can't fall asleep after 5meo bad trip, it's been 4 days please help

[khalifa]

@Aaron p  before 5meo i used to meditate 15minutes a day, i didn't care about self inquiry it didn't interest me did not resonate after some sessions of it.

 

I used to do an hour a day at times, sometimes up to 4 hours those were rare, i could feel a bliss like state when i did it for that long and it used to last for like a day, happy for no reason

 

some of my dosage spilled out during the injection phase, not sure how much i took in to be honest it has been a year

 

 

@seeking_brilliance  it's not that easy. the energy is just unpleasantness, i no longer leave my body these days, i just feel off uncomfortable

 

@ivory  whenever i do that,  i feel like my heart just hurts therefore i stopped trying so hard against it

Edited August 14, 2020 by khalifa

[Aaron p]

@khalifa you have to be careful with these things man. Don't inject that shit. I perceive that you have had problems with drugs in the past and that you aren't serious about awakening. Develop your mind bro, and weigh your dose of tested 5meo carefully with precision scales. Slowly up your dose with a calm mind, a clean room and an authentic devotion. DEVOTION

[Ry4n]

Dying can be an unbelievably painful experience that I think deserves more compassion in this community. 

[Lyubov]

On 8/13/2020 at 3:17 PM, khalifa said:

I've reached out to martin had an hour and a half conversation with him.

He suggested that i go through his book and educate myself about 5meo and going for another trip, to allow the energy to complete itself this time.

Apparently he's had a guy similar to my case where he was suffering up to 5 years, He vaped and let go and felt much better, the process was done within minutes.

This sounds too good to be true for me, What do i have to lose.. Uh.. I guess I'm already suffering so i may give it a try again, I'm already traumatized enough by it and now i have to go for another one. Shit.. Argh.. I have a bad feeling about this

I'm really desperate though.

 

 

 

 

Yup. He said same thing to me as well. It brings up stuff and if it isn't let go completely it can linger and result in what we call PTSD. I've been in a very similar situation as you where I was suffering for months after a really scary trip with sleep problems and all that. 

To be honest if someone hasn't been through such an experience or unless they have a specialization working with people who have been then they have no business in commenting or giving advice on these situations. 

I was able to ground out most of mine by talking about the experience with an integration therapist from MAPS as well as using some marijuana lightly in personal ceremonies to get used to the fear-trauma response the body falls into. Eventually I just got tired and used to that intense fear that comes up and was able to release a lot of this energy. I was super gentle with myself and I realized having a very solid foundation is crucial for grounding it out and releasing the traums. Surround your elf with people/family you trust and feel safe around, maje sure you are living in a place you feel safe and secure in. If everything is chaotic around you it's really hard to ground this stuff out. 

I've recovered a ton from mine after a long time of suffering and my sleep problems are gone now so I know you can recover too. If you don't feel safe doing 5meo again you can always try MDMA therapy. I would not do it alone but work with an experienced facilitator therapist. I also would not do 5meo alone again but with a private trained facilitator. I would also find someone to talk to who has done it before who offers helping people who have had bad trips 

Check out MAPS integration therapists 

Edited August 14, 2020 by Lyubov

[Tetcher]

So after one year you still have PTSD after that experience? That's harsh..

It really makes me wonder how beneficial 5-meo-dmt really is. Most influential eulogists for this drugs are Leo Gura and Martin Ball, they sell it as the ultimate drug for awakening yet both of them suffer the aggravation of their ailment (that they claim existed most of their life), it also grew their arrogance to an ugly level.

It's so easy for Martin to tell you to double down on 5-meo-dmt to solve a traumatic issue that was caused by 5-meo-dmt in the first place, but at the peak of his sleeping issue he had to post a public apology to all the people he hurt with his arrogance, he should have taken his own advice and faced his sleeping issue with more 5-meo-dmt but instead he went for the slow and progressive healing of his condition for more than a year now. After such an episode he should show more humility and acknowledge that he ultimately doesn't know whether more 5meo-dmt will hurt or heal you, he's an interesting point of view but still just a point of view.

[RedLine]

I am sorry for you.

Looks like you have a lot of fear/resistance to the Absolute (to death) and that's is where your problems are coming from. You decided to cross a line and you want to go back but you can't... 

[sidaz10]

did you try plug meo ?

[khalifa]

@sidaz10

only my first time, have not tried to again, I'm too fearful that i may lose my mind

[Aaron p]

@khalifa bro can I ask you one question...do you experience a full body orgasm or anything like that when you consume 5meo?

Edited August 18, 2020 by Aaron p

[khalifa]

@Aaron p  no blissful sensations, only lots of terror feel like i'm about to die forever and there is no going back, my natural surviving instincts is to breath like crazy and freak out,  i think if i were to be more calm and if i let go/trust in that energy state, it would've been differently, thing is i had shit foundation about the breathing and postures on how to handle and let go of it

 

i've just read martin's book, and i understand where i went wrong because what i did was far from optimal, i should've just trusted my body to breath normally without trying to over-excert it to forcefully breath to stay alive for hours, but then again it was my bad, i didn't even take it seriously not even respect what it means to actually die using 5meo, then again i don't think can be any preparation that can get one ready for it, but i think being aware of how ego might try to control the experience and noticing it can help calm it down as a rebirth instead of pure death, then again i'm not sure any assurance can be heard by the ego mind at such a terrifying state of mind when it realizes it is dying temporarily, but it feels like that death is permanent at that moment.

Edited August 18, 2020 by khalifa

[Grateful Dead]

uf that sounds terrifying

did you post something on reddit recently?

and sorry if you answered that before but have you dont any other psychedelics before that experience?

[Nahm]

@khalifa

How’s everything other than psychedelics and nonduality going my man? How’s you’re life purpose, job, career, hobbies, relationships, etc? 

[khalifa]

@Nahm  life purpose is half assed, online zoom classes have made things very easy for me for the past 2 semesters, i've missed a lot of classes, but i am able to catch up due to just re-watch recordings whenever i want to, i'm lucky because of the covid-19, i'd probably fail if it weren't, but then again, i do want to leave home back then it felt more grounding to leave and run away from home, since home was very scary back then, my room would always remind me of death, atleast now it's not so bad, but i still have fear of long nights when i look at my bed, i go like oh no not again, last night i've been able to be more calm then usual, i had a re-activation but i was able to process it much better instead of freaking out when it happened, surprisingly it was quite easy, it felt neutral, not good or bad, it did feel good at some point, but my hand hurt and i had to move it, that's when the activation just stopped, it felt much weaker then it used to be atleast, so it was easier to deal with, maybe i'm ready to face another trip, but i'm not sure if i want to

now that i think about it, i don't really have a strong life purpose and i'm ok with that as i've been trying to figure that out for quite awhile, right now i'm pretty much neutral, i did find something that suits me though, so it isn't so bad

as for hobbies, for days where i sleep terribly, i don't feel like engaging in them since i feel brain dead reaction time wise, like gaming for example or even watching stuff

relationships, i'm not doing well, i'm mostly a loner but that's normal i guess

 

 

@acidgoofy  no other experience besides the ibogaine

[Nahm]

@khalifa

What if it turned out sleep was the furthest thing from something to fear, but more relaxation, peace, love? Any perspectives about sleep, life, yourself, that would then not hold up anymore so to speak?

 

[Vittorio]

On 10.8.2019 at 0:18 PM, mandyjw said:

I had a strong natural awakening and couldn't sleep for between one and two weeks. Don't worry, it will pass so try to accept the situation fully. This goes against other advice here but one thing that made it worse is because I was also naturally fasting which intensified the energy in my case. If you eat carbs before bed, they make you drowsy and sleepy. Might help a little in the meantime. 

Are you still getting meaningful dreams and realizations? 

Accepting the situation is exactly the kind of suggestion I would give you too.

I read you are saying you weren't ready.

Well, you were indeed.

Otherwise you never would have tried the substance in the first place.

[khalifa]

@Nahm

I will always find something to complain about, before all of this it used to be tinnitus, but i still had lots of well being over all compared to after doing 5meo, I will be honest i am improving but it still quite doesn't feel as normal as it used to be, I cling to the baseline health i used to have.
Something feels very off, life feels strange now, worrisome, but it does feel like i'll appreciate life even more when i do make it back to that baseline, I do still appreciate life more even now as i've been to depths that i can't explain how awful those first months were. But it's a rollercoaster.

 

 

@Vittorio I'll have to agree with you. I wanted something new i was bored with mundane life, I wanted to see what's all this hype people are talking about all this 5meo infinity. My ego bought in, Didn't like what it saw, is trying to run away now ironically. I would like to taste some blissful tastes though, It does sound nice on paper, but do i really need it? Don't think so, I mean we'll all taste infinity once we actually physically die. So i guess there is no rush in doing it again.

[Arzack]

Even Martin Ball in his last video said that integration isn't needed if the trip is long enough to go from pain to bliss. This is why I advocate for (big doses of) LSD/mushrooms, or plugged 5-meo (which last longer) in my subreddit (see my sign.).

Yet I didn't find the balls yet to try it so I'm not sure if you'd have "reactivations" with this method. I'm also not sure if there is a clear demarcation (difference) between reactivations and PTSD from short bad trips.

Anyway it's a tough game for most people, even if you don't have PTSD and reactivations, you're supposed to keep dosing regularly until permanent nirvana is achieved. It's a paradox how easy it is "physically" to drop a bunch of tabs, and how difficult it is in reality if you know what you're getting yourself into.

[khalifa]

@Arzack  high doses will take the body longer to recover, months to years, i wouldn't recommend it but everyone's different

[Nahm]

2 hours ago, khalifa said:

I will always find something to complain about

Why? Anything you’re getting out of it? A benefit?

2 hours ago, khalifa said:

Something feels very off, life feels strange now, worrisome, but it does feel like i'll appreciate life even more when

Is the complaining equaling the worrisome feeling? What about appreciating life more by forgetting about the baseline?

[khalifa]

@Nahm

Perhaps my complaining comes from lack of health and/or satisfaction of life, no benefit to be honest, just wishing for a better state of being or dream, i'd like to try a body with no health issues some day, When i was younger, I used to have that but i didn't really realize it's value, until i've lost parts of it. At least i learned to appreciate better but i still long for what's lost.  I know lazy thinking. But then again most young kids wouldn't realize how blessed they are, hey i'm probably still blessed, it can be way worse right.. I still have a somewhat functional body compared to my ibogaine trip where i felt like i was a 90 year old man that could barely move around, and would be instantly exhausted just by moving my hand or leg. It was quite stressful, When i compare myself with that moment, i seem to have all sorts of gold around me especially this body that can still do so much. Although the afterglow appreciation doesn't last as long. I remember being so happy after my ibogaine trip.

 

Complaining is feels different, worrisome is just me not feeling good and feeling like i have no control over my experience and it just plain sucks when i keep overthinking about it, probably amplifying it when i could just let go and be present with what is, i realize this, but it's hard to actually do, it's simple to talk about it though. Perhaps a bad learned habit. I do have days where it is automatic.

 

>What about appreciating life more by forgetting about the baseline?

Sure these come by sometimes, they feel way better to be honest, I should do that more often