Are all gurus a scam?

[tatsumaru]

Why is that people like Sadhguru keep making claims about how it is possible to do epic changes like change your genes, cure any disease, manifest bodies of goddesses, go into different dimensions but at the end of the day it's just talking. The same guru that has the power to change their genes needs donations to save the forests, the same guru that can cure any disease is balding or aging, the same guru who can manifest goddesses can't manifest the trees he's looking to plant. Where are the buddhas with the holographic dharmakaya, where are the immortal taoists flying in the clouds, where are the awakened ones who are omniscient and omnipotent and can give the answer to any questions there is and solve any problem there is? Where are the vivekanandas who can read a 700 page book in an instant by just touching it? I keep hearing about these magical stories but they aren't to be seen anywhere. It seems like it's just a scam and even though spirituality tells us we are infinite beings and gods and bla bla bla, my experience shows that we are incredibly limited beings to the point that it's actually doubtful if we can even do anything. It looks like we are walking corpses who are the slaves of this reality and the only thing we can do is to rest in awareness as a sort of sanctuary while life carves us and devours us and then kills us in some brutal way. Where are these magics I am asking? Is there anyone at all that can prove what they are talking is true? Is there anyone who can walk the walk? I'm doubtful... I will be happy to accept once I see it or experience it but no one is there to show me.

[Aakash]

The answer to all questions, is love through being. creation is itself an ongoing process, so in the future, what we will expect to be not possible now, will only be common sense in the future. 

Edited August 4, 2019 by Aakash

[tatsumaru]

7 minutes ago, Aakash said:

The answer to all questions, is love through being. creation is itself an ongoing process, so in the future, what we will expect to be not possible now, will only be common sense in the future. 

Sorry, but this is not at all relevant to the question I am posing.
Also it's just a fancy way of saying - creation unfolds slowly and is time dependent.
If anything has changed in our society so far its because of science and technology it's not because of gurus learning to manifest more powerfully. There isn't a single guru who can manifest anything as far as I am concerned. In fact if spiritual legends are to be trusted there were way more buddhas and magicians back in the time of the buddha. I don't mean to be cynical but there's simply no evidence that anything of what you are saying is true. Sounds like wishful thinking.

Edited August 4, 2019 by tatsumaru

[zeroISinfinity]

How it is when you are not God. 

Letting go of how it is not to be God. 

Profit. 

Lost in perceivables. Option 1

Droping perceivables. Option 2

Edited August 4, 2019 by zeroISinfinity

[Aakash]

@tatsumaru that's it my friend  so how can you know for sure, what's possible and what's not when creation itself is infinite and doesn't need materialism to create. It can imagine anything into being- such as healing its own leg. It just takes time to get to that development. 

Would a caveman know how to use an iphone, no because it's not cognitively developed enough. But do you know how to yes? 

so its the same relativity 

you are a cave man to the mystics. and they are telling you its possible. You still won't believe it. Just like the cavemen will eat the iphone thinking its food and then slit your throat in the process while your trying to tell it. 

Sound familiar ? just like your trying to slit the throats of mystics with your knowledge of how the world works

Edited August 4, 2019 by Aakash

[Aakash]

@zeroISinfinity you still dont get it, percievable is awareness. awareness is god's way of understanding its own self. Because awareness is itself dualistic to formless. even though we call it formless itself, its actually form. We've got it backwards LOL. Enlightenment is basically a samadhi state, that can never touch god, but can give the illusion of itself as god, which is the highest truth possible. made out of love, for the sake of loving its own self

Edited August 4, 2019 by Aakash

[tatsumaru]

4 minutes ago, zeroISinfinity said:

How it is when you are not God. 

Letting go of how it is not to be God. 

Profit. 

Lost in perceivables. Option 1

Droping perceivables. Option 2

Show me how it is when you are God. Are you just resting in your awareness escaping from the mystery of phenomenon or are you in control?

4 minutes ago, Aakash said:

@tatsumaru that's it my friend  so how can you know for sure, what's possible and what's not when creation itself is infinite and doesn't need materialism to create. It can imagine anything into being- such as healing its own leg. It just takes time to get to that development. 

Would a caveman know how to use an iphone, no because it's not cognitively developed enough. But do you know how to yes? 

so its the same relativity 

you are a cave man to the mystics. and they are telling you its possible. You still won't believe it. Just like the cavemen will eat the iphone thinking its food and then slit your throat in the process while your trying to tell it. 

Sound familiar ? just like your trying to slit the throats of mystics with your knowledge of how the world works

I do not make any claims as to what is possible and what isn't. Other people are making those claims and don't have anything to show for it. You seem to be making them as well. You claim it can imagine healing its own leg. Is this in your experience or is it just a belief? Show me that it is possible. Naropa healed his whole body after he jumped from a cliff hundreds of years ago, so it doesn't seem to have anything to do with time.
 

6 minutes ago, Aakash said:

You still won't believe it

I am not interested in belief systems and religions.

[zeroISinfinity]

Nature in general. Best guru. 

DogGuru Best guru.

Human gurus, lost in self created stories and concepts. 

Self agenda, Their worldview and perspective pushed onto others. 

Very rarelly fully awoke. Covert Narcissism. 

Good way to Exploit humans and their pure desire that comes from Source for Truth. 

Let devils dance with each other and Exploit one another. 

Zerosum. Wolves and sheeps.

Rupert Spira is cool. 

 

Edited August 4, 2019 by zeroISinfinity

[tatsumaru]

1 minute ago, zeroISinfinity said:

Nature in general. Best guru. 

DogGuru Best guru.

Human gurus, lost in self created stories and concepts. 

Self agenda, Their worldview and perspective pushed onto others. 

Very rarelly fully awoke. Covert Narcissism. 

Good way to Exploit humans and their pure desire that comes from Source for Truth. 

Let devils dance with each other and Exploit one another. 

Zerosum. Wolves and sheeps.

 

If observing nature is the best path, then what is the difference between science and spirituality?

[Aakash]

2 minutes ago, tatsumaru said:

I do not make any claims as to what is possible and what isn't. Other people are making those claims and don't have anything to show for it. You seem to be making them as well. You claim it can imagine healing its own leg. Is this in your experience or is it just a belief? Show me that it is possible. Naropa healed his whole body after he jumped from a cliff hundreds of years ago, so it doesn't seem to have anything to do with time.

you must understand what absolute infinity means first, i can not show you because i do not have that much consciousness 

but i can say that its possible yes. 

This is the best answer your going to get from anyone and the same answer your getting from gurus, the proof is in being not in seeing it. 

[Aakash]

6 minutes ago, zeroISinfinity said:

Nature in general. Best guru. 

DogGuru Best guru.

Human gurus, lost in self created stories and concepts. 

Self agenda, Their worldview and perspective pushed onto others. 

Very rarelly fully awoke. Covert Narcissism. 

Good way to Exploit humans and their pure desire that comes from Source for Truth. 

Let devils dance with each other and Exploit one another. 

Zerosum. Wolves and sheeps.

Lol this is said from a position of devilry and ignorance. its no difference to what @tatsumaru is saying about mystics. You as god are no different to a human being. Absolute infinity is even beyond. Being ignorant of god is itself delivery. 

Edited August 4, 2019 by Aakash

[zeroISinfinity]

No I am not saying this. Practises wakes you up and your own wisdom in Discerning what teachings to follow. 

Compare this 2 for example. One is exploitative narcissists and 2nd fully awoke. 

[Aakash]

@zeroISinfinity ehhh but i'm more awake than Leo, you should be worshiping me  BOW TO ME NOW! the prince of hell is the one true king  

Just like you should be worshipping me  instead of worshipping nahm. 

like the title says, guru's are scams ahahah

Edited August 4, 2019 by Aakash

[wavydude]

@zeroISinfinity nice riddle

53 minutes ago, tatsumaru said:

Where are the buddhas with the holographic dharmakaya, where are the immortal taoists flying in the clouds, where are the awakened ones who are omniscient and omnipotent

well probably not on this forum 

53 minutes ago, tatsumaru said:

my experience shows that we are incredibly limited beings to the point that it's actually doubtful if we can even do anything

Thats you're experience and I assume you recognize experience can change, I also assume you realized that no matter what someone else tell you, you can never be 100% sure if the're elightenend or whatever becouse that is their's experience. So you got two options here: 
1. Work to experience these states you are talking about yourself.

2. Forget about it.

[zeroISinfinity]

Good show. 

Yeah sure if you are "novice", you could learn new concepts that Will bring you closer to Truth. But maximum from Gurus you can get is development of spiritual ego. 

What real Guru should lead you is to transcend it not to keep you stuck in it. 

When you get your samadhi you Will realize your Guru is literally you. So Will you Kiss his ass? 

And if you are fully realized Will you allow worship of your ass? 

Of course not. 

[Aakash]

@zeroISinfinity intentions are very different from surface value  but if you want to worship me, i will shower you with devilry on unheard levels  

Edited August 4, 2019 by Aakash

[Inliytened1]

@wavydude that was a good response.

@tatsumaru yes you should be skeptical.. But at the same time curious and open minded.  Have you had an awakening experience that reveals the nature of all of reality being pure consciousness yet?  Because once you realize via direct experience that reality is fundamentally mystical, all kinds of new doors open to you.   The materialist paradigm dissolves.  

If one is still stuck in the materialist paradigm than these things are not going to be remotely possible to them.

Edited August 4, 2019 by Inliytened1

[zeroISinfinity]

I am not saying there is no value in listening to Gurus. 

There is, some show you your blind spots. Things you overlooked. 

For example Leo's episode of Responsibility, never ever even crossed to my mind. 

Some of his points are so true and spot on. With 100% accuracy. 

[AlldayLoop]

https://www.actualized.org/insights/tapping-into-collective-consciousness

[zeroISinfinity]

Listen people like @Nahm

Ponder questions. 

What is Your perspective on Reality?How you see it and how you want it to be?

What do you want? 

This questions are far more powerful then any talk about God or Whatever else. 

You can only wake up yourself. 

More powerful then going to ashram and serving and worshipping your guru. Oh wow he is so wise he knows more then me while you are Truth entire time. 

 

Edited August 4, 2019 by zeroISinfinity