Enlightenment Inquiry

[zasa joey]

If the awareness is constant, I mean the perceiver where is it when we are asleep, why isn,t it aware of the state of sleep? I mean deep sleep. 

[zasa joey]

Also in his earlier enlightenment videos leo said, that this is a reality in which there are only perceptions, and he said that perception doesnt need perciever to be percieved. he said that we are all the sensations, and experiences, and etc. basically reality, and now he says we are the perceiver of it all, and that isn,t an experience, a thing. like wtf? which one is it. maybe in later videos he will say something else about our true nature

[Natasha]

@zasa joey My take in a nutshell is that perciever IS perception, like it's all one substance manifesting itself. 

And the first part of your question - when we're in a deep sleep and our brain is 'turned off', that doesn't mean there's no awareness. And remember, it's the EMPTY awareness Leo's talking about, where no thought, feeling or any other possible mind activity cab be present.

[zasa joey]

@Natasha so why the hell should i be happy about finding my own existential nature? how can i feel peace and fulfillment? like i already know that when i die, i will end up like i was before i was born, absolute emptiness, empty awareness. Finding out that I am "that" isnt much soothing, its more depressing for me!

[Natasha]

@zasa joey Self realization would actually make your life more liberated and meaningful. You'd be able to separate the lie of your conditioned mind from the truth of reality. You'll appreciate and value life more, from the simple position of just being, existing. It will also help you rid yourself from different neuroses, like fear (of emptiness being the biggest one of all), guilt, neediness, etc. It's a process that will take some effort on your part, ego will resist changes. But more you press on, further you'll advance, and more beautiful and joyful life will become. There will be no death to be afraid of. And you'll get that enduring peace that transcends all understanding   

[zasa joey]

@Natasha I wish it was true, but why does that all seem like a wishful thinking and unreal? I really want to put my mind around this, but i just cant get dedication, im too sceptical, i started strong determination sittings, i was doing it for one week and then i quit. oh man. now i have watched this neti neti method two times and im doing that guided meditation a lot on my own, but i dont know. Like once again as leo said i am nothingness that is self-aware, im not self-aware when my body is asleep. I just cant grasp it.

[Natasha]

@zasa joey Check out Ayla's thread in self-Actualized Journals forum called 'Mind Attacks After Initial Seeing'. She describes how the ego tries to make you doubt and undermine the process, and the steps to get yourself back on track. 

[Natasha]

@zasa joey

 

[zasa joey]

@Natasha thank you

[Joyboy]

There are very few people still have consciousness in deep sleep, they're on the high level of enlightenment I presume.

[zasa joey]

@7oo13ad but what does that have to do with enlightenment? consciusness is self-aware, it should be self-aware during sleep, its not like something else is aware of consciousness right?

[Joyboy]

When you are in deep sleep it is exactly the same when you die. If you still have consciousness, I would say you are immortal. Enlightment is when you are realize that you are Nothingess has self-aware.

That's why 90% of enlightment people leave their body when they realized that, said Sadhdguru. 

[Huz]

@zasa joey There is no point asking about it because you won't understand it via language. You need to do the work and experience it, and it will become evident

[zasa joey]

@7oo13ad and isn't it so? doesn't leo say that nothingness is eternal, it cannot die, so in a sense it turns out that im immortal, but why the fuck do i want immortality if i cant experience anything? how am i immortal than?

[Joyboy]

Yes that Nothingness is eternal and you can't experience anything until you are AWAKE (enlightened). Else you gonna sleep forever again when you die, just like before you were born.

[zasa joey]

@7oo13ad wait a sec. are you saying that when i become enlightened, then im going to experience nothingness even after my death?

[SkyPanther]

4 minutes ago, zasa joey said:

@7oo13ad and isn't it so? doesn't leo say that nothingness is eternal, it cannot die, so in a sense it turns out that im immortal, but why the fuck do i want immortality if i cant experience anything? how am i immortal than?

"You" are not eternal.  Consciousness is. "You" are not consciousness.   When Leo says consciousness is internal he means existence, because both are dependent on each other.

You require memory to remember events.  Consciousness is just awareness of "now" without memory.  If you can hold on to conciousness via meditation, you can be aware of "now" while sleeping. Otherwise your brain stops recording memory and rests.  And you lose the connection awareness. 

[Joyboy]

You are not exprience nothingness, you are the Nothingness. And I said IF you are enlightened, you may still have consciousness after you die, no one know for sure because there's no way to communiate and no one know what after death  

Like I said above there are very few people still have consciousness in deep sleep.

[Huz]

what this issue with is this is that you are infesting your mind with theories and believes. Its a lot harder to get to an experience by creating a map of enlightenment and its easier for your ego to mask the experience - meaning that you might not even believe it happened after. If you have an experience your ego will probably mask it with language: "is this eternal, is this nothingness , is this it, is this what i am looking for etc". Be careful , just do the work. I am saying this because this happens with me a lot. As a scientific/rational thinker I have built a model on enlightenment in my head. I wish i never did and it hinders you practice.

Edited May 4, 2016 by Huz88

[zasa joey]

@SkyPanther  I am not the self-aware nothingness? is that what you say? than what am i?