Are Ayahuasca and Peyote also good for Liberation and oneness

[Schahin]

I am curious to know this, i had one experience with 5 Meo Dmt but it was very frightening even if it in the longterm definitely stilled my mind. 

Buy I am eager to finish this but in a much more gentle way. Just wanted to know if peyote and ayahuasca lead to the same realization of oneness and nothingness or if they lead to more illusions, maybe in combination with food fasting and meditation. 

What I an concerned of is people say after a 5 Meo experience every other tool or medicine will lead you to that same experience. 

So me having had the experience of losing my mind, could another psychedelic just lead me to that Bardo state again or will it be alright

Edited August 15, 2019 by Schahin

[Shadowraix]

Always wanted to try peyote. People have told me mescaline in general feels like a much more gentle teacher.

Ayahuasca is DMT based so it can be quite intense, but should be a lot easier than smoking it. (Which is beyond comprehension intense)

Every psychedelic could have a potential to make you feel insane, but set and setting as well as a good mindset can alleviate a lot of issues. I'd only recommend 5-MeO generally to more experienced users. More traditional psychs can lead to the deep insights you seek. I had my first ego death on lsd!

Do your research on mescaline, I think it might be a good first time for you, if you can extract it. Eating the cactus/powder/tea can have varying amounts and the plant matter is nausea inducing.

[SunnyNewDay]

I would be very careful with ayahuasca. I regret drinking ayahuasca and should of started with something much more loving and calming. I fooled myself into thinking it was something I could handle and make me feel better but I have been pulling myself back together for six weeks after doing 4 ceremonies. I can't really beat myself up for that though because from the research I had done at the time it felt like it was the right choice. It has triggered a massive amount of psychotic problems, ocd, mood swings and paranoia in me recently where I started to believe delusional stories about myself and all sort of crazy stuff even a month after taking it like I was back in the terror trip which happened during the final ceremony. I've also found who you do it with can have a major impact and the people there aren't necessarily equipped to help you handle what comes up. I felt really abandoned and misunderstood by some of the people at the retreat and while I think they are good people and their intentions are to help I don't think a lot of these retreats are equipped to deal with everything that comes up. Talking about it in therapy has helped clear this up and integrate what has happened and released a lot of stuff and bring back clarity to my thinking and who I feel I am. If you have any history with mental illness (especially to do with manic/obsessive overthinking) of any sort I'd be careful taking ayahuasca. I'd say it's for mentally strong people with a high degree of self love for themselves and others and with experience tripping on psychedelics. I was not this going into the ceremonies.

[Schahin]

I have two experiences with ayahuasca, indeed it gives you terror, it is not calm it is quite harsh, you need to gain control over the experience by your breath. 

I do not know if it is for everyone similar, but the first time I just let the visions take control over me and I was in total confusion, the second time I knew I had to solely meditate concentrate on my breath and let go of the fear. Did you do it this way? Enjoy the experience, when it gets too much concentrate on breathingfor a bit, do meditation and let go

 

Edited August 16, 2019 by Schahin

[TrynaBeTurquoise]

Fear is just a label of an emotional energy. If fear comes up during a psychedelic, don't label it as "fear" and as "bad". Let the emotional energy be as it is and it will pass, just like the feeling of euphoria on it will pass, if you resist the emotion because you label it as "fear" and think "I shouldnt be afraid" then it is going to stick and become a bigger issue. These are medicines that give you growth, if fear is needed for you to grow then it will give you fear, you have to surrender to the present moment. 

[Esoteric]

I have done both peyote and ayahuasca ceremonies. Don't go in thinking ayahuasca will be gentler. It can be quite harsh at times. Ayahuasca is something you can't describe really. It can be so different each time. Like a completely different journey each time. You don't know what you are going to get with aya. 

Peyote is very grounding. You feel present in your body and it is much more smooth. I prefer Ayahuasca as it is more mystical and unpredictible, at the same time full of love and gives you lessons on what you need to work on.

[Mercurio3]

Why do you need Ayahuasca having the possibility of just smoking pure N,N-DMT? Far deeper, profound and much more gentle. If you have a good vaporization technique (something like VaporGenie Sherlock, not a common crystal pipe) and surrender completely to the experience, yes, you can get to see God. I did in my first time. But it’s very rare mainly due to poor vaporization and burning the molecule.

[seeking_brilliance]

I have San pedro cactus and read about making chips out of it, but haven't tried.  A little worried about intensity. I would only be able to use it around my husband if it is similar to Marijuana...in other words if I can still function and not lose my mind. Does anyone have any experience with san pedro and the effects of mescaline? 

[seeking_brilliance]

@Esoteric

Even though you say mescaline is more gentle, is it something that I can take for insights but not trip out of my mind?  Just a low dose I guess? 

[Esoteric]

3 hours ago, seeking_brilliance said:

@Esoteric

Even though you say mescaline is more gentle, is it something that I can take for insights but not trip out of my mind?  Just a low dose I guess? 

@seeking_brilliance I have only been to one Wachuma/San Pedro ceremony. So a Shaman dosed it for me and I think he gave me a lot. 2 big scoops, whatever that tells you. I'd say a low dose would work for you, you should look it up on Erowid. Though I vomited a lot, but that was after she (two Shamans were present) shot up Rapé tobacco in me, but I was definitely nauseus before, so it can cause nausea. But I don't understand why you'd only be able to use it around your husband if it is close to marijuana? They are not really comparable. 

[seeking_brilliance]

1 hour ago, Esoteric said:

@seeking_brilliance I have only been to one Wachuma/San Pedro ceremony. So a Shaman dosed it for me and I think he gave me a lot. 2 big scoops, whatever that tells you. I'd say a low dose would work for you, you should look it up on Erowid. Though I vomited a lot, but that was after she (two Shamans were present) shot up Rapé tobacco in me, but I was definitely nauseus before, so it can cause nausea. But I don't understand why you'd only be able to use it around your husband if it is close to marijuana? They are not really comparable. 

Not like Marijuana in effects but just able to keep my wits about me, is what I meant. I want a psychoactive effect without tripping balls

 

[Esoteric]

@seeking_brilliance Then a low dose of LSD or mushrooms will be fine aswell. 

Edited August 16, 2019 by Esoteric

[seeking_brilliance]

46 minutes ago, Esoteric said:

@seeking_brilliance Then a low dose of LSD or mushrooms will be fine aswell. 

That's good to know. I'm sure mushrooms will be legal here eventually.. Just have these cactuses but always too nervous to try it 

[Esoteric]

@seeking_brilliance Ah right. Well do you know how to extract mescaline? I have very little knowledge about it but from what I understand they need to have grown for several years before it is worth extracting mescaline. But yeah, mescaline seems very good for getting aquainted with psychedelics. It made me feel absolutely amazing.

[seeking_brilliance]

22 minutes ago, Esoteric said:

@seeking_brilliance Ah right. Well do you know how to extract mescaline? I have very little knowledge about it but from what I understand they need to have grown for several years before it is worth extracting mescaline. But yeah, mescaline seems very good for getting aquainted with psychedelics. It made me feel absolutely amazing.

Yeah I could chop it up and make a tea, which is nauseating.  I've also read a tek where you can cut them into slivers and put them in the oven to make chips. But these recipes aren't the easiest to understand dosage. The chips are supposed to be less nauseating. I even wondered what a dehydrater would do

[Esoteric]

@seeking_brilliance Alright, good luck if you decide to try it, you will probably have a wonderful time

[Kensho]

On 8/15/2019 at 8:11 PM, Schahin said:

What I an concerned of is people say after a 5 Meo experience every other tool or medicine will lead you to that same experience. 

On 8/15/2019 at 8:11 PM, Schahin said:

 

In my experiecne, 5-MeO-DMT in the form of Bufo Alvarius did not have an impact on my later trips with ayahuasca and shrooms. Bufo alvarius for me was like a psychedelic nuclear bomb compared to ayahuasca. I don't see how ayahuasca could give that kind of experience. 

[Schahin]

1 hour ago, Kensho said:

In my experiecne, 5-MeO-DMT in the form of Bufo Alvarius did not have an impact on my later trips with ayahuasca and shrooms. Bufo alvarius for me was like a psychedelic nuclear bomb compared to ayahuasca. I don't see how ayahuasca could give that kind of experience. 

So you mean with your later Ayahuasca trips you did not get back to the ultimate state you had with Bufo alvarius?

[outlandish]

Eat San Pedro/Peruvian Torch and not Peyote. Peyote is critically endangered and should no longer be harvested from the wild for consumption non-indigenous people. So, unless you know specifically that the Peyote has been cultivated, opt for the San Pedro, otherwise you're just contributing to Peyote's demise.

San Pedro grows quickly and easily, isn't at all threatened, and delivers the same mescaline experience. 

Yes ayahuasca and mescaline cacti are well known to be good for liberation and oneness  They won't point as directly to the ultimate primordial nondual experience, but that can be a good thing too.

Peyote is such a beautiful plant!

 

[Kensho]

10 minutes ago, Schahin said:

So you mean with your later Ayahuasca trips you did not get back to the ultimate state you had with Bufo alvarius?

No. The ayahuasca trips continue to be typical ayahuasca trips, with each one having its unique characteristics of course. 

With Bufo Alvarius I had my first ego-death, but my first ayahuasca ego-death came after many sessions, so I don't consider it as an after-effect of Bufo Alvarius. I 've read stories about people who had their trips changed or intensified after 5-MeO-DMT but that was not my case.