Leo. Suffering.

[Forestluv]

23 hours ago, Truth Addict said:

To say that something is either true or false is just to add a layer of belief upon reality which, to me, is unnecessary. I believe that true vs. false is. . . 

 

[Truth Addict]

@Serotoninluv

Saying that this or that is true or false is pointless unless it's put in a relative context.

In a non-dual consciousness, these concepts don't make sense.

I hope that helps.

@Nahm Okay, just a suggestion, breathe from the stomach and contemplate what I said. You may be able to see it, if you want to.

[Forestluv]

@Truth Addict I’m not disagreeing with you. I was pointing to something else I noticed. 

“To say that something is either true or false is just to add a layer of belief upon reality which, to me, is unnecessary. I believe that true vs. false is. . . “

It’s such a sneaky squirrel ? 

[Truth Addict]

@Serotoninluv I see.

Believing is another matter. I acknowledge my beliefs as just beliefs, neither true or false. Saying that a belief is true or false is just adding another layer of belief upon the original belief. Saying that a belief is true/false is a groundless assumption. Holding beliefs does not contradict being in a nondual consciousness as long as they're seen for what they are.

[Forestluv]

19 minutes ago, Truth Addict said:

I acknowledge my beliefs as just beliefs, neither true or false. 

This gets really sneaky. The ego says “my beliefs are neither true nor false”, then speaks about them as if they were true. There can be a subtle attachment and identification. One exercise is to hold the opposite belief and see if it feels the same way. For example:

“I acknowledge my beliefs as either true or false. Saying that a belief is true/false is not a groundless assumption.”

Does this feel different to you? If so there may be underlying attachments/identification to a belief. Essentially that the belief has truth to it. Intellectually saying “My beliefs are neither true or false”, does not cut to this deeper level. 

Another exercise is to see if a belief can be let go of as easily as the mind can let go of bird chirps that pass by.

There is a deeper level to attachment/identification to the relative as absolute than the intellectual level.

[Truth Addict]

@Serotoninluv

What are you trying to say with quoting me?

[Forestluv]

6 minutes ago, Truth Addict said:

@Serotoninluv

What are you trying to say with quoting me?

I updated the post

[Nahm]

Direct experience is always king.

[Truth Addict]

@Serotoninluv

Yeah, I see. And thank you, really. That's another approach for the same insight.

I find my approach to be free from thinking and free from strange-loops.

For example, if I said: the earth is round is a true statement. There would be a ton of thinking included to explain that claim, and then to say that it is true, I would have to prove that the attached belief of truthfulness is true, and then I would have to prove that once again as well to infinity, which leads to a strange-loop.

The same process goes for a claim that is described as false.

So much thinking included (which I've grown tired of).

Whereas, if I stepped back and just observed the situation, I would be able to detach from it and become free from its consequences. That's what I'm advocating here.

So, in the end, both of our approaches will lead to the same conclusion, which is that everything that is, is true, and that nothing ever is false. But I still prefer my approach.

Edited July 31, 2019 by Truth Addict

[Truth Addict]

5 minutes ago, Nahm said:

Direct experience is always king.

Belief is always queen.

?

[Nahm]

@Truth Addict ??? Love ya!

[Truth Addict]

2 minutes ago, Nahm said:

@Truth Addict ??? Love ya!

??

[Forestluv]

@Truth Addict I don’t disagree with what you are saying. I’m getting at something different. I get the sense that below the conscious intellect, there is a belief what is thought here is true (regardless of whether the mind consciously thinks “what I believe is neither true or false”). Yet, I could be wrong. Perhaps it’s stimulating something in me I can introspect.

I can say “What I just wrote above is neither true or false”. Yet at a deeper level, do I really believe that? It can be quite subtle and sneaky. To be honest, there is some type of energy that believes what I wrote above is true, even though I intellectually understand it is neither true or false.

It’s like peeling the layers of an onion.

[Nahm]

@Serotoninluv ?

[Forestluv]

Just now, Nahm said:

@Serotoninluv ?

Unsure of what teary face means here

[Truth Addict]

6 minutes ago, Serotoninluv said:

@Truth Addict I get the sense that below the conscious intellect, you believe what you are thinking is true (regardless of whether the mind consciously thinks “what I believe is neither true or false”). Yet, I could be wrong.

You're not completely wrong. I believe/know (from direct experience) that whatever I think/believe becomes true. How do I know? Because I said so, and I am the master of my reality. How do I know? Because I said so.. To infinity ?

That is a conscious conclusion that I've come to realise.

@Nahm Why are you crying?

Edited July 31, 2019 by Truth Addict

[Forestluv]

3 minutes ago, Truth Addict said:

You're not completely wrong. I believe/know (from direct experience) that whatever I think/believe becomes true. How do I know? Because I said so, and I am the master of my reality. How do I know? Because I said so.. To infinity ?

That is a conscious conclusion that I've come to realise.

? 

[Nahm]

@Serotoninluv Like when you ‘peel the onion’...tears.

[Aakash]

@Serotoninluv you can not escape relativity my friend. 

What were the foundations of what you said based on for saying the things you said ? 

Edit: basically what Nahm said

ill say this because I doubt many people going to read the thread and your Coral and I particularly love coral people. 

I’ll tell you the real absolute truth. THE REAL ONE. I don’t like saying it because I like Leo. But I like how you decided to be coral aswell and genuinely like truth. 

so I’ll sacrifice my like of actualised.org to tell YOU seratoninluv the absolute truth. 

The absolute truth is “all TRUTH is relative” 

 

Edited July 31, 2019 by Aakash

[Forestluv]

1 minute ago, Aakash said:

@Serotoninluv 

What were the foundations of what you said based on for saying the things you said ? 

I don’t know and I’m not too interested in making up a story about it right now.

Did you watch the Spira video Gil linked today? Some good stuff in there.