Finally Playing Devils Advocate

[Aakash]

@kieranperez

3 minutes ago, kieranperez said:

Good god. Fucking no lol. It actually isn’t and I hope you work on tossing that nonsense lol

and this is why leo says you only become fully awakened after you understand truth= love 

after enlightenment, it flips back on itself. and relative beliefs become completely true. Still you need to be critical and think about what you should trust and what you should not. However, you are no longer asking yourself 

"what is the truth" because EVERYTHING IS TRUTH AND NOTHING IS TRUTH. 

they collapse and true non-duality is formed

[Enlightenment]

1 hour ago, Tetcher said:

That is going full circle, first you start psychedelics and you're blown away by what reality is but then you start to wonder to what extent you're being hallucinatory and come to rediscover the value of the scientific process and why it first emerged from a more mystical culture.

This sort of happened to me

[kieranperez]

@Natasha @ajasatya @Nahm @cetus56 @Shiva @Charlotte And other mods please close thread. 

[Preetom]

1 hour ago, kieranperez said:

@Natasha @ajasatya @Nahm @cetus56 @Shiva @Charlotte And other mods please close thread. 

We need all the avengers to close up this woo woo mess ?

[kieranperez]

22 minutes ago, Preetom said:

We need all the avengers to close up this woo woo mess ?

I just have no interest in debating. 

And yes it would be nice if they closed it already. 

[Leo Gura]

@kieranperez Like I said before, imagination has many layers to it. It is not so simplistic as imagining a unicorn and it physically appears.

Reality/consciousness has many partitions and levels which are hidden from itself. Just like a sophisticated operating system. The OS does not allow access to all of its parts willy nilly to any random app. There are permissons and layers of security to ensure the integrity of the whole thing.

There are aspects to consciousness which are private and aspects which are public. This duality itself is imaginary though at higher levels of consciousness.

The whole point of being an individual creature is that you have this private domain of consciousness to work within. You are master over your private little dimension. Or at least it appears that way to you because that's how you know you're an individual being. God had to imagine that for you. Now you want to blur those boundaries but you're still so busy being in a state of separation.

What good would God's design be if I could imagine that your child is a dog and he suddenly turned into a dog? Can you see why such a design would be problematic? So as a human I am precisely not given such powers.

All limitations and boundaries are purely imaginary, but as a human you are not given consciousness of how this imagination works -- for your own benefit. It's too much for most people to handle. Human life is on a need-to-know basis. God does not reveal things to you which you do not need to know. Unless you need to know them. Then all is revealed. Which is why a burning need to know is so important in this work.

[Forestluv]

2 minutes ago, Leo Gura said:

There are permissions and layers of security to ensure the integrity of the whole thing.

It seems entry passwords are granted as we go deeper and develop mastery. 

[Leo Gura]

@kieranperez The questions you're asking here are good ones. Keep asking them of yourself as you contemplate, meditate, and trip.

If your desire to understand consciousness is deep enough, eventually you should get the answers until everything becomes clear.

Remember that you are imagining the entire physical world with all of its rules and limitations. So if some physical scenario (like your camera example) works the way it works, it works that way precisely because you imagine it that way. But you're not aware yet of how you're doing it. Notice that your confusion rises because you imagine that it (the camera) should work some other way. You imagine that way and then super-impose it upon your yet deeper layer of imagination of the physical world. So the confusion arises because you're imaging things at various layers and getting tangled up in them.

You imagine there are other people and cameras who see things. Then you complain how come they don't see things as you see things. Because first and foremost you imagine they are separate from you. You gotta untangle the many layers of your own imaginings. Of course first and foremost you gotta realize that "you" and "imagination" are themselves entangled, confused, and imaginary notions.

[Nahm]

@Leo Gura Awesome. 

[Surfingthewave]

@kieranperez Sorry to get pedantic but perhaps you need to think more about meeting girls and talking to them in real life, rather than how you imagined, as no matter how enlightened you think you are, or how real you would like your thoughts to be, I'm afraid to say it's never going to happen as you so imagined. 

 

Edited July 13, 2019 by Surfingthewave

[Ibn Sina]

Wow this is such an insightful thread. Thanx a lot for such a profound answer @Leo Gura

[kieranperez]

39 minutes ago, Surfingthewave said:

@kieranperez Sorry to get pedantic but perhaps you need to think more about meeting girls and talking to them in real life, rather than how you imagined, as no matter how enlightened you think you are, or how real you would like your thoughts to be, I'm afraid to say it's never going to happen as you so imagined. 

I’ve never EVER said on this forum that I’m enlightened nor do I pretend to be. Idk how much more clear I need to be on this. Don’t try and be a smart ass with me.

2 hours ago, Leo Gura said:

@kieranperez The questions you're asking here are good ones. Keep asking them of yourself as you contemplate, meditate, and trip.

If your desire to understand consciousness is deep enough, eventually you should get the answers until everything becomes clear.

Remember that you are imagining the entire physical world with all of its rules and limitations. So if some physical scenario (like your camera example) works the way it works, it works that way precisely because you imagine it that way. But you're not aware yet of how you're doing it. Notice that your confusion rises because you imagine that it (the camera) should work some other way. You imagine that way and then super-impose it upon your yet deeper layer of imagination of the physical world. So the confusion arises because you're imaging things at various layers and getting tangled up in them.

You imagine there are other people and cameras who see things. Then you complain how come they don't see things as you see things. Because first and foremost you imagine they are separate from you. You gotta untangle the many layers of your own imaginings. Of course first and foremost you gotta realize that "you" and "imagination" are themselves entangled, confused, and imaginary notions.

For me I think it’s more of digging this same insight I had regarding this and go a lot deeper with it. 

I’ve always been onboard since the beginning that the tastes I’ve had, however grand they were, were only tastes and so the assumption I always keep in mind is that I still have A LOT deeper to go. It’s funny how with every massive insight like this goes, the more efficient and open my own epistemology is. 

I think it is important to note though that this is a function of the relative world goes. 

I bring up these questions to you really just allow for greater openness and open more blindspots (ignoring the usually parroting chirping that comes along in response to these kinds of posts). I find myself less reliant on outside points of view trust my own direct experience more. However, as far as relative matters go, I’m always want check with certain teachers to keep my openness there. So I’m glad to see you know where I’m coming from.

As far as your point, I can’t really give any sort of genuine agreement or disagreement. I’ve had tastes of what you’re talking about but not the degree I imagine you’re talking about. 

[Leo Gura]

@kieranperez Good, you are like a bloodhound who's caught onto the scent trail of God. The trail is twisted and goes through a deep briar patch. Keep sniffing it out until one day you'll find yourself looking straight into the face of God.

Asking high quality questions is exactly what's required.

[kieranperez]

17 minutes ago, Leo Gura said:

@kieranperez Good, you are like a bloodhound who's caught onto the scent trail of God. The trail is twisted and goes through a deep briar patch. Keep sniffing it out until one day you'll find yourself looking straight into the face of God.

Asking high quality questions is exactly what's required.

Thanks man. Still appreciate you converting into a brother on the path  

By the way, after your deep trips, do you feel extremely energetically and emotionally sensitive to your environment hours or the next few days after? After a deep trip, relative to me and my own experiences, I feel so emotionally vulnerable and susceptible to the energy and vibe around me it’s overwhelmingly. Do you find that with you? 

[dvdas]

@Leo Gura If god does reveal things to people that have a burning need to know, why god revealed some of the things you talk about to you and not to other hardcore practitioners, Om swami comes to mind. You yourself have said in the past that you could not go to that extremes. so why you have these insights and others don't. 

[Aakash]

@dvdas I have to give you my praise, this is the best question i've seen this week

Edited July 14, 2019 by Aakash

[kieranperez]

20 minutes ago, dvdas said:

@Leo Gura If god does reveal things to people that have a burning need to know, why god revealed some of the things you talk about to you and not to other hardcore practitioners, Om swami comes to mind. You yourself have said in the past that you could not go to that extremes. so why you have these insights and others don't. 

Follow your bliss, your strengths, and what works for you. 

[Leo Gura]

1 hour ago, kieranperez said:

By the way, after your deep trips, do you feel extremely energetically and emotionally sensitive to your environment hours or the next few days after?

No

1 hour ago, dvdas said:

@Leo Gura If god does reveal things to people that have a burning need to know, why god revealed some of the things you talk about to you and not to other hardcore practitioners, Om swami comes to mind. You yourself have said in the past that you could not go to that extremes. so why you have these insights and others don't. 

I had a burning need to know.

And cutting edge drugs 

[Bryanbrax]

@Leo Gura so willpower plays a role in this 

[kieranperez]

@Bryanbrax no you literally put your hands around your head on your sofa while insights and deep enlightenments rain down and penetrate your being from the heavens until it's time for afternoon tea.