Psychopaths and spirituality

[Evoke]

How do psychopaths and sociopaths fit into the spiritual paradigm? Can they become enlightened or even grow themself spiritually at all?

The reason i ask is because i once met a girl with clear signs of psychopathic behavior. She didn't seem to have altruistic feelings at all. She even tried to manipulate me spiritually.  Very creepy behavior. The sex was great though.. ? 

[SoonHei]

there is no requirement / prerequisites for being enlightened. of course, it's more "rare" if one isn't doing the work/ on the path... kinda like that example of getting hit my ligthening... u can be hit my ligthening while ur on ur front proch watching the storm but can certainly increase the likelyhood if u got a steel rod pointed at the sky and are barefeet on top of a hill.

 

 

following are all whom can be enlightened: serial killers, rapists, politicians, presidents, child abusers, drug traffickers

and also, drug addicts, those who have been raped or in the process of (some girl who is a spiritual teacher now had this to her... she realized in the midst of her abuse that her rapist was none other than infinite love ) 

[Nahm]

Spirituality is not a paradigm, it is seeking and discovering the actual Truth about yourself. Then, you’ll know such answers. In the meantime, let thoughts about other people go - you’ll need all your focus for spirituality. I hear you on the crazy sex though. Nice.

[SoonHei]

13 minutes ago, Nahm said:

I hear you on the crazy sex though.

yeyeyeyye

 

[Forestluv]

1 hour ago, Evoke said:

How do psychopaths and sociopaths fit into the spiritual paradigm? Can they become enlightened or even grow themself spiritually at all?

Consider that enlightenment could be transcendent of a personality, such that the person does not become enlightened. Rather, the person appears within enlightenment. 

Could a human-mind body realize it is within enlightenment? Sure. After this realization, could impulses of anxiety, fear, frustration etc. arise within the mind body? Yep. 

Since the realization is trans-personal, it is often related to a dissolution of the personality, since awareness of the illusory/imaginative/dreamlike nature of the personality is revealed. There is often an energetic shift away from self-seeking. Yet impulses that humans like to categorize as “bad” can still arise in human mind-body (such as frustration and insecurity). The mind-body is highly conditioned and within a society that may reinforce and encourage that conditioning. Even after the awareness is revealed the mind-body still has potential for development at the personal level. Yet the “essence” of enlightenment can be a “game-changer” in which much of the divisive personality dynamics dissolve. 

Imo, this is the biggest misconception for a seeker. That the person gets a thing called “enlightenment”. They see others who they think have gotten this enlightenment thing and think it should look a certain way (peaceful, blissful etc.). Self-seeking for an imaginary thing called enlightenment can provide a person motivation, yet it’s also kinda a wild goose chase. Kinda like searching for your glasses and then realizing they were on your face the whole time. Yet most humans have a need for the search as this keeps awareness contracted within a personality and keeps the ego relevant and in the game.

Enlightenment isn’t something an illusory person gets. The personality is a human construct composed of appearances. There is no stable thing called a person that catches enlightenment. Rather, there are personality appearances within enlightenment. I’ve experienced expansive consciousness beyond human form that was inexplicably beautiful.

I’ve also experienced contracted consciousness of inexplicable anxiety and terror in which the mind-body desired to kill itself to make it stop. Enlightenment was equally present in both situations. 

[Nahm]

@Serotoninluv Awesome. ??

 

“I want to know what enlightenment is! ....Oh, there’s nothing to know. Ok. Alright”

[EvilAngel]

???

[Evoke]

Great answers from all of you so far. This forum is really something else! ? ?

I suspected that my question is kind of an ego distraction from my own inner work but the question still arose in consciousness  ? 

[DrewNows]

@Evoke this book is really fascinating, I actually just finished listening to it and it touches on the relationship between spirituality and psychopathy mostly in the last hour of the book. There are indeed some correlations and amazing findings relating to psychopaths and spirituality.  Also it is quite entertaining and shines light on many different aspects of the brain, behaviors, empathy and what separates the psychopath from normal people 

(edit: @Natasha you may enjoy this book) 

Edited August 13, 2019 by DrewNows

[Natasha]

14 hours ago, DrewNows said:

 @Natasha you may enjoy this book

Will give it a listen, thanks

I think the problem with psychopaths is not that they objectify reality, but that they don't connect to it with empathy and love. They're on a perpetual fight-or-flight inner rollercoaster fueled by the 'lizard' brain. They lack emotional regulation and are mainly driven by their survival instinct.

[loub]

On 7/23/2019 at 4:38 PM, Nahm said:

“I want to know what enlightenment is! ....Oh, there’s nothing to know. Ok. Alright”

Don't you mean there is Nothing    to know?

[Nahm]

On 7/23/2019 at 9:12 AM, Evoke said:

She even tried to manipulate me spiritually. 

Can you elaborate, scrutinize that, be more and more specific?

 

@loub Who knows. Great pic. 

[ajasatya]

@Evoke It's not a distraction because it leads to more understanding of what Enlightenment is and what it's not.

A blocked heart is a bottleneck for the experience of Enlightenment. Psychopaths and sociopaths may have insights on the mental level, but they will never experience the Full House until they manage to open up to Love, Goodness and Compassion.

[wk197]

What would hypothetically happen if a psychopath took a large does of 5 meo DMT

[Esoteric]

On 7/23/2019 at 4:38 PM, Nahm said:

@Serotoninluv “I want to know what enlightenment is!"

"I want you to shooow meeee"

[brugluiz]

Once I thought I was a psychopath, but I would say I just haven't integrated my shadows properly (for example, I felt that if I said "no" to a person, I was being a psychopath). I do feel guilt, shame and regret, but I still have a hard time with enlightenment. Maybe the most near of enlightenment I reached was during psychosis, what I can describe as an "I'm everything and everything is me" moment.

What I conclude is that I have very little understanding about psychopathy. They say it's caused by traumas, but people with schizophrenia and even bipolar disorder had many traumas and they still can overcome them. Maybe there are many other factors such as biological, psychological, emotional and spiritual ones.

[Nahm]

@Esoteric We can walk from here to there. It’s no problem, simple. The thing is, you’ll quit...pause it so to speak...bow out.