Mapping Out Leo's Psychedelic Insights Within Vedantic Perspective

[Inliytened1]

@Mikael89 It's not accurate to say that Brahman is not the world, and that's all there is.

it can be seen as One.  it IS ONE when you become it.  So any disctinctions made are relative.

The Absolute will reveal all is One.

If Anna1 agrees with this then we are all arguing about the same thing really!

And I consider her on expert on this teaching from knowing her posts.

[Inliytened1]

@Mikael89 No, i just posted her quote saying the world is Brahman but Brahman is not the world.

The formless is still the form. 

To say the form is the formless but the formless is not the form is only 1/2 complete.

You have to see Oneness to grasp this.  You must awaken to yourself.

[Preetom]

3 minutes ago, Inliytened1 said:

OK i realized i had it backwards.

But even so, Brahman is still is the world too...the world is consciousness in the form of form.

It's all One thing.

No you are still misinterpreting Vedanta. Brahman is not in the world. Brahman never becomes or unbecomes anything. Brahman alone is. The world is not.

3 minutes ago, Inliytened1 said:

@Mikael89 It's not accurate to say that Brahman is not the world, and that's all there is.

it can be seen as One.  it IS ONE when you become it.  So any disctinctions made are relative.

The Absolute will reveal all is One.

If Anna1 agrees with this then we are all arguing about the same thing really!

And I consider her on expert on this teaching from knowing her posts.

If it's all ONE why are you still making a distinction between the world and Brahman. Your message seems to imply that there must be a world and Brahman- two things first- then they will be viewed as one - yeah that's panchychism or a version of Samkhya philosophy, not advaita vedanta.

Like I said, if one is really Brahman then for him there is no misconception about what Brahman or the world is. He neither needs to talk or convince anyone about it. But before that, this precise discrimination is essential. Or else you get a half baked nonduality or whatever it is- but it's definitely not what advaita vedanta is talking about.

[Inliytened1]

For those who need clarification:

Brahman - formlessness

world = form

 

[Jkris]

@Inliytened1

Jagath Mythya Brahman Sathyam - Adi Shankara

The world is not real only brahman alone is real - Truth

@Preetom  

 

[Inliytened1]

@Preetom You can make distinctions, that is duality.  But they are within non-duality.  They are not separate from non-duality.

So from a non-dual perspective - or the Absolute perspective which is revealed to you when you become the Absolute -

The world/form is Brahman/formlessness

AND

formlessness/Brahman is the world/form.

It must come full circle.

It's all one thing.  We just create the illusion that they are different so that they can be different.

[Inliytened1]

@Mikael89 No, the illusion of garbage, which is still Brahman, dissipates.  Leaving Brahman.

Brahman can't escape itself.  Strange Loop.  Paradox.  Ring a bell?

Newsflash - you are Brahman - you are the whole chabang! 

[Preetom]

3 minutes ago, Inliytened1 said:

For those who need clarification:

Brahman - formlessness

world = form

No Vedanta doesn't define brahman and world like that. Now I can see where you are misunderstanding. It's because you've conflated advaita vedanta teachings with shunya vada teachings of Buddhism and purusha-prakity philosophy of Samkhya.

What you are preaching is Samkhya or panpsychism where both form and formless are Real. Even when you are saying form is formless and formless is form, you are making the distinction of 2 things first.

 

 

[Inliytened1]

Dang the spiritual warrior comes out of retirement and you guys run?  what fun is that?

Just kidding.  I was simply just trying to show you guys what IS - there isn't a particular teaching -  that is all imagined.

There is only Truth.

Edited June 25, 2019 by Inliytened1

[Inliytened1]

@Preetom I was quoting Anna and using her analogy.  She is an expert in that teaching.

[Aakash]

@Preetom the reAson you are not understanding is because you are using language to fight your case bro. Bhraman does not exist or exist. Bhraman is simply a term for that which is. And what is.... can’t be put into a perspective, vendanta alike. Hence winter soldier is not actually enlightened. He’s basically experiencing imaginary bliss and peace, likewise all other enlightened beings. 

all there is is consciousness. Put simply just don’t try to define it and you’ll come closer than you ever have to the absolute than an enlightened being. 

What this means is the following: 

repeat after me: 

anything I believe to be true... it’s not true.. but because I imagined it myself... it is true. 

Likewise what I am doing now. 

What you don’t get about Leo is Leo is imagining god into existence. Meaning it will happen. And therefore Leo’s experience is real. Compare the realness of which is higher. Is not possible, because that’s creating distinctions! 

But relatively speaking, his imagination of god is more accurate than enlightenenment. MEANING it more accurately represents non duality than the current framework for non duality itself I.e enlightenment. 

[Inliytened1]

This is why we say Truth cannot be taught.  You have to become it - or more precisely, you have to discover that you are IT by BEING it.

No teaching in the world can do that for you.  No spiritual teacher or teaching in the world can do it - because you are imagining all of that as God.

[Aakash]

The issue is you need an experience of having no ability to define reality and this comes with cognition errors in your reality. To resist these cognition errors is true being. 

The man with no perspectives, is the winner. Not the man who is from the non dual perspective. You are right though if you don’t teach it. There is no need to speak about it. 

 

[Aakash]

@Inliytened1 I agree the teaching is an experience to prove this following sentence in duality 

“I am god, I am infinite, and I can not be defined” that is enlightenment full stop. 

whether Leo becomes the truest god or someone else. Is only another infinity within infinity. Enlightenment itself is another infinity within infinity. However, the consequences of Leo if he does succeed will ripple through reality. Who knows what could happen lol 

non the less, this is only mere speculation. 

Edited June 25, 2019 by Aakash

[Inliytened1]

@Aakash And you are right if you do teach it.  

Duality city.

We should go as far as we can go with language but we need to be conscious of it's limitations.

RIght now we are in duality otherwise there would just be isness.

There would not be an Aakash or a Preetum.

 

[Preetom]

6 hours ago, Jkris said:

@Mikael89 There are no objects in deep sleep. why Brahman is not experienced in deep sleep ?? @Preetom 

(Deep sleep is true nature of awareness ??? - Sri Ramana Maharishi)

That's a very crucial question. It arises from misunderstanding what Maharshi means by Self or Consciousness.

The thing we call consciousness, the consciousness that operates in our waking and dream states and knows objects and experiences is NOT the Self or Real Consciousness. Because we are used to associate consciousness ONLY when we are knowing things, we feel we have lost Consciousness in deep sleep where no things are known. 

What Maharshi refers to as Self or Real Consciousness is that which doesn't know anything other than itself. It's nondual, whole, solitary Being Consciousness.

You are infact experiencing Self in deep sleep, but this ''Self-experience'' is hidden by darkness of ignorance or the bliss sheath. When your dual or object knowing consciousness arises immediately upon waking up and look back at the deep sleep experience, it misinterprets that sleep experience as unconsciousness or void because it itself was absent that 'time'. So the instruction is to self-inquire and realize Self in midst of waking state and penetrating all the mental sheaths. You can't do that during deep sleep.

And the meaning of ''Deep sleep is true nature of Awareness'' is that deep sleep is the only state that resembles Real Awareness at it's best. Because in deep sleep there is no subject-object experience duality, exactly like the realization of the Self. That's why Ramana said after self-realization waking, dreaming, sleeping all will vanish and only the ''conscious sleep'' will remain.

'Sleep' means there will not be any subject-object duality. And 'conscious' means you won't be taken over by the darkness of ignorance or the illusion of unconsciousness ever again

6 hours ago, Jkris said:

Brahman is not an object of experience.The eyes cannot see itself.

Vs

Awareness is aware of itself.Yes defenitely it is an experience - suchness,is essential,Nothingness,emptiness,void

please clarify

This is the limit of the metaphor. The eye cant see itself, the tongue cant taste itself, the knife cant cut itself etc  are all helpful metaphors for vedantic discrimination and appreciating the reality and supremacy of Brahman.

But these metaphors collapse when the realization is done. Consciousness is not insentient like eye, tongue, knife; so the metaphor collapses.

And isness, suchness, nothingness, void etc are all subtle teaching pointers. They are not experiences as we know them. Awareness aware of itself- it's not an experience. It can't be described in any way. It's the only thing thats going on and we can realize that for ourselves. After we realize, we'll know exactly what it means and won't need to listen to any description about it.

 

[Aakash]

@Inliytened1 yes and so it’s a choice, live in duality or live in non duality. Both are still distinctions, so reality encapsulates that. Meaning 

a) either your cognisance of the truth in your experience 

b) you are being it currently 

and I think Leo is switching between both daily. Such as you would if you were doing meditation. It is the only way to find god. 

Duality and non duality must collapse. Meaning there is not ONE but ZERO. 

That is what Leo is talking about in his trip with dpt. but again it could extend to infinity aswell and therefore it’s basically thrill seeking and that’s why seekers can’t accept it. Because they’re looking to be caged in. Not that it matters though because there is no right or wrong. 

[Preetom]

19 minutes ago, Mikael89 said:

I understand now this is the reason why Advaita Vedanta isn't teached or even talked about much in this forum.

Because everyone would just come in and destroy it and corrupt it. It's impossible to keep it clean from contamination here.

And there is little to no leeway to make personal stories and doctrines around it as things are precisely defined lol

Btw thanks for posting the quotes from Ribhu Gita. Those are the real gems of this thread

And I'm foreshadowing the nightmare of Leo coming back and making all of us bald so that no hair splitting is possible

(wait is that why he is bald in the first place?)

 

[Aakash]

@Preetom ? but you lose your cognition capabilities! That’s why you THINK it’s the end. ??. 

Your cognition/ mind must become enlightened aswell to be an overall well rounded enlightened person. 

Bringing non duality back through to duality. Etc.. 

practicality and pragmatism bought about in your everyday life. Unless your Leo and your a thrill seeker. 

Edited June 25, 2019 by Aakash

[Aakash]

19 minutes ago, Preetom said:

And there is little to no leeway to make personal stories and doctrines around it as things are precisely defined lol

The fact it’s precisely defined ISSSSSSS the reason why it’s not true. It’s the same exact thing as someone saying to you: 

you should live your life in a way that is fruitful and abundantly filled. 

Where as you believe that you can sit around all day doing nothing like a yogi. 

Both are true and both are incorrect. Relative to each other 

so this enlightenment you “define clearly” is relative to the absolute lol. This is mathematical proof to prove enlightenment isn’t the end as we know it. 

Why? Because you can’t encapsulate infinity! Enlightenment is an attempt to find god. Not to solve your personal issues. 

It’s an attempt to understand what’s going on in reality and what it is and encapsulate it. 

Its just people STOP when they think they’ve encapsulated it and what is this ? THIS IS EGO. 

Enlightened people are trapped in EGO. And have decived themselves they aren’t. Because their distinctions have broken down. So by default their own self deception is the following: 

“i am god, god is ego. I have no ego.” This is their assumption their whole reality is predicated on. If they questioned this it would break their reality and that’s why they don’t! 

It’s not their ego! EGO IS A FACET OF THE ABSOLUTE. EGO DOES NOT MEAN AN INDIVIDUAL ENTITY BECAUSE INFINITY IS ONE THING. INFINITY ISSS EGO. you are god, thinking your human and that have changed to god. 

This is distinctions all messed up. There was never a you in the first place! 

So your ego in “duality” is enlightenment. It’s only enlightenment if your aware of how you convince yourself of self deception. Enlightenment is the END OF MAYA 

REALITY IS DIRECT! 

Edited June 25, 2019 by Aakash