Higher taxation of the rich, backfires.

[Bodigger]

1 hour ago, SFRL said:

Trump becoming president will make him and his clan a lot of money, now and in the long run. 

Clan?

[Leo Gura]

Trump's wealth is fake. So unlike real billionaires, he probably actually needs the money to stay afloat.

Trump is constantly losing money so he always needs new infusions.

He lost $400 million of daddy's money.

All his money is made from his brand name. So running for President was just a PR stunt to up his brand name.

[Quicksilver]

On 09/08/2019 at 4:40 PM, Bodigger said:

Please explain redistribution.

Is this the Robin Hood theory?

Tax the rich in theory always becomes tax the middle class in practice.

Because the government implementing the taxation can easily be corrupted by the real rich to not tax them. 

Closing the loopholes and insuring the tax money is properly used is the real challenge, not "taxing the rich" 

 

[Leo Gura]

On 8/9/2019 at 10:03 PM, Keyhole said:

I think if we tax the rich a lot of them will move away to countries that do not tax.

No they won't. This is a myth.

The US used to have a 75%+ tax rate for rich people.

You cannot currently move away from IRS taxation. If you are a US citizen even if you move overseas you still owe the IRS money. You can't just do a bunch of business in the US while living offshore as a citizen and not pay taxes.

Not to mention that most desirable countries have fairly high taxes.

[SunnyNewDay]

We need to work our way slowly out of the commercial system. Do we even need money or to be as reliant on it in a more advanced system? Nope not nearly as much. We can and will do this over time but I hope the future generations don't suffer as much as imagined said due to climate change but I also don't want to put my head in the sand. I think climate issues will be very humbling and make us more caring and less money driven.

[Yog]

18 hours ago, Keyhole said:

I think if we tax the rich a lot of them will move away to countries that do not tax.
Not saying that we shouldn't, just throwing that out there.
 

The place I live in, is a sinkhole for these things, people from all over Europe come and open companies here just to dodge high taxes. In a way it is beneficial, it helps the economy, people get employed. In another exploitation can happen . People are cheap, and taxes are low, its a goldmine.

Also the previous government used exactly this to lure foreign companies to invest in here.
People stay in the US, Denmark, UK, Netherlands ,their legal stuff and the employees are here, they visit from time to time.

People are quite reactive to taxing, rich or not. That's for sure. Maybe its a good idea to give them some other benefits to make it feel like a fair play instead of a robbery.

EG: We tax you ass heavily, and for those money you get government discounts and benefits all over the board, witch are way more worthwhile than you holding onto that not-needed money. if you direct you products in "this way", grants, financially cover holidays, employee  benefits like  gym, trainers, healthcare, provide you constant advice. Also a choice and direction where their huge tax money go. EG: 10 km of wind turbines for wind energy. Just speaking off my mind.

 

Edited August 10, 2019 by Yog

[Shadowraix]

@Yog Say the taxes go to making society healthier. This can only reduce company responsibilities for employees since the gov covers it and it increases spending elsewhere. 

If you aren't in the medical industry price gouging for example, healthier people who can spend elsewhere is something you want. 

This would certainly cover if not reduce the tax impact no? 

Edited August 11, 2019 by Shadowraix

[Dwarniel]

This is just simply not true. I think you would benefit from studying socialist countries. I live in one up north in Scandinavia. I'm middle class and I tax 40% of everything i earn. I'm not sure how much the richest tax, but its a looooot. If you talk to them about how they feel about it, most of them will answer that they're happy to tax. Because we know that if something happens to us, or our loved ones, lets say... They need a complicated spinal surgery after an accident... The bill is going to be zero. If someone has a mental breakdown, they are going to be hospitalized and taken care of, for free. If you want to study, you'll get payed for it! That's where the tax money goes, and here everyone is proud of our society and the good it does. We love being a part of it.

It doesn't backfire - it does the complete opposite. It gets everyone the same opportunity to have success in life. And if you're too ill to contribute, or have had a crippeling accident - We are happy to share our money to support you. Because that's what we do in a loving, just, society. We take care of eachother. If someone doesn't like the idea of high taxation here in Norway, they're going to be viewed as greedy and selfish. 

I hope this is the future for conservative countries as well. It would make your living standards so much higher. 

[Dwarniel]

On 6.8.2019 at 2:54 PM, Yog said:

-Jesus: The poor will be with us always.
 

Yeah, we have poor people here as well. The difference is, because of high taxation, our poor people gets an appartment and money for food every month. They don't get enough in my opinion, but its better than living on the street and dying from lack of food/shelter or crime

[Aeris]

3 minutes ago, Dwarniel said:

Yeah, we have poor people here as well. The difference is, because of high taxation, our poor people gets an appartment and money for food every month. They don't get enough in my opinion, but its better than living on the street and dying from lack of food/shelter or crime

On 10/08/2019 at 7:03 AM, Keyhole said:

 

I wish to be poor in Norway. It means to be Richer than the average French worker 

Edited August 11, 2019 by Aeris

[Dwarniel]

3 minutes ago, Aeris said:

I wish to be poor in Norway. It means to be Richer than the average French worker 

Are you serious? ? Like, is it bad? Could you share a bit about how it is? 

[Aeris]

15 minutes ago, Dwarniel said:

Are you serious? ? Like, is it bad? Could you share a bit about how it is? 

France is great but you just got enough monney to live in the basement of your parent and eating pasta everyday. 

Forget the car totaly.

There is help like in Norway. But you cannot live alone if you got no work.

And there is no work. Unless you like doing dishes wash in restaurant for 50% more than the current welfare.

You got 500€ not working. 1000€ working. (35h x 4 per month )

Means when you poor. People call you out for not working.

Mental illness doesn't exist for the French people. ( In the collective subconscious this is not a point. Doesn't exist )

But the system is close.

The welfare is more charity than a true help. And working sounds stupid when you get only the amount of 2 welfare. ( 1000€ is the average salary of more than 50% of the society )

Most vacation will be in a tente while taking a flixbus lel

 

 

Edited August 11, 2019 by Aeris

[Shadowraix]

@Dwarniel I look up to the scandanavian countries for how giving and caring they are. I hope to one day explore their culture ?

[Dwarniel]

5 minutes ago, Aeris said:

France is great but you just got enough monney to live in the basement of your parent and eating pasta everyday. 

Forget the car totaly.

There is help like in Norway. But you cannot live alone if you got no work.

And there is no work. Unless you like doing dishes wash in restaurant for 50% more than the current welfare.

You got 500€ not working. 1000€ working. (35h x 4 per month )

Means when you poor. People call you out for not working.

Mental illness doesn't exist for the French people. ( In the collective subconscious this is not a point. Doesn't exist )

But the system is close.

The welfare is more charity than a true help. And working sounds stupid when you get only the amount of 2 welfare. ( 1000€ is the average salary of more than 50% of the society )

Most vacation will be in a tente while taking a flixbus lel

5 minutes ago, Aeris said:

 

Wooow, i had no idea! How's the taxation situation in France? 

[Dwarniel]

4 minutes ago, Shadowraix said:

@Dwarniel I look up to the scandanavian countries for how giving and caring they are. I hope to one day explore their culture ?

You should come visit! It's really beautiful nature as well, perfect for vacation. If you travel to the north of norway/sweden/finland (or iceland) in winter you'll see the nothern lights as well if you haven't seen that before. Sososo beautiful 

[Chi_]

@Dwarniel How's the Tax and Insurance situation there? Like how much of your salary goes to the government and for insurances per month? 

 

I have hiked and camped in Norway a couple of times and I was in awe with the country the whole time

[Dwarniel]

8 minutes ago, Chi_ said:

@Dwarniel How's the Tax and Insurance situation there? Like how much of your salary goes to the government and for insurances per month? 

 

I have hiked and camped in Norway a couple of times and I was in awe with the country the whole time

I pay 40% of my salary in tax, and i don't really have insurance ?  I only pay like 15usd a month just in case the apartment burns down, then i'll get all of my belongings replaced. 

I would probably pay more if i had a car, its really high taxation on cars in Oslo. They want the cars out of the city, to create a green city. They put a lot of money into roads for bikes, electric busses, electric rent a car and so on

[Aeris]

10 minutes ago, Dwarniel said:

Wooow, i had no idea! How's the taxation situation in France? 

Not on salary. Mostly objects.

Welfare mainly : 485€ a month. Taking bus for 30 min - mostly 2€ and (0.25€ is taxed on it) 1.75€ without taxes.

Most objects are taxed.

Look tabacco would cost 11€ in France and in Germany 6€. ( But this one is very taxed for whatever reason )

A 20m² of house in a city like Strasbourg would cost 400-500€ a month ( an help of 150€ is provided though ) so let's say 300€ for one room/kitchen + toilet/shower.

There is food help for really poor poor in the street for 'hobo/tramp'. 

I don't know really for them just talking what I know and expérienced.

Taxation is that every action is taxed.

Your salary ain't taxed before 1600€ a month. 

If you got 36000€ a year you pay 10551€ for instance.

But all social heal is mostly pay when you're citizen ( dental and prob cancer ). 85% is pay by the system.

Maximum assurance cost ~150€ a year for 100%. All drugs.... ( Shitty ) are pay. We handle everyone Xanax and codéine instead of fixing mind and body. ( Mum knows )

[Aeris]

6 minutes ago, Dwarniel said:

I pay 40% of my salary in tax, and i don't really have insurance ?  I only pay like 15usd a month just in case the apartment burns down, then i'll get all of my belongings replaced. 

I would probably pay more if i had a car, its really high taxation on cars in Oslo. They want the cars out of the city, to create a green city. They put a lot of money into roads for bikes, electric busses, electric rent a car and so on

Sounds nice that everything is without car though. Is it expensive to get a driver licence ? Here It's like 1500-3000€ to get it

[Dwarniel]

9 minutes ago, Aeris said:

Sounds nice that everything is without car though. Is it expensive to get a driver licence ? Here It's like 1500-3000€ to get it

I think it's like 3000, not completely sure,I don't have one. Don't need it 

Thank you for sharing about the situation in france, i learned a lot 

Edited August 11, 2019 by Dwarniel