I don't understand homos

[Truth Addict]

I have no problem at all with other races, ethnicities, nationalities, religions, cultures, etc... Except with gender and sex preferences. (and more recently with highly intellectual people, but that's kind of irrelevant here).

I don't understand how homosexual people are normal people. I don't know if it's good for me to understand them right now because my society rejects them entirely, so it might be dangerous for me to think differently. And even though I already think differently, the people I interact with would call it just philosophy, but with sex preferences, it's a different matter. Sex and marriage are serious matters where I live, i.e. among Muslims.

I don't understand transsexuals, bisexuals, lesbians, gays, etc... I don't even know how many genders are there.

However, I can watch lesbian/bisexual female porn. But I can't watch gay porn at all, it disgusts me.

I haven't seriously thought about this until now. Some people say that it's just a defence mechanism that I don't accept homos, and that it means that I have inhibited homosexual tendencies. I don't think that is the case for me. But who knows? I could be wrong.

Edited September 26, 2019 by Truth Addict

[Emerald]

The negative reaction probably comes from it being a strong social taboo where you are. 

So, you've developed a resistance to it to protect yourself from social scorn or being conflated with a gay person. Or you could be seen as being in cahoots with gay people... which people would also likely frown upon.

If you've witnessed that people, who are not heterosexual, on the receiving end of harsh judgment all your life, you will adopt these harsh judgments inwardly and outwardly to avoid being on the chopping block yourself.

But it doesn't necessarily mean that you're gay. It also doesn't necessarily mean you're not. 

The fact of the matter is that you're in a blindspot, as the stakes are too high for you to do genuine inquiry into your own sexuality.  Because, 'What if you see something that can't be unseen? What if you aren't totally straight?' It will naturally make you ask the questions, "Will my family still love me? Will my friends still be my friends?" These are very high social stakes to be facing. Not to mention if it's against the law or you would be subjected to wider social scorn.

So, you're bound to have a lot of shame and shadows relative to sexuality. And it's of great benefit to you to be able to look at these parts of yourself squarely, regardless of consequence. It will really help you integrate and grow.

Also, you're probably okay with watching lesbian porn because you're attracted to women. Also, seeing lesbian porn doesn't make you have to face with any gray areas in your own sexual preference like gay porn would... which again, would mean social ostracism and lots of pain and rejection.

Also, to give my personal story, I am bi-sexual myself. And it took me a while as my society developed to see it as normal. When I was a kid, being gay/bi was still socially unacceptable to most people. So, I grew up with homophobic beliefs based on what I was taught and what my society accepted as normal.

It wasn't until I was in middle school that I came to be friends with quite a few people who were gay, lesbian, and bi. And from there, I recognized that it was pretty common and normal. It was like 10% of society at least, and I'm from quite a conservative area. So, the real gay people in my life replaced the imaginary gay caricatures in my head.

That said, because I am more attracted to men than women, it took me until I was like 20 to come to terms with my sexuality and admit to myself that I am bi-sexual. I was still fearing social judgment and scorn about it until then.

Also, to answer your inquiry about there being many gender delineations, I want you to picture gender as a scale. And the different gender names that people come up with are spots along that spectrum, that allow people that occupy less common spots along that spectrum to come together as a group to understand information about their gender and sexuality, which helps them know and accept themselves better.

 

 

[Bill W]

Maybe you don't need to. Maybe understanding homosexuality just isn't for you. Maybe you are not cut out to understand it. Understanding it might be beyond your capability. 

[Truth Addict]

@Emerald Thank you so much ? I'll try to figure out what I am.

@Bill W Maybe.

[Forestluv]

3 hours ago, Emerald said:

That said, because I am more attracted to men than women

@Emerald You suggest attraction along a spectrum. For example, someone identifying as bi-sexual may roughly say they are 60% along the spectrum toward attraction to men. Do you think we can also create some type of spectrum for "attraction"? For example, sometimes I feel an attraction toward transgender women. It has a sexual attraction component involving a form of femininity, yet I don't desire to have physical sex with them. Yet it's not like a friend attraction either. Maybe like an energetic form of sex. It's hard to explain. 

[DrewNows]

@Truth Addict Have you had many encounters with gay guys? (im curious) 

We fear what we don't know and what we don't know often becomes an image of what we believe to be true. I dare you to confront a gay guy and confess your hate or homophobia, ask if he would still be willing to have a short conversation with you so that you could see him as a person (and in actuality as you) and then learn to overcome this phobia you have unknowingly created 

Ever since i've gotten in touch with my feminine side, the heart, or emotional body i've developed more of a passive side and there was a gay guy who approached me in a grocery store; he came off as just a normal (straight) guy (what do ya know) lol and he was really friendly id given him my number before i even realized he might have actually been hitting on me. When he called me up later i was hardly able to talk, sort of distrusting and had so much disapproval that he wasn't able to get anything out of me.  Anyways I saw him again some months later and he started complimenting me again and asking how id been and this time i decided id at least have another convo with him to get this sorted out and i explained i wasn't gay but appreciated his compliments and he was still pushing asking if i'd ever considered stripping (like maybe he'd pay me personally to strip for him). I told him it wasn't anything i'd ever considered doing and just not something im currently interested in despite what easy money it could be lmao

[Key Elements]

@Truth Addict Let's say, for example, you met someone at your workplace who is very talented. He's about to quit and start his own business. He's very friendly. And, you knew about his interesting business cause he told you. You want to make friends with him and find out more so that maybe you could start your own business. You want to learn something from him. But then, what's keeping you from making friends with him is that you found out that he's gay because someone told you. In this case, what are you going to do? Are you going to stop yourself from making friends with him?

[Emerald]

1 hour ago, Serotoninluv said:

@Emerald You suggest attraction along a spectrum. For example, someone identifying as bi-sexual may roughly say they are 60% along the spectrum toward attraction to men. Do you think we can also create some type of spectrum for "attraction"? For example, sometimes I feel an attraction toward transgender women. It has a sexual attraction component involving a form of femininity, yet I don't desire to have physical sex with them. Yet it's not like a friend attraction either. Maybe like an energetic form of sex. It's hard to explain. 

Yes, I see attraction and gender both as being a spectrum. But really, both are more of a reflection of the masculine/feminine spectrum and are behaviors that are influenced by the Yin/Yang signature that we're imbued with. So, sexuality and gender are really just a couple of expressions of that overarching signature.

I suppose the way I would see being attracted to trans-women, it would depend on how much/little you personally perceived them as women without trying to.

You could be attracted to a trans-woman, and if your natural perception is that she's a woman, then it's no different than being attracted to a cis-gender woman. I still see that as fundamentally straight on the spectrum, because to you, she is a woman.

But if you are attracted to a trans-woman because you can see that she has male features and fundamentally see her as a man who looks like a woman and that combination of the masculine and feminine is the thing that turns you on, then I'd probably place that somewhere in the bi-sexual region on the attraction spectrum.

 

[pluto]

All forms of life have purpose in creation. Creation does not make mistakes.

[Truth Addict]

@Serotoninluv Why do you remove your posts?

@DrewNows I haven't met anyone at all who isn't straight, not even online. I don't think they're many anyway.

@Key Elements I can't answer the question because I don't know how I would react. Maybe if he can not sound so creepy as I was programmed to perceive. But anyway, it's highly unlikely to happen in my lifetime, because it's highly unlikely that I can move outside of where I live now, but who knows?

@pluto Yes, that includes my inability to understand other genders.

[Bas]

As a straight guy I think it's good to flirt with gay men, have fun, get intimate, kiss them passionately. They'll want to push you in having sex. If you're really straight you'll find out that doesn't turn you on, simple as that. When your dick doesn't grow when he strokes it then there's not much more to uncover.

If this disgusts you to even think about then your sexuality isn't grounded in the body. It doesn't mean you're gay necessarily, more likely sexuality is too much an idea you adopted from your culture and upbringing. 

 

[kira]

@Truth Addict  same could be said about terrorists

[Truth Addict]

@Emerald @DrewNows

Earlier today, I was talking with my little brother (20 years old) about this topic of homosexuality. He doesn't seem to share my problem. He is straight but he accepts that everyone can have their original/made preferences as long as that doesn't affect him.

So, as we were discussing my problem, I remembered that I had a traumatic event when I was 13-14 years old. I was invited to an older guy's (married to a woman and is nearly 40 years old) apartment to watch porn (I never watched any porn at that point), and so I naively went there, only to find him waiting for me completely naked. I remember how I freaked out and ran away as quickly as I could. The guy was a colleague at work (yes, I used to work since I was 12 years old). He left the job one week right after that incident. I think he was afraid that I would tell someone about it.

However, I never told anyone about that besides my brother, and that was like 4-5 months ago as part of our shared shadow work. I couldn't tell my parents as I knew they would shame and blame me and moralise to me and probably beat me up. I didn't tell anyone else about that incident until now, as it is so much unaccepted in my society.

That seems to be quite the reason for my homophobia. Waiting to hear from you guys about what you think. What's the next step?

Edited September 27, 2019 by Truth Addict

[Key Elements]

2 hours ago, Truth Addict said:

@Emerald @DrewNows

Earlier today, I was talking with my little brother (20 years old) about this topic of homosexuality. He doesn't seem to share my problem. He is straight but he accepts that everyone can have their original/made preferences as long as that doesn't affect him.

So, as we were discussing my problem, I remembered that I had a traumatic event when I was 13-14 years old. I was invited to an older guy's (married to a woman and is nearly 40 years old) apartment to watch porn (I never watched any porn at that point), and so I naively went there, only to find him waiting for me completely naked. I remember how I freaked out and ran away as quickly as I could. The guy was a colleague at work (yes, I used to work since I was 12 years old). He left the job one week right after that incident. I think he was afraid that I would tell someone about it.

However, I never told anyone about that besides my brother, and that was like 4-5 months ago as part of our shared shadow work. I couldn't tell my parents as I knew they would shame and blame me and moralise to me and probably beat me up. I didn't tell anyone else about that incident until now, as it is so much unaccepted in my society.

That seems to be quite the reason for my homophobia. Waiting to hear from you guys about what you think. What's the next step?

In all societies, there are always gays and other people with different sexual orientation. The reason why you may not hear it in your society is because it is very oppressed and hidden. For example, if you are actually gay, you would not risk telling anyone. Being a different sexual orientation, such as being gay, is hereditary. So, a little boy who is born gay may not fully understand that he's gay because society doesn't accept that. The society is saying, "Men are only attracted to women and vise versa, and nothing else exists beyond this." The boy may act out when he is growing up by going around kissing other boys in his school and not fully understand his behavior. He may likely end up marrying a woman, but he is only attracted to men. A gay guy is not attracted to women. He may end up secretly cheating on her with other gay men. Or, this behavior may come out in disturbing ways, like what happened to you when you were twelve. Part of the reason is due to a society banning and not accepting these things. The gays and LGBTs never got a chance to develop themselves or develop themselves with healthy boundaries. It's not just society that has a problem with not being educated and opened on these issues, but most of all, the parents and families.

[Emerald]

1 hour ago, Truth Addict said:

@Emerald @DrewNows

Earlier today, I was talking with my little brother (20 years old) about this topic of homosexuality. He doesn't seem to share my problem. He is straight but he accepts that everyone can have their original/made preferences as long as that doesn't affect him.

So, as we were discussing my problem, I remembered that I had a traumatic event when I was 13-14 years old. I was invited to an older guy's (married to a woman and is nearly 40 years old) apartment to watch porn (I never watched any porn at that point), and so I naively went there, only to find him waiting for me completely naked. I remember how I freaked out and ran away as quickly as I could. The guy was a colleague at work (yes, I used to work since I was 12 years old). He left the job one week right after that incident. I think he was afraid that I would tell someone about it.

However, I never told anyone about that besides my brother, and that was like 4-5 months ago as part of our shared shadow work. I couldn't tell my parents as I knew they would shame and blame me and moralise to me and probably beat me up. I didn't tell anyone else about that incident until now, as it is so much unaccepted in my society.

That seems to be quite the reason for my homophobia. Waiting to hear from you guys about what you think. What's the next step?

That does seem like it would be the reason to have that strong of an aversion.

What I recommend is trying to process through those traumas.

To understand this, you have to understand how trauma works. Basically, the trauma response that our mind/body does in response to an excessively stressful situation or event is to shut down the processing of those high intensity emotions through repression. So, our body and mind work together to create a resistance and blind-spot to things that trigger up that trauma.

That's what repression is. It's a protection mechanism. But it's only meant to be a temporary repression, until you're in a safe enough environment to go back and process those high intensity emotions.

So, your mind and body work together to give you thoughts in the mind and feelings in the body that keep you from facing the emotions put there during the original trauma. In this situation, it seems your mind has created judgments against gay people and your body as created feelings of aversion and disgust that come up when you think of male homosexuality. 

This makes perfect sense because it's your mind/body's way of keeping you from facing those traumatic emotions AND it keeps you avoiding gay people too. Now, most gay people wouldn't do that. But since you probably only know that guy who exhibited gay tendencies, he is your mind's only familiar association with gayness. So, to you, he is the only familiar symbol for "gay" and he is also the symbol for your trauma. So, your mind cuts out the middle man and equivocates gayness with trauma.

Now, this trauma response of shutting down, is a coping mechanism to keep us being able to live and survive after experiencing traumatic situations. But this response, though allowing us to be more resilient, is also quite problematic for us. It creates blindspots in consciousness and there can be a lot of repressed emotions. That's why it's important to process through the trauma eventually.

Now, the problem is that our mind/body has created protection mechanisms that keep us resistant to facing those traumatic emotions... and even unaware. So, the mind/body will trick you into getting derailed and not facing your emotions in that way.

This is where body-work practices come in. You can do body-scan meditation to bring more awareness to repressed feelings that are hiding in the body. You can also do various forms of yoga (tantra, kundalini, kriya, hatha, etc.). You can also do Tai Chi or Qi Gong. Or you can do the practices associated with exorcism. Or you can get reiki done. 

All of these practices are designed to do the same thing. And that's to process through the blockages in the body created by the mind/body's trauma response.

You can also get to know more gay people and make friends. That way, the man who caused your trauma isn't the only person you associate with gayness. That will help you face with aversions as you make friends with gay people, which helps with the processing. It will also help take the sting out of gayness as a symbol, allowing you to face those emotions with less distress.

Imagine that the concept of gayness is like the doorhandle that you need to turn to open the door on your repressed trauma. Right now, that door handle of gayness as a symbol is heated up so hot, that you can't even touch it without pulling your hand away. This stands in the way of being able to face what's behind the door. But if you get to know more gay people, it cools down gayness as a symbol and that door handle becomes easier to grasp and turn. As you become more comfortable with gay people, you can open the door much more easily because the initial sting of the symbol of gayness goes away.

[Forestluv]

16 hours ago, Emerald said:

I suppose the way I would see being attracted to trans-women, it would depend on how much/little you personally perceived them as women without trying to.

You could be attracted to a trans-woman, and if your natural perception is that she's a woman, then it's no different than being attracted to a cis-gender woman. I still see that as fundamentally straight on the spectrum, because to you, she is a woman.

But if you are attracted to a trans-woman because you can see that she has male features and fundamentally see her as a man who looks like a woman and that combination of the masculine and feminine is the thing that turns you on, then I'd probably place that somewhere in the bi-sexual region on the attraction spectrum.

I don't feel any attraction to trans-women that are transitioning and have still have male features. Only the ones that are fully transitioned and very feminine. It's like they are so feminine that they are willing to go to any effort to express their femininity, including facial feminization surgery. Yet I don't see the surgeries - I just see the feminine desire, energy and expression. If she still has a penis, I don't really see it a penis anymore. It's more like a feminine woman with a large clitoris. . . As well, there is something attractive about men with a lot of feminine energy, including some gay men. Yet I don't want to have physical sex with them. 

[Commodent]

1 hour ago, Truth Addict said:

I was invited to an older guy's (married to a woman and is nearly 40 years old) apartment to watch porn (I never watched any porn at that point), and so I naively went there, only to find him waiting for me completely naked.

Yes, your view on gay men will probably change upon resolving this trauma.

I remember when I was younger and watching porn, I would always be disgusted by the sight of a penis. To the point where I would only watch lesbian or solo girl porn. But in the past year or so upon healing lots of my traumas, I have become much, much more comfortable with male sexuality. Now I can actually look at classical statues of nude men and marvel their beauty. Sometimes, I can even feel tinges of attraction towards really attractive men. So it is definitely something that can change.

Now, I cannot remember having ever been exposed to any sexual trauma, but I know for a fact that my mother endured sexual abuse as a child and was afraid of men during my upbringing. So there's probably some transgenerational trauma involved.

[outlandish]

3 hours ago, Truth Addict said:

So, as we were discussing my problem, I remembered that I had a traumatic event when I was 13-14 years old. I was invited to an older guy's (married to a woman and is nearly 40 years old) apartment to watch porn (I never watched any porn at that point), and so I naively went there, only to find him waiting for me completely naked. I remember how I freaked out and ran away as quickly as I could. The guy was a colleague at work (yes, I used to work since I was 12 years old). He left the job one week right after that incident. I think he was afraid that I would tell someone about it.

However, I never told anyone about that besides my brother, and that was like 4-5 months ago as part of our shared shadow work. I couldn't tell my parents as I knew they would shame and blame me and moralise to me and probably beat me up. I didn't tell anyone else about that incident until now, as it is so much unaccepted in my society.

That seems to be quite the reason for my homophobia. Waiting to hear from you guys about what you think. What's the next step?

Wow that poor guy, probably so repressed that he ended up behaving completely inappropriately with you. I can definitely understand why that traumatized you. It's really crazy to me to imagine that your parents would potentially beat you up for telling them the story. You're lucky to have a cool brother you can confide in, I think that will be really helpful to get over it. Your brother sounds super cool.

You live in a society that really represses homosexuality, obviously. I think the next step is to try to understand how hard that must be for someone who is gay, and how that might result in acts of desperation like you describe. When you live in a society where homosexuality is open and accepted you find that these sorts of things don't really happen, because gays are free to find each other and form healthy relationships. It's just too bad your society isn't there yet. It takes people like you who are willing to grow and accept these different kinds of people that ends up slowly changing society.

At some point you will probably meet someone is gay, or who comes out to you as gay, and it will be a good opportunity to practice acceptance. It's ok to accept homosexuality, and not be homosexual. 

Most homophobia actually stems from people's fears of themselves being gay. Thats actually a really easy problem to solve - ask yourself, am I attracted to men? Once you really face that question and find the answer, the fear and the homophobia tend to melt away.

There's no reason you should feel like you ought to be able to watch gay porn or anything like that. It's not to your taste and that's fine. 

[Aeris]

23 hours ago, Bill W said:

Maybe you don't need to. Maybe understanding homosexuality just isn't for you. Maybe you are not cut out to understand it. Understanding it might be beyond your capability. 

or just "beyond you" !!!

___

I m straight, but I don't care if people are gay, that's too out far of what my mind is focused on.

the better question is what is life & reality, again & again 

[Angelite]

23 hours ago, pluto said:

All forms of life have purpose in creation. Creation does not make mistakes.

Creation does not make a mistake. 

It is when you try to change creations. 

Imagine a place where even the idea (of LGBTQ) didn't exist.

It is a social construct.