So many problems with Leo's vid, What is Love part 2.

[zeroISinfinity]

@Monkey-man Uf What wall of Text. 

Trust me I tought the very same when I started Being interested in God, religion and Spirituality. 

But 

Do Spiritual practises yourself. Truth is not else where. Truth is within YOU. Truth is Actual, real not philosophy or theology. 

Trust me everything Will be turned upside down and You Will be quite shocked when You become it fully and not only with it but with everything else. Whatever you beleived tought God/Reality actually is will be False. 

All the best on your path. 

Meditation is the way. 

Edited September 8, 2019 by zeroISinfinity

[Truth Addict]

These arguments that Leo is making are red herrings for you.

Cut right to the chase, or you will get nowhere.

Contemplate Love for yourself. Do the work.

[TheAvatarState]

@Ibn Sina literally all your objections are answered in the video. The whole video. Allow yourself to listen before coming here to complain about "problems" with it. 

[Nahm]

@Ibn Sina There’s no room in imperfection for perfection, and there’s no such thing as imperfection. Infinite can not know finite, and you can not forget, on purpose.  All is the only way it can be, just as you made it. Look for problems, look for beauty & love. Still up to you. 

[Jonac]

I must admit. In general I love the content but this episode was a hard one. And i even have watch the all thing (just watching for 25 min) 

[Neorez]

to live is to kill

[Pacific Sage]

16 hours ago, Monkey-man said:

1.  So the point of life is for awareness to overcome, to triumph over Infinite Being, through the use of language in its original form. 

2.  . Real purpose for humans is totally different, it has to do with language. 

Its well known that the way you employ a specific language can totally shape your reality, learn more languages and see through sophistication and limitations.

Since the language can shape ones reality it is a big limitation to the truth. 

16 hours ago, Monkey-man said:

Its ideology is about eliminating pain and maximizing good.

 

This is exactly what Leo is speaking as well. To eliminate to pain you need to know all the causation leading to the pain for which you would need a meta level perspective which can be gained through not taking it personally first (removing yourself from the situation) and analyzing it from a third person perspective. Once that is understood you can go about eliminating pain and maximizing good.

 

16 hours ago, Monkey-man said:

Because consciousness is what causes pain to Being, so Being hates Consciousness and wants to eliminate and dominate it. 

 

Being is quality level of consciousness. they are the same.

 

And BTW doesn't Islam mean surrender so if you truly surrender to any situation, you can find love anywhere.

[Aaron p]

@Ibn Sina first of all, congratulations you have not fallen into the trap of believing leo. Most people fall for the old "belief" trap.

However, an element of truth that you are missing, is in regards to what *defines* what is good and bad. What's throwing you off is, you believe good and evil are absolute. However this is not the case. 

You may say, "money is good, poverty is bad. Food is good, hunger is bad. Shelter is good, homeless is bad. Intelligence is good, ignorance is bad." Etc. And most people will agree with what youve said. But ask yourself, what is the defining factor as to whether something is classified as "good" or "evil." 

In the story of the garden of Eden, the tree that Adam and Eve ate from was called "the tree of the knowledge of good and evil." 

Leo said this, "There isint a book some place in the universe with all the bad things written in it and all the good things written in it." Before you ask me why God let's bad things happen, tell me...what makes something "bad"?

[allislove]

22 hours ago, Ibn Sina said:

Leo just says, 
Lions killing Antelope is love because it leads to we looking at sunset etc.
The greater good would be, Antelopes not dying on a daily basis, and Lions not having to kill Antelope. They living on their own happily. That would be the 'greater  good'. 

I agree with Ibn Sina, that would be a better design. 

[lennart]

22 hours ago, zeroISinfinity said:

Love is all That is. Literally, actually. 

In full TRUTH Leo is You but until That Day finally comes for You to realize this(donkey apocalypse ). 

Rest assure That This is the case. Everything is Love. 

Don't doubt God ever because You are only hurting yourself. 

Is this your current experience or do you just believe it?

[Ibn Sina]

1 hour ago, Aaron p said:

@Ibn Sina first of all, congratulations you have not fallen into the trap of believing leo. Most people fall for the old "belief" trap.

However, an element of truth that you are missing, is in regards to what *defines* what is good and bad. What's throwing you off is, you believe good and evil are absolute. However this is not the case. 

You may say, "money is good, poverty is bad. Food is good, hunger is bad. Shelter is good, homeless is bad. Intelligence is good, ignorance is bad." Etc. And most people will agree with what youve said. But ask yourself, what is the defining factor as to whether something is classified as "good" or "evil." 

In the story of the garden of Eden, the tree that Adam and Eve ate from was called "the tree of the knowledge of good and evil." 

Leo said this, "There isint a book some place in the universe with all the bad things written in it and all the good things written in it." Before you ask me why God let's bad things happen, tell me...what makes something "bad"?

- I know that Good and Bad is a complex topic. Philosophers have been discussing about it for over a thousand years, from the time of Aristotle, to Kant to Neitzsche to modern philosophy. The subject is called Ethics.
- I have almost no knowledge of Ethics.
- However, I have a basic concept of good and bad , which uptill now I have never met a person who has made me go "Oh, my conception of good and bad is wrong. There's more to it"
- Right off the bat, I conceive of  good and bad as relative. What is good may be bad for you what is bad for me may be good for you. It is relative.
- In Neitzche's genealogy of morals, what is good for the nobel people is bad for the slaves and what is good for the slaves is bad for the nobel people.  neitzche recognizes  there are 2 kinds of morality. Master morality and Slave morality.
- So morality is basically a function of survival. The mind labels good and bad according to what it  thinks it is good/beneficial for itself and bad/harmful for itself. It's a survival mechanism.
- But I also accept Leo's conception of 'greater good'. Which means, good for 'more people', the field of goodness expands,  what is best for the universe as a 'whole' that is the 'greater good' in Leo's conception which I understand and more or less think of it as valid. 
But again the question of whether 1 life is greater than 100 lives, is a never ceasing debate in philosophy. (The thought experiment, of - you had  a switch, a train is coming. One switch kills one person, another switch kills 100 people. Which switch would you press?) There are huge philosophy lectures where there is debate and good arguements for both side.
However, I kind of belief that it is better to save  the life of 100 people than 1 single individual. But it's just me. There are arguments to both side.
- So unlike you, I do think there is  a fixed 'good'. Good means that which creates happiness ( I kind of accept Utilitariansim of John Stuart Mill who had an IQ of 200). And if something creates happiness / benefit in the lives of 100s of people, than that thing is 'good'. If creates happiness for 1000s, then it is even better , it is Leo's 'greater good'. So good is not something that is very difficult to define. You can change my mind if you have sound arguments.

 

John Stuart Mill

John Stuart Mill was a 19th century political philosopher and member of the British parliament. As a student of philosopher Jeremy Bentham, Mill championed utilitarianism and criticized unlimited state control. His estimated IQ scores range from 180-200 by different measure
-The 40 smartest people of all time - Business Insider

Edited September 9, 2019 by Ibn Sina

[lennart]

17 hours ago, zeroISinfinity said:

@Monkey-man Uf What wall of Text. 

Trust me I tought the very same when I started Being interested in God, religion and Spirituality. 

But 

Do Spiritual practises yourself. Truth is not else where. Truth is within YOU. Truth is Actual, real not philosophy or theology. 

Trust me everything Will be turned upside down and You Will be quite shocked when You become it fully and not only with it but with everything else. Whatever you beleived tought God/Reality actually is will be False. 

All the best on your path. 

Meditation is the way. 

Meditation is not the only way. There are a lot of exercises. And also different people need different things at certain points in their life.

[pOnG]

@Ibn Sina whats wrong if leo is wrong?

(im not saying his right or wrong) 

Thats your logic sabotaging you 

Its better calm and be peaceful

 

Just let it go

And you will find the answer

or maybe not

But its ok

[Aaron p]

Fuck it. Here's the answer.

"Good" and "bad" are defined by what is good and bad for you (the ego). Money is good, only because it's good *for you*. Poverty is bad, only because it is bad *for you*. Death is bad, only because it's bad *for you*. 

 

So what would happen if you were to, say, disappear. The knowledge of good and evil would also disappear. Good and bad are contingent on your ego. Why would death be bad, if there is no "you" to die? Or why would poverty be bad, if there is literally no "you" to be poor. And enlightenment is of course the realisation that "you" are an illusion, and therefore good and bad are also an illusion. 

[Aaron p]

Good and bad are like water and fire, both need to exist in harmony simultaneously to create an equilibrium in reality. You think you hate evil so much..."evil" is necessary.

Would you go to the cinema and buy a ticket for $7 to watch a movie in which there is no bad guy? And no robbers, or thieves? Where this really really powerful superhero sits and chills out, eating Cheetos and watching Netflix all day..? An hour and a half movie about this superhero relaxing and enjoying all of his *good* stuff in life. After all, all you seem to like is good. The truth is, you crave evil...you need something to fight against, otherwise you have no sense of purpose. 

I guarantee you, you would get up and leave after 20 minutes of watching a movie that has no evil. You'd be so bored. You evil bastard haha ?

Edited September 9, 2019 by Aaron p

[Scholar]

I can only recommend to stop viewing Good and Bad as attributes of other things, and instead view them as their own dimensions of consciousness. In my view ethics is greatly delusional in that it simply deludes reality into something it is not. The ego deliberately confused different states of being so as to create it's own narrative. Goodness and Badness must be viewed for what they are, not be confused to be part of something that they are not.

 

Again, I can only repeat. The only thing that is Good is Goodness itself. There can be no other thing that is Good. Now you must only closely observe Goodness. Once you see it for what it is, you will not be able to call anything good or bad. It will be absurd, it will be clearly delusional to you. It will be as delusional as saying 1=2.

 

Notice that when you die, there will be neither Good nor Bad. Both of them will cease to exist. They are both impermanent. One day all life in this universe will cease, the structure that holds together time and space will fade away. All of it will fade into nothingness, including Good and Evil. Even if there was Good and Evil, it would be completely irrevelant, as the end state is always the same, a dissolving into Nothingness. When there will be noone left to judge what was Good and Bad, what will it have mattered how much Good or Bad have happened before they ceased to exist?

 

Again, Death is the great equalizer. In the eyes of Nothingness, all is the same, all is equally fragile.

Edited September 9, 2019 by Scholar