. And most frighteningly, I will be stuck at the place where I'm at now. No new insights, no growth. Just ... nothing.

 @Commodent

Your personal intelligence is meaningless when you can have a relationship with god aka infinite intelligence, infinite love, infinite truth, infinite bliss. If you take some uneducated man with a totally average intelligence, who through only love deepens their relationship to god so far that they realize themselves to be one permanently that person is basically omniscient and yet you may mistake him as simple because their is no need for them to be otherwise, a thousand years of effort and your personal intelligence would still be dust by comparison. But being intelligent is fine just turn it towards god and away from division from others. The path of knowledge is nearly impossible isolated, some element of devotion or love is almost always needed or intelligence tends to get lost in itself. Set your intelligence upon realizing love and the path will be much sweeter. But you dont have to give up or lessen the value of intelligence or knowledge   

Edited September 29, 2019 by enderx7
getting to the point quicker

[Leo Gura]

That's a very good insight about your fear.

1 hour ago, Commodent said:

For each new insight, I feel like I'm growing and seeing things more clearly. So I feel like I can never get enough. The hunger is insatiable. But at the same time, there's this fear of not doing it. And that makes me wonder what lies on the other side. It could be growth, or it could be stagnation. It seems like I just have to take the plunge in order to find out.

But you must take it deeper. What is it about your identity which allows this fear to have any teeth at all for you?

Obviously you've somehow made intellect an significant part of your identity (of who you think you are). So you fear losing that sense of intellectual self.

Contemplate that. Try to get more clear about it.

And of course you know the ultimate solution here will be to surrender that intellectual self. You must bite the bullet that you will have no intellectual advantage over anyone else. At first you will resist accepting this because it will feel like a serious loss of meaning. You will feel like your life will become worse as a result. It will feel empty. But that emptiness is Truth. That emptiness is the True Self which you are avoiding. That emptiness leads to liberation.

Remember, a big part of waking up is surrendering meaning. Especially those things in life you find most meaningful, which for you probably means the meaning which comes with intellectual pursuits and knowledge acquisition. Notice that knowledge acquisition is a subtle form of greediness and materialism. Like the businessman hoards money the intellectual hoards ideas and insights.

Hoarding of ideas and insights must ultimately be surrendered to attain the final liberation. Because your truest Self is more empty and insubstantial than an insight or a piece of knowledge.

Of course don't make the mistake of demonizing or rejecting insight. Just don't build an identity out of it. That's all.

[Truth Addict]

I was intellectually and emotionally inferior my whole life, thinking that I'm superior. When I let go of that fear, I became actually superior 

What lies on the other side is freedom.

Edited September 28, 2019 by Truth Addict

[studentofthegame]

Perhaps you could benefit by examining your current state of balance in life.

The long walks, contemplation and journaling are all important parts of your journey, and perhaps this current fear you describe is an indicator of a tipping-point at which your balance is slightly out.

Are there areas of life you aren't committing enough time and resources to? If that is the case then that could be behind the mechanism of your fear communicating a message to you.

I am still struggling to commit myself to projects and habits that i desire to have in my life, so I speak from this perspective. When i suppress my plans (whether it's through distraction, procrastination etc.) and become unconscious / ignorant of them, i usually get the message via fear, low mood or similar.

Edited September 28, 2019 by studentofthegame

[Bas]

9 hours ago, Commodent said:

For each new insight, I feel like I'm growing and seeing things more clearly. So I feel like I can never get enough. The hunger is insatiable. But at the same time, there's this fear of not doing it. And that makes me wonder what lies on the other side. It could be growth, or it could be stagnation. It seems like I just have to take the plunge in order to find out.

Thanks for sharing, I can relate so much! The fear of not growing is very real for me. All these things I use.. contemplation, meditation, youtube, books, actualized.org, whatever. Letting go or surrendering is always slightly infected with the belief that something has to change about it to see it clearly, and often that I need some clever insight or technique to "clear the way" or something. Growth is happening like you say, it's candy. My life is improving and getting better, I feel like "getting closer", but that makes no sense at all.

Whatever truth I want to discover or I think I need to grow towards, I project in the future. It's just a sneaky way of confirming that it isn't here right now, but that can't be truth. I tell myself that, but it's just part of the ratrace, I don't embody that, deep down I don't know what that means. Writing it down is even tiring.

 

@Leo Gura Your recent Fear videos are GOLD <3 thank you thank you thank you

[Commodent]

7 hours ago, TrynaBeTurquoise said:

Nobody wants to be with a person that just spews their intellect all the time, saying things they might not be ready to understand themselves, they want someone who is empathetic and a great listener. A strong intellect won't hurt but its not the be all end all of providing value to others, far from it.

An that's the tricky thing. I feel like reflection helps me see things like that. That I might need to become more empathic or a better listener. And I feel addicted to that growth of seeing things more clearly.

7 hours ago, Serotoninluv said:

@Commodent Curiosity and creativity can also be motivations for contemplation and conceptualization.

In my case, it is. But when I stop doing it, fear hits. Why do I want to stop doing it when it's such a positive activity, one might ask? I feel like I can sense an unbalance, like @studentofthegame says. It's limiting my ability to live and enjoy life fully. More on that.

25 minutes ago, studentofthegame said:

Are there areas of life you aren't committing enough time and resources to?

Yes! I'm constantly gathering new information, organizing it in my mind. But I never actually do anything, besides schoolwork. I have like a thousand things I want to do, but I never actually get started. I guess I might be afraid of committing to the wrong thing. Which makes me feel like I need to think and reflect more.

As you said, contemplation and journaling is definitely something I need in my life, but I might be overdoing it. Thanks for the insight

7 hours ago, enderx7 said:

Your personal intelligence is meaningless when you can have a relationship with god aka infinite intelligence, infinite love, infinite truth, infinite bliss.

I am curious about this "infinite intelligence" people are talking about. I don't quite understand it, and I feel like I'm quite far from realizing it. Or maybe I do understand it, and I'm just making it grander than it really is. It's not the first time that I have been seeking something that I already have. It sounds intriguing at least, that's for sure.

7 hours ago, Leo Gura said:

Notice that knowledge acquisition is a subtle form of greediness and materialism. Like the businessman hoards money the intellectual hoards ideas and insights.

Haha YES! Never enough!

The intellectual pursuit really set in in the start of my teens when chronic depression kicked in and my humor faded away. So I began desperately seeking for a solution in order to find back my humor and light-heartedness, the only thing really that attracted people to me up to that point. So my entire teens I was desperately pursuing knowledge, like my survival depended on it, in the hope that I would find a solution that would help me return back to my funny, lighthearted old self that was loved and accepted. But during this entire pursuit I was really just running away from my depression and the fear of the losing my identity as a funny and socially accepted person. I was not really facing the real issue at hand, although I felt like it. The solution always remained far away in the distance.

Now, I have healed lots of my traumas and I feel like I'm at a much better place. Which has got me hooked, to the point where personal growth has become all-consuming. So I guess it's more an identity of always growing, wherein the intellectual identity seems tightly interconnected.

8 hours ago, Leo Gura said:

Because your truest Self is more empty and insubstantial than an insight or a piece of knowledge.

So insights won't help me get in touch with my true essence? More insights really won't help me get there quicker? That sounds very counter-intuitive, because I feel like what I'm doing is literally shedding away my delusions. What you say about surrendering meaning resonates a lot with me, so I will reflect more on that. Living a boring, stagnant, meaningless life sounds absolutely terrifying.

I might be really bad at showing it, but I really appreciate the work you're doing. Thanks for all the work you're doing in helping us move forward.

@Bas Yes, that is exactly what it is! A more "elevated" form of ratrace. It's a very sneaky thing indeed, distracting us from what we have right here, right now. Thank you for sharing your experiences, it's good to know one is not alone.

[Aeris]

11 hours ago, Commodent said:

I had this insight a couple of days ago after watching "How Fear Works" part 1, and I figured someone in here might relate so I'm going to share it.

I was walking my dog, reflecting like I usually do, and I came up with the thought of monitoring my micro-fears like Leo had suggested. I did that for a while, and then I put my attention on the activity that I was doing in the moment, which was reflecting. Don't get me wrong, I find it a rather pleasant activity, but I do it all. the. time. That is, unless I'm gathering new info. So I started wondering why I'm never really taking a break from it. Why am I so addicted to thinking and generating new insights? And then it hit me.

I have a strong fear of being surpassed intellectually. It's very real. I can even recall abandoning certain ideas for the sole reason of them becoming mainstream. I feel very calm and relaxed when I'm reflecting, and I enjoy the places where it takes me. I feel like I'm growing. But when I stop doing it, the fear hits. If I still the mind, I will not grow. And what will eventually happen when my understanding is not growing? People will surpass me intellectually. People will see things clearer than I do. And thus, my value in the world will diminish. I will have nothing to show for. I will become boring. Dull. Unineresting. No value. And most frighteningly, I will be stuck at the place where I'm at now. No new insights, no growth. Just ... nothing.

I feel good about sharing this with you. I feel like it might help some people. I feel valuable. But I would not have been able to share this with you hadn't it been for reflection. I would not have been where I am today without it, not even close. That's what makes it so hard. Because the rewards of reflection are so obvious. For each new insight, I feel like I'm growing and seeing things more clearly. So I feel like I can never get enough. The hunger is insatiable. But at the same time, there's this fear of not doing it. And that makes me wonder what lies on the other side. It could be growth, or it could be stagnation. It seems like I just have to take the plunge in order to find out.

Simple question, but do you create "art" / ? like drawing, music and this kind.

you'll be mindblown by the realisation while trying a "mastery" at art.

You'll see there is no insight to get ( there is, but no need to be "seeking" for it )

[Commodent]

@Aeris I've been wanting to get into art for a long time I feel like these are the things all this info gathering and reflection is distracting me from doing. Other things I would also enjoy, like art.

[Aeris]

4 minutes ago, Commodent said:

@Aeris I've been wanting to get into art for a long time I feel like these are the things all this info gathering and reflection is distracting me from doing. Other things I would also enjoy, like art.

Then stop that grab a pen.

You can still listen audiobook while drawing.

It needs paper

A Pen and a hand.

And no bs why It's not 'useful'

I put my head on the front that doing art will open your mind as hard as a psychédélic.

What makes the Line having sense.

+ Drawing is active méditation.

 

[Inliytened1]

 

Quote

Yes! I'm constantly gathering new information, organizing it in my mind. But I never actually do anything, besides schoolwork. I have like a thousand things I want to do, but I never actually get started. I guess I might be afraid of committing to the wrong thing. Which makes me feel like I need to think and reflect more.

 

Perhaps this is how this can actually be a trap for you...where as if you face this fear head on and overcome it you will no longer cling to it.   When you rest in Being, you are stilling the mind.   Stilling the mind is where you will find Truth.  By this we mean formlessness or nothingness.  Infinity.   But paradoxically infinity is not just emptiness but it is everything.  

When you become conscious of Truth you will relinquish your identity and with it your fears.   Ultimately, of course, you will come full circle because, you were in fact always Truth even in form.

You will go back to thought - to gathering thoughts and organizing them in your mind.  To reflecting.  But it will be different now.  You will have transcended your own identity.   You will be free of its clutches.   You can do these things but they won't enslave you.  Through this spiritual growth you can then self actualize to a much deeper level and find much deeper satisfaction from your reflections and from life itself.

 

Edited September 28, 2019 by Inliytened1

[Thewritersunion]

now what exactly are you curious about? why? do you do it for pleasure or to grow the consciousness of humanity or both?

good questions to ask

[Truth Addict]

@Commodent

Hey! I just remembered our first interaction here on the forum.

I sent you the link 

[Commodent]

21 hours ago, Aeris said:

Then stop that grab a pen.

Yesterday I was listening to some folk metal, and I felt inspired to draw a viking. So I sat down, drew a cartoonish-looking viking and considered myself done pretty quickly. I really enjoy the idea of unfolding myself creatively, but whenever I sit down to actually draw it feels really uncomfortable. It's like I'm forced to face my perfectionism. That is no excuse however. I'm gonna keep doing it and just face it.

@Inliytened1 Yes, I definitely want the freedom to not do these things. It feels like a form of addiction.

Another thing, I have tried very hard to still the mind before, and I kept doing it for maybe well over a year (through mindfulness). But it felt very forceful and it did not leave me feeling any good at all. Although I had suppressed the verbal thoughts I was still very much thinking under the surface. Nothing had really changed. So if I'm going to still the mind I want it to be an organic thing. I don't want to fight with myself anymore. So maybe I can find some enjoyable activity that will induce this stillness of mind. Drawing seems like a good candidate.

Thank you for your post, by the way. I liked it.

@Thewritersunion I'm curious about everything related to my life. Insights give me pleasure, because I know that I'm growing. The curious thing is that when I have become able to help myself through seeings things more clearly, I've begun feeling a rising urge to extend a helping hand to others. To people who might be in a similar situation that I were. That's something I also want to do, to write a book or something. Maybe even become a therapist.