Lucid Dreaming as a tool for Enlightenment?

[GreenWoods]

I have a question: Is it possible to exit a lucid dream and merge into the actual Godhead?

Obviously, you can have mystical experiences in lucid dreams. You can see that everything is the Self, can dissolve the dream scene into pure Light and have insights into Love, Consciousness, .... But all that is still produced by your mind, or God's mind, you are still dreaming and not at the very Source yet. If you take psychedelics in waking life you can 'exit' this reality and merge back into the actual Godhead/Source/Love/Nothingness. So is this also possible to do from a dream?

Actually it should be possible because this reality and dream reality are both equally an imagination by God. So it should be possible to exit both, right?

Perhaps you would just wake up?

What do you think?

 

[AlwaysBeNice]

I found setting a strong intention/prayer is good for lucid dream work, not just for becoming lucid, that doesn't really matter that much, and will become natural as you practice meditation/seld-enquiry/ada, but for going deeper into the dreams and letting go, facing fears.

Because fears/resistance is also what doesn't allow us to go as deep into the dreams or enlightenment.

That should also make dreams as intense and freeflowing as possible, up to a point where doing anything at all deliberately is kind of out of the question, because it's all happening rightly.

Sounds boring perhaps but it really isn't.

Makes dreams refreshing as well, al though sometime it's like Jesus Christ what was that, or not even sometimes, but always good benevolent dreams, if you see it's for letting go

[TrynaBeTurquoise]

9 hours ago, GreenWoods said:

I have a question: Is it possible to exit a lucid dream and merge into the actual Godhead?

Obviously, you can have mystical experiences in lucid dreams. You can see that everything is the Self, can dissolve the dream scene into pure Light and have insights into Love, Consciousness, .... But all that is still produced by your mind, or God's mind, you are still dreaming and not at the very Source yet. If you take psychedelics in waking life you can 'exit' this reality and merge back into the actual Godhead/Source/Love/Nothingness. So is this also possible to do from a dream?

Actually it should be possible because this reality and dream reality are both equally an imagination by God. So it should be possible to exit both, right?

Perhaps you would just wake up?

What do you think?

 

Some insight into your question

Around the 15:00 mark he starts telling about a dream where he consciously chose not to indulge in something exciting like sex but wanted to go deeper and get to the godhead/source of consciousness. 

[GreenWoods]

16 hours ago, TrynaBeTurquoise said:

Some insight into your question

Around the 15:00 mark he starts telling about a dream where he consciously chose not to indulge in something exciting like sex but wanted to go deeper and get to the godhead/source of consciousness. 

@TrynaBeTurquoise Thank you!

The critical part is around 18:50-19:05. Here he says that he goes beyond the body into Emptiness. Was this Emptiness still an imagination, a part of the dream or did he merge into the actual Emptiness? I tend towards that it was still in the dream, but ain't sure...

[GreenWoods]

@AlwaysBeNice  @seeking_brilliance  @mandyjw  Thanks for sharing 

[GreenWoods]

On 12/2/2019 at 11:03 AM, GreenWoods said:

I have a question: Is it possible to exit a lucid dream and merge into the actual Godhead?

Obviously, you can have mystical experiences in lucid dreams. You can see that everything is the Self, can dissolve the dream scene into pure Light and have insights into Love, Consciousness, .... But all that is still produced by your mind, or God's mind, you are still dreaming and not at the very Source yet. If you take psychedelics in waking life you can 'exit' this reality and merge back into the actual Godhead/Source/Love/Nothingness. So is this also possible to do from a dream?

Actually it should be possible because this reality and dream reality are both equally an imagination by God. So it should be possible to exit both, right?

Perhaps you would just wake up?

What do you think?

 

I gave it some more thoughts.

(Sleep yoga is about staying conscious during dreamless sleep. You are no longer conscious of the body, only awareness of awareness remains.)

So here is my new take:

1. What I called exiting the dream is probably the same thing as turning dream yoga into sleep yoga, thus becoming aware of awareness as awareness.  

2. There are no imagined mystical experiences. If you have an awakening inside a dream, then that's the actual thing, depending on how deep the awakening, it can't be considered happening inside a dream anymore. (This is my new assumption, I am not sure). That also means that LaBerge (the guy from the video) probably merged into the actual Emptiness.

I see two opportunities/options:

1. Sleep yoga. If you learn sleep yoga then you can abide in nondual awareness during the whole night. Usually, you achieve this by not losing awareness when the body falls asleep (but I don't think it's like WILD. Because with WILD you are still conscious of the body. And I doubt that all the lucid dreamers who can successfully WILD can stay aware during dreamless sleep). This usually takes years to achieve. An easier way to experience it is through lucid dreams. You dissolve everything till only awareness of awareness remains.  Or do it like Andrew Holecek. In the book Dream Yoga page 236, he says that it works best for him to "close my lucid dream eyes, hold my breath, and take the plunge through my dream ground". If you are very advanced, you can remain in this awareness the rest of the night, independent of REM or non-REM cycles.

2. So far, I only read about awareness of awareness during sleep yoga, which doesn't seem like a comprehensive awakening. Probably you can turn it to other directions too. But I would prefer this way: Instead of dissolving the dream first, just induce a facet of awakening first and then dissolve the dream. My assumption is, that at the beginning, this is still happening inside the dream (or rather you are perhaps 80% still in the dream and already 20% outside/beyond the dream), but if you go deep enough, you completely dissolve the dream and get to the pure and actual facet of awakening, beyond the dream. Here you can probably stay at the most till the REM cycle ends. But I believe you can extend this to the whole night if you are advanced.

[GreenWoods]

Forget about pada, I have found a technique that is way more powerful:

Pada works. I was doing it for about 10 weeks and had 14 lucid dreams that lasted on average 2 minutes and 5 lucid dreams with 7 seconds on average (perceived time). during most of the weeks I put all my attention on pada. It's way too much effort. 

Disadvantages of pada:

• you can only lucid dream during REM and only as long as the REM phase lasts.
• you have to be aware almost every minute of every day plus constantly be checking whether it's a dream (if you want frequent lucid dreams). This is very exhausting and boring. And it prevents you from doing other stuff effectively. It would take many many months till it could become effortless.
• pada leads to DILDs (dream induced lucid dreams) that means the lucid dreams will probably never be as stable, vivid, long and with as much dream control as a WILD (WILD is superior because you enter the dream with your full day-time consciousness). But all these things are very important if we want to use lucid dreams to have mystical experiences 

The other technique (the one in the link above) solves all these problems.

 

Edited December 19, 2019 by GreenWoods

[GreenWoods]

I wasn't sure whether OBEs are competitive with psychedelics, but now I'm very confident that everything you can reach with psychedelics, you can reach with OBEs as well.

Psychedelics are still superior because you can just take them, but if you want an alternative to psychedelics, then OBEs are probably your best bet. 

It will take a lot of practice but eventually it won't make a difference whether you plug 5meo or have an OBE and induce an awakening from that state. At least according to my current understanding.

Edited April 25, 2020 by GreenWoods

[ucan99]

Hello @GreenWoods, first of all thank you for your work. I have been thinking about lucid dreaming and sleep yoga. It looks like sleep yoga is a superset of lucid dreaming in the way that if you do sleep yoga you can also have lucid dreams, but I dont know which one is harder to do. Which one takes more time to do?

[peanutspathtotruth]

@Judi Just started reading a book about this topic which specifically talks about using lucid dreaming for enlightenment work (see the book thread). He says that indeed the dream consciousness is by definition still the ego consciousness, and that it's very important to be clear about that. 

But, with stable lucidity, you are in a situation where you're not only conscious but you also have full access to your subconscious mind. Spiritual practices in this state of consciousness are supposed to be much more potent than in normal waking consciousness. There's also a lot of potential for shadow work by confronting your subconscious. 

Edited January 20, 2021 by peanutspathtotruth

[GreenWoods]

@ucan99 Yes, when you do sleep yoga you can also have lucid dreams. In fact, all your dreams will be lucid.

Sleep yoga is much more difficult than having lucid dreams. If you are serious, lucid dreams can be achieved relatively easily:

• Do 5-10+ very short WBTBs every night
• Do 300-600 quick reality checks every day
• spend 45 minutes trying to remember and journelling your dreams, every day
• Experiment with MILD and DEILD
• apply many minor tricks and tips

 

After 2 weeks even a beginner should have many lucid dreams. Possibly, several every day.

Edited January 24, 2021 by GreenWoods