How do I escalate physical touch with a girl?

[Toby]

1 hour ago, flowboy said:

@kag101 Thank you for your assumptions, it shows your ignorance. I actually had sex with 5 different stunning women over only the past 7 days. A good week for me. How was yours?

You see why my sack is empty and my statements about women are pretty confident.

I don't understand. You write that you feel "healed" after that workshop numerous times and still you don't display the capacity / interest for lasting relationships. Why is that?

[flowboy]

@Toby  Your assumptions are incorrect.

• 3 of the 5 women I referred to are actually friends I share a deep connection with
• Another one was a new date, whom I had AMAZING chemistry with and a great connection, definitely will keep seeing her

Why would you assume my relationships are not long-lasting?

You're thinking too much within the societal conditioning that relationships can only be meaningful if they're exclusive.

Do yourself a favor and get out of that paradigm.

Do you have only one exclusive friend? No. Are your friendships lasting? Yes, hopefully.

 

And even if hypothetically I would only be having one night stands that I'd never see again, why would that conflict with being healed? Question that. Think for yourself. I think if that's what someone wants, more power to them. Being in a couple is not a superior way to live. Who put that thought in your head?

Self-actualization also means the ability to be fully happy on your own, and not need someone to complete you.

Edited May 28, 2019 by flowboy

[Aeris]

2 hours ago, flowboy said:

@Toby  Your assumptions are incorrect.

• 3 of the 5 women I referred to are actually friends I share a deep connection with
• Another one was a new date, whom I had AMAZING chemistry with and a great connection, definitely will keep seeing her

Why would you assume my relationships are not long-lasting?

You're thinking too much within the societal conditioning that relationships can only be meaningful if they're exclusive.

Do yourself a favor and get out of that paradigm.

Do you have only one exclusive friend? No. Are your friendships lasting? Yes, hopefully.

 

And even if hypothetically I would only be having one night stands that I'd never see again, why would that conflict with being healed? Question that. Think for yourself. I think if that's what someone wants, more power to them. Being in a couple is not a superior way to live. Who put that thought in your head?

Self-actualization also means the ability to be fully happy on your own, and not need someone to complete you.

it's not a paradigm shift to be with more than 1 woman.

the trick is, if no one complete you, you believe that is self actualized to be fully independant, that is right indeed.

but in the meantime, not having solid relation with someone, no spiritual connection, you will always been seeing people as mere experience, however it's your choice for now, maybe a day you'll like a woman enough for not wanting the others.

relation "exclusive" are not a thought put by society totaly.

 

Edited May 28, 2019 by Aeris

[flowboy]

17 minutes ago, Aeris said:

not having solid relation with someone, no spiritual connection

@Aeris I have both of those. You don't need to confine yourself to a single person to have that.

Do you need to have only one friend, for true friendship? No, you don't.

Love is endless and there is enough for everyone. You don't 'run out' of it. You can have it with as many people as you like.

This bias towards exclusivity is just societal conditioning towards the codependent clingy coupling that is considered normal.

Edited May 28, 2019 by flowboy

[Toby]

But how can trust, intimacy, connection and everything else... deepen if you keep it non-committal?

[flowboy]

@Toby This idea of commitment meaning sexual exclusivity is just a conditioned shortcut to avoid doing the emotional work of confronting jealousy and insecurities. That's all it is.

You can develop trust by practicing radical honesty and getting over your insecurities.

This way, you can re-define commitment in a positive way (being with each other) instead of a negative way (not being with others)

See, my girl friends don't have to pretend around me that they're only seeing me. I don't get insecure about that, so we can be honest and open.

In the same way, I don't make any pretenses around them. I'm even seeing two best friends at the same time. Everyone is on board and happy with this.

And because I share myself completely, not holding anything back, I can have very deep and intimate connections.

Even deeper than in most typical exclusive relationships, where my desire for other women as well as her attraction towards men is something that is typically taboo, a topic that must be avoided to not make the other insecure. It's even normal to pretend you're never attracted to someone else! This having to pretend, and tell each other untrue stories (only you baby! I never looked at another man that way since I met you) is what makes the typical exclusive relationship way LESS authentic and intimate.

Edited May 28, 2019 by flowboy

[Aeris]

39 minutes ago, flowboy said:

@Aeris I have both of those. You don't need to confine yourself to a single person to have that.

Do you need to have only one friend, for true friendship? No, you don't.

Love is endless and there is enough for everyone. You don't 'run out' of it. You can have it with as many people as you like.

This bias towards exclusivity is just societal conditioning towards the codependent clingy coupling that is considered normal.

that's why I only have few friends in fact now that I m clear with my way.

I have no time for 10 relationship. the more you got, the more hollows they are aswell just what I observed on me.

and with girls, one is already taking me too much time.

When I would use my time to makes music and all sort of things if I was around 2-3 girls ? 

and I need aswell true dedication, a girl who fucks around and stack MST is not my thing, I cannot accept to share emotion in her mind with thinking about the others guy who fucked her yesterday.

I need aswell someone worth to trust and that I could totaly be vulnerable with.

with friends I m the same, loyal and trustful. and I hope for the same.

I m not really into pick up life

dedication is not a disease, it is bliss and true passion, the only way to accomplish solid things long term.

when you'll one day be 30y + you will hardly have any solid relation with anyone.

of course fix my love in a few range that I call "family" is dangerous, but having no solid attachement, then no family, no deep spirituality.

depend what you call spirituality, of course people bother me etc..

it takes work to keep real relations

but I m not sayin your way are wrong, you should just not believe that "family" is a thought story, it's just one of the main aspect of the metaphysical aspect of reality. Even monkeys have a sense of family and fixed relation ( especially for rising a child, but still ).

 

[joeyi99]

On 5/26/2019 at 8:50 PM, Leo Gura said:

I consider smooth physical escalation a cornerstone of good dating technique. You can get ridiculously good at it and girls love it.

Entire manuals have been written on it. Search for "kino escalation". This is one part of the Mystery Method which was actually quite good and practical.

The rule of thumb is, you start to physically touch her within seconds of meeting her. During the day time physical escalation needs to be very mild. But during night time, like at bars and clubs, it can be very heavy.

It needs to be very natural, which means you need to feel that it's natural for her to feel that it's natural.

Start with non-erotic areas like hand, arm, shoulder. Then move to hug. Then holding hands. Then playing with and rubbing various parts of her body. Make it as casual and playful as possible.

So typically you shake her hand as soon as you meet her. Then you might pat her on the shoulder. Then you might take her hand in your hand and immediately throw it away. Then you might get real close to her body and immediately step back. Then you might take her hand and examine her bracelet, ring, or watch. Then you might tell her to give you a hug. Then you might hold her hand as she walks with you. Then you might put your hands around her waist as you square up to her. Then you might gently run your finger along her jaw line. Then a very short kiss, no tongue. Then you might rub her hips. Then you might pull her into your chest. Then you might squeeze or spank her butt in a playful way. Then you might fondle her tits over her clothes. Then you might breathe on her neck. Then you might gently bite her neck. Then you might run your hands through her hair, gently grabbing and pulling it. And by this point you need to isolate her to a private location for heavy makeout, foreplay, and sex.

The best way to get comfortable doing all this is to go out to rowdy nightclubs and open every girl with physical openers and practice escalating as quickly as possible until she pushes you way. You'll be amazing how far you can get how quickly. Try even going for an instant makeout. All of this builds your comfort level and confidence such that later you can escalate smoothly on any girl in any situation and it will feel natural to her.

She does not have to be drunk for any of this. But obviously if alcohol is involved you can get away with a lot more a lot faster. Mostly she doesn't even need to drink the alcohol. All that's required is that you're in a social space where such things are seen as normal. Whatever you do needs to fit the social situation you're in. At bars and clubs this kind of heavy physicality is totally normal. Obviously not at the mall during day time. There you play it more chill. Although I've met a guy who would hit on women at the mall and have sex with them in that very same mall! LOL! You'll be amazed at what you can get away with when you're smooth and confident.

Obviously for any of this to work she has to show some attraction to you. Although the initial few steps of physical escalation require no attraction. Touching any erotic areas requires a degree of attraction.

The best way to tell if a girl is attracted to you is by looking in her eyes. Does she look into your eyes and hold contact? Does she follow your lead and listen to your words? Then she's attracted. If she's looking away from you a lot, she's not attracted. You need to capture her attention with charm, humor, and confidence.

I think I know who the mall guy is lol. Sonny Arvado https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCUIoI3uyIUtZlrygHUhkj3A

[flowboy]

@Aeris  I think your choices are equally valid, so I'm not saying everyone should live like me.

Definitely I recognize that maintaining multiple relationships takes a lot of time, which can be a problem.

21 hours ago, Aeris said:

I cannot accept to share emotion in her mind with thinking about the others guy who fucked her yesterday.

I need aswell someone worth to trust and that I could totaly be vulnerable with.

with friends I m the same, loyal and trustful. and I hope for the same.

I just want to point out some differences in ways of thinking. And I've thought like this too.

• Other guy who fucked her yesterday means not trustworthy. Why? If there is no agreement she's breaking, I don't see how that speaks to her character negatively. I would interpret it as a woman who owns her sexuality.
• Not only seeing you means not dedicated. Is that true? You're never spending all time together in a relationship, you have to work and see friends. Is that lack of dedication, then?
  Or is it a possible other sexual connection that detracts from yours? The win-lose mentality. When you love someone else, you love me less. This is untrue.
• I have a girl friend who has a boyfriend. I can be totally vulnerable with her, and I trust her. What would you be afraid of in that situation?

It's this value judgment, this labelling of "not loyal/trustworthy", this association between other engagements and betrayal, that I'm calling into question. I've been there, so I won't say I don't understand. It can feel like that. But to me that's all it is, projections of the painbody. You made me feel x so I will label you as an X

Edited May 29, 2019 by flowboy

[Display_Name]

@flowboy Lol I wouldn't have the patience explaining myself to some randos on the Internet thinking they know what my life should look like or how healed I am

This level of close mindedness with sexuality and relationships is what happens when chodes get into spirituality before game (99% of this forum). I used to be one

People in these circles will preach spiritual autonomy but really lack respect for personal goals and passion when it doesn't align with their holier than thou concept of what spirituality looks like

Watch them judge you as soon as pickup or casual sex is mentioned

Ranting a bit not just in regards to this thread but many of the pickup related threads I've seen here over the last year

Edited May 30, 2019 by Display_Name

[SFRL]

52 minutes ago, Display_Name said:

@flowboy Lol I wouldn't have the patience explaining myself to some randos on the Internet thinking they know what my life should look like or how healed I am

This level of close mindedness with sexuality and relationships is what happens when chodes get into spirituality before game (99% of this forum). I used to be one

People in these circles will preach spiritual autonomy but really lack respect for personal goals and passion when it doesn't align with their holier than thou concept of what spirituality looks like

Watch them judge you as soon as pickup or casual sex is mentioned

Ranting a bit not just in regards to this thread but many of the pickup related threads I've seen here over the last year

I agree. 

Let me start out admitting that I am pretty much a novice when it comes to spirituality. When it comes to dating I consider myself advanced though. 

What you get a lot on here is that people are maybe intermediate level when it comes to spiritual work. And intermediate when it comes to dating. If that. And then they forcefully try to combine the two. Which really leads to concepts that leave a lot to be desired. 

Not saying that in theory it can't be done. But you really need to be a master at both to pull that off. Just my opinion. 

 

[Display_Name]

On 31/05/2019 at 2:50 AM, SFRL said:

 

On 31/05/2019 at 2:50 AM, SFRL said:

I agree. 

Let me start out admitting that I am pretty much a novice when it comes to spirituality. When it comes to dating I consider myself advanced though. 

What you get a lot on here is that people are maybe intermediate level when it comes to spiritual work. And intermediate when it comes to dating. If that. And then they forcefully try to combine the two. Which really leads to concepts that leave a lot to be desired. 

Not saying that in theory it can't be done. But you really need to be a master at both to pull that off. Just my opinion. 

 

@flowboy@SFRL What people here fail to see is that pickup IS spirituality.

It reveals fears to conquor and transcend. It integrates spiral dynamics Red and Orange. It fulfills the Maslow level of Sex and Social Life to allow for actual authentic spiritual seeking. It raises autonomy and independence. It strengthens your spirit. I could go on and on. 

 

I'm the type of guy to hit the club on a Saturday to "pick up chicks" (really it's to grow and develop myself through actual action), then snort 5MeO the following Sunday, have myself dissolve and realise God. Then I'll go out and game some more the next day, then I'll meditate and do yoga on Tuesday. 

And why not? It's the same thing. Development. I'm just covering more bases then most people here. 

Don't be that weakminded, beta, fear riddled new ager listening to Matt Khan all day. All about love but completely unable to take any kind of action in the world. Needs and desires unfulfilled. 

Move through all the spiral stages. Don't skip red and orange. Become strong, autonomous, and empowered. Empower yourself to fulfill the human sex need. Be skilled at the social domain. 

This is so obvious to me yet people will so ignorantly call pickup manipulative, neurotic and selfish. Or worse "just be yourself". PSA: "yourself" is also just a collection of conditioned, manipulative behaviours. Fuck sake, is it more selfish than sitting on your cushion meditating? No, of course not. PSA2 EVERYTHING YOU DO WHILE NOT 100% GOD REALIZED IS SELFISH. As it should be. 

Develop yourself in all domains. Cover your bases. Empower yourself. It's that simple. 

/rant

[flowboy]

On 31-5-2019 at 1:52 AM, Display_Name said:

Lol I wouldn't have the patience explaining myself to some randos on the Internet thinking they know what my life should look like or how healed I am

I know, I've been worried about it too. Why spend the energy? Part of it is because I feel it could maybe help open some minds of people who read this thread, to give a voice to that perspective. I do hate slut shaming and related small-minded moral convictions about sexual behaviour, and feel motivated to point them out.

But also I'm still addicted to agreement, like most people. People saying things I really don't agree with, unfortunately motivates me to get involved.

I realised that this need to find or create agreement is what shackles me. I'm still working on letting it go.

Edited June 2, 2019 by flowboy