Is 5 meo dmt really a magic pill to enlightenment?

[Key Elements]

23 minutes ago, Nahm said:

You still have to live your life to the fullest and find your purpose.

How do you know that is true for you and also true for everyone?

Nahm, this is an obvious question.

I'm not sure about everyone. Some ppl die before their time and that itself is a lesson to be learned for others. For me, I'm not just going to sit at home and stare at my wall and eat Cheetos (like Leo said). That's an obvious negative consequence.

This won't end till your death.

How do you know you die?

You don't. I'm talking about relative truth.

Then, you'll find out what happens to you.

Why wait? 

Because you could change your karma.

 

 

[Key Elements]

I just told him about nirvana, but I'm not sure he heard me. Well, it's really his choice to listen or not and to check it out. We can only control what we can do in our own life purpose.

Tbh, I'm not sure if 5meo could change your karma/fate. Karma is also another factor and extremely profound.

[Leo Gura]

25 minutes ago, kieranperez said:

Meant more in the beginning after your first 1 or 2 trips

My biggest struggle is pretty much always post trip when it comes back to the self esteem issues of my everyday life.

I keep debating with myself whether or not to buy it and hesitate cause I feel like it’s not the right time. Especially the feedback I get from others. 

Look, this is a highly personal matter.

Your trips will be very different from mine. So my experiences are not a good point of reference.

My first trip I had a panic attack.

In the end, no of that matters. Just minor obstacles.

[universe]

Can the body simulate the effects of 5 meo dmt?

For example, with enough awareness of the present moment I get kinda similar effects to shrooms.

[Leo Gura]

10 minutes ago, universe said:

Can the body simulate the effects of 5 meo dmt?

For example, with enough awareness of the present moment I get kinda similar effects to shrooms.

Well, obviously, since that's basically what enlightenment is.

You'd have to sit and concentrate on nothingness for many thousands of hours. Or do decades of yoga.

Yoga is basically a method for naturally producing 5-MeO-DMT or its equivalent. Dark room retreats are another method. Long fasts are another method. Shamanic breathing is another method.

All these techniques are designed to change your state of consciousness.

[kieranperez]

4 hours ago, Leo Gura said:

Look, this is a highly personal matter.

Your trips will be very different from mine. So my experiences are not a good point of reference.

My first trip I had a panic attack.

In the end, no of that matters. Just minor obstacles.

Fair enough 

[Chi_]

@Shadowraix and @Inliytened1

Thank you for your replies! I'm more eager now to try it

 

@Leo Gura

Cheers 

[SunnyNewDay]

On 6/8/2019 at 3:16 AM, Leo Gura said:

Yes. If you do it right. And you will awaken deeper than a Zen master with 40 years of daily practice.

You can be so awake that you won't be able to walk straight.

But do you dare go there? Probably not.

how do you know this is true though if you haven't had the experience of a zen master practicing for 40 years? I'm not saying you're wrong or even right but consider the qualities someone might have developed if they have been practicing intelligently and disciplined for 40 years. There may be a piece of the puzzle one has there that allows them to see things in a different way than others wont due to lack of experience and discipline. 

[Key Elements]

17 hours ago, Inliytened1 said:

@Key ElementsOne doesn't need to find a Master somewhere on You Tube or in a book to believe that.  Once you awaken you understand that you are every Master out there.  

Hey..wait a minute, did you just assume here that I have no spiritual growth/experience or lack of? Did you just say that I just read from books? I think if you did that, or if I did that to myself (in my life purpose or wherever), then I'm probably going to misguide someone or myself in the path. You can't just assume. Some ppl (myself included) did not self reflect enough to realize they already had something happen to them. The question is, if this happens, and they just went ahead and tried a hardcore method, this may misguide them. This isn't relative truth. It doesn't follow rational logic.

[Key Elements]

I'm also thinking, if a person doesn't empty the mind and self-reflect objectively (as much as possible), the person doesn't know where he/she is at on the path. If he/she blindly takes up a method, it's not that much different than following the Bible literally and blindly just because someone else said so.

[Inliytened1]

6 hours ago, Key Elements said:

Hey..wait a minute, did you just assume here that I have no spiritual growth/experience or lack of? Did you just say that I just read from books? I think if you did that, or if I did that to myself (in my life purpose or wherever), then I'm probably going to misguide someone or myself in the path. You can't just assume. Some ppl (myself included) did not self reflect enough to realize they already had something happen to them. The question is, if this happens, and they just went ahead and tried a hardcore method, this may misguide them. This isn't relative truth. It doesn't follow rational logic.

 No not at all i wasn't judging you i was trying to say that one doesn't need 5-Meo to have the highest realizations.    Probably came across the wrong way.  Once the realizations are reached, whether using a substance or not, you reach the same place.  Just maybe different paths.

Edited June 9, 2019 by Inliytened1

[Moreira]

Its been scientifically proved that meditation for years changes your brain pathways, while taking a magic pill will give you a little taste of enlightenment ant then youll go back to your miserable existance.

[Bobby]

@Moreira no.

psychedelics change you permanently. I’ve only done mushrooms and I know that

[Leo Gura]

7 hours ago, SunnyNewDay said:

how do you know this is true though if you haven't had the experience of a zen master practicing for 40 years? I'm not saying you're wrong or even right but consider the qualities someone might have developed if they have been practicing intelligently and disciplined for 40 years. There may be a piece of the puzzle one has there that allows them to see things in a different way than others wont due to lack of experience and discipline. 

Some things in life you can only intuit. Not everything is absolute knowledge. We deal with a lot of uncertainties in this work because we never have perfect information. We cannot crawl into a person's head to know how awake they are. But we nevertheless have to make some assessments of it in order to determine who is worth learning from.

I have interacted with and interviewed masters with 40 years of experience. And I see gaps in their understanding of reality/God. I feel like I have become conscious of some things they have not. Of course this is a grey area. It involves some guesswork.

No doubt 40 years of discipline is a powerful thing and comes with many benefits which you could not get any other way. But it does not guarantee the highest levels of consciousness or understanding.

[Nahm]

@Bobby The knower of change did not change.  

 

 

[Key Elements]

9 hours ago, Inliytened1 said:

 No not all i want judging you i was trying to say that one doesn't need 5-Meo to have the highest realizations.    Probably came across the wrong way.  Once the realizations are reached, whether using a substance or not, you reach the same place.  Just maybe different paths.

Ok, cool then, because I'm about to say something here...

5 hours ago, Leo Gura said:

I feel like I have become conscious of some things they have not. Of course this is a grey area. 

I tell myself to be careful whenever these thoughts come into my mind. We really don't know what they've experienced, unless they tried their best telling you and you could relate. Then you may know where they're at. Truth isn't a fad. We all know that millions of copies of the Bible could be printed out and passed out in these mega churches, and they may contain the Truth in them, but doing this will most likely cause harm and dogma rather than spreading the Truth. The same could be true for 5meo. The same could be true for other strong methods. I hope that all these methods are showing you the Truth (including the Bible) in a very authentic way. You see? I'm trying to say something here. Right now, because of technology, it's easy to just go on the internet and follow anything just because it worked out for someone else. We're all embodied as an ego. So, we all have different karmas. Karma is very profound. Our paths are not going to be the same.

[noselfnofun]

13 hours ago, Leo Gura said:

Some things in life you can only intuit. Not everything is absolute knowledge. We deal with a lot of uncertainties in this work because we never have perfect information. We cannot crawl into a person's head to know how awake they are. But we nevertheless have to make some assessments of it in order to determine who is worth learning from.

I have interacted with and interviewed masters with 40 years of experience. And I see gaps in their understanding of reality/God. I feel like I have become conscious of some things they have not. Of course this is a grey area. It involves some guesswork.

No doubt 40 years of discipline is a powerful thing and comes with many benefits which you could not get any other way. But it does not guarantee the highest levels of consciousness or understanding.

It would be interesting to get a zen mastery of 40 plus years of practice to take 5meo 20 times and see what he says, maybe then we would get our answer? Maybe Shinzen young as he is looking at finding a faster way to awakening. Tho I'm not sure he's as deeply awake as someone like sadguru

[Leo Gura]

9 hours ago, noselfnofun said:

It would be interesting to get a zen mastery of 40 plus years of practice to take 5meo 20 times and see what he says, maybe then we would get our answer? Maybe Shinzen young as he is looking at finding a faster way to awakening. Tho I'm not sure he's as deeply awake as someone like sadguru

The problem with offering an old man 5-MeO is that I don't wanna kill the poor guy.

I offered it to Ralston. He refused, ridiculing me.

Closedmindness is a hell of an obstacle to this work. A person with 40 years experience is also a know-it-all in his own mind.

[ValiantSalvatore]

@Leo Gura Are there some highly enlightened beings who have taken 5-MeO?

I know Shinzen took LSD when he was younger and seems very open I bet he also did an ayahuasca retreat etc he definitely tried some native American approaches towards experiencing with sun dances, starvation and stuff like this. 

 

[Leo Gura]

12 minutes ago, ValiantSalvatore said:

@Leo Gura Are there some highly enlightened beings who have taken 5-MeO?

I know Shinzen took LSD when he was younger and seems very open I bet he also did an ayahuasca retreat etc he definitely tried some native American approaches towards experiencing with sun dances, starvation and stuff like this. 
 

None of that comes anywhere close to 5-MeO-DMT.

Many Western enlightened masters have taken LSD. But LSD ain't good enough.

Shinzen probably is open enough. But I would worry it might kill him. Him's pretty old.

A full-on 5-MeO breakthrough is a terrifying thing. It will give you a panic attack.