Consciousness existing apart from the brain?

[Inliytened1]

7 hours ago, Truth Addict said:

@Kushu2000

Consciousness is occurring inside/dependent on the brain, and the brain is occurring inside/dependent on consciousness. You can't separate the two. They're one and the same. Form is identical to formlessness.

How is this even possible? I don't know. Ask God.

Consciousness really isn't inside the brain the brain is consciousness.  

[Kushu2000]

@Inliytened1ive heard that before.. this thread was a result of my critical thinking. 

[Truth Addict]

6 minutes ago, Inliytened1 said:

Consciousness really isn't inside the brain the brain is consciousness.  

Yeah, you're not taking the relative into account.

Truth includes the relative. Non-duality includes duality.

Edited July 28, 2019 by Truth Addict

[Inliytened1]

11 minutes ago, Truth Addict said:

Yeah, you're not taking the relative into account.

Truth includes the relative. Non-duality includes duality.

7 hours ago, Truth Addict said:

 

 

Thanks for the reminder  but what i mean is even in duality that's not the case..form is essentially nothing.  But if you mean relative to a materialist then yes i get you. 

 

 

[Truth Addict]

10 minutes ago, Inliytened1 said:

But if you mean relative to a materialist then yes i get you.

Now we're talking! How else is nonduality going to resonate with materilists?

[Inliytened1]

7 hours ago, possibilities said:

@Kushu2000 Haha if I was administrator I’d just ban all low quality posters and prosletysers. I’m a lot more strict in this sense than Leo though haha. They truly can’t comprehend that they’re just projecting though, this is why after all Leo makes videos in the ways that he does. It’s a form of personal indoctrination, taking the high ground, which is a tough thing to escape if you believe yourself to be acting as a “teacher”. When one is a teacher, especially when they classify themselves as such and haven’t been asked by others, the latter being a more sensible endeavour, they are not being students of life, in this sense they are charlatans. All sense of superiority beyond mere logical deduction is illusory, and this is where all teaching stands when they have not been asked.

And yes, I see lots of “teachers” on this forum and not enough simple discussion among human beings where there’s a sincere attempt towards mutual learning.

What you are doing here is saying that all spiritual teachers - Adyashanti, Sadghuru, Leo and many others are prosletyzers...when it has been beaten over the head to you that Truth is not a belief - and when a spiritual teacher explains Truth, such as for example the Absolute Truth of the nature of reality and tells you not to take it as dogma that they are all proselytizing.    

If someone here is teaching when they shouldn't be - trust me they will be weeded out and banned.  I have seen it happen here with my own eyes.  Eventually they will ban themselves.

From your POV Truth is just a belief.   If it wasn't, you wouldn't be saying the things you are saying - because you would be enlightened.   Only 1% of the population is enlightened.   So ofcourse it is going to be belief to you.

That doesn't mean spiritual teachers are prosletyzers...

Edited July 28, 2019 by Inliytened1

[Enlightenment]

@possibilities May I ask you what definition of consciousness you subscribe to?

For me, simply the fact that something seems to be happening (even if it only seems) is enough of a proof of consciousness. 

[zeroISinfinity]

 

 

 

[Keto15]

@DrewNows thank you so much for sharing that video. It is the best explanation for the consciousness questions I have been pondering for the last few months. You rock!

[Ramu]

@Kushu2000 the problem is that you're taking a lot for granted and making a lot of assumptions.  Metaphysically there is no "brain".  If you assume that everything is happening "in a brain"...then where is this brain occurring?

[Juan Cruz Giusto]

On 7/27/2019 at 8:00 PM, Kushu2000 said:

People have probably talked about this stuff ad nauseum, but i havent heard a good argument for thid yet... If i hit you in the head, you lose consciousness. How can you then say that consciousness exists "out there" somewhere, apart from you, and exists withour your brain?

Good argument. You are defining consciousness here as the ability that you and other human beings have to be conscious and aware of experience.

Let's say consciousness = qualia = subjective experience.

Cool. Materialism says that the brain is the one that produces consciousness or qualia because that's where the electrochemical reactions are happening and we only see consciousness when there's a brain. They claim that consciousness (mind) is originated by the brain (matter). 

Now, let's definite matter as the stuff reality is made out of and matter is when arranged in a complex way, originates consciousness. Notice though that you never experience matter, you only experience consciousness/mind/experience/qualia. 

So, if nobody ever experienced and found matter (is in principle impossible since whatever you find will be consciousness or mind), why do we claim it exists? If the only thing we are 100% sure it exists is mind, why do we add matter to the equation?

Let's say that reality is made out of the same stuff your mind is made out of, but since it's bigger let's call it Consciousness. Not because your personal mind falls asleep when you get hit by a bat means all of reality isn't made out of consciousness. Also, not because the world functions in a very specific and predictable way, it is not made out of the same stuff your experience is made out of.

It's useful to divide Personal Consciousness and Consciousness as a whole. They don't have a different nature, they are the same. That's why it's said that reality is made out of consciousness.

As to materialism, correlation doesn't mean causation. Not because each time you see a brain there's consciousness, it means that the brain generates consciousness. They are correlated, like a coin and its 2 faces. The brain is how a 3rd person sees your experience. The less complex the exterior, the less conscious the interior.

Practically, no matter what I say and the philosophy behind it, you and I still don't know what Reality is. A Direct Consciousness will only suffice. If it turns out to be Consciousness or Nothing or Matter or Candy it doesn't really matter. What matter is what's true.

 

[Autumn]

On 7/27/2019 at 8:44 PM, Serotoninluv said:

@Kushu2000

Is a character in your dream conscious!? 

Well that's an interesting thought!