Greatest master of our time?

[Freakyboo]

No, he didn't embody his teachings - he was abusive and narcissistic.  There are plenty of testimonies online.  Beware of worshipping one person.  Plus this "crazy wisdom" type teaching from Trungpa Rinpoche to Andrew Cohen to Adi Da - they were all narcissistic abusers who hurt a lot of people.

https://www.enlightened-spirituality.org/Da_and_his_cult.html

 

 

[AlwaysBeNice]

14 hours ago, Freakyboo said:

No, he didn't embody his teachings - he was abusive and narcissistic.  There are plenty of testimonies online.  Beware of worshipping one person.  Plus this "crazy wisdom" type teaching from Trungpa Rinpoche to Andrew Cohen to Adi Da - they were all narcissistic abusers who hurt a lot of people.

https://www.enlightened-spirituality.org/Da_and_his_cult.html

That's interesting.

Though I must say to begin with, people's testimonies aren't that reliable when it comes to spiritual people unfortunately, albeit certainly spiritual people can make mistakes, whenever there is a person in the center of attention, especially a leader, or someone that is worshiped, that tends to pull out a lot of anger, distrust and jealousy in people, and especially if these people get invested into his groove of actions, parties and association, and they may be mocked in some way, people can explode, it's not uncommon to hear people wanted to kill or attack their spiritual teacher at some point in their relationship, truly. 

This in combination with the fact people can lie and gossip quite easily in in general (if you hadn't noticed), in combination with the fact that in his earlier stage, he actively mixed himself with the people, talked with them, hosted crazy parties, had sex with people, made fun of people, gave shaktipad transmission, spoke of his enlightenment, should inevitably create dramatic gossip and possibly or probably also false allegations, (I've even experienced this multiple times myself, I may sound arrogant here, but it's true, and one of the reasons is my own relatively developed spiritual state, although I don't consider myself enlightened, but the more unique and authentic you get, the easier you get slack from (normal) people, and perhaps even justifiably so to some degree, because you can bear and love more.

And not to forget, lawsuits for the possibly pursuit of money.

-

All in all, I can't know exactly the things he did in the past, but from what I have seen so far, he was a deeply awakened man with a deep love for people and their enlightenment, he may have done negative things or he may have not, it's really hard to say, it may have truly been for the conscious sake of helping people go beyond their egos out of love, and that's what I tend to lean towards, also because I have met some long-term devotees for some time, and they were very genuine developed people, also listening to the long term (reasonable and genuine) devotees online, some of which had some criticism.

I mean, this is an interesting shift when we come to the spiritual field, compassion and kindness are so important, at the same time is truth, and then bullying or making fun, can become a mature and reasonable thing ('again') when done in the proper context to people who say they are committed to go beyond egoity, it is true that we can grow the quickest in confrontation, and without a doubt, this man was extraordinarily funny. 

-

Being 1/20th into it, someone exclaims:

'He kept complaining about how his devotees were falling short, without ever, ever holding himself at all responsible — after all, he was the Godman! And not just the Godman, but THE Godman.',

This is already not true, he proclaimed he had failed, failed to help enlighten a greater mass.

Also yes, he sounds extremely arrogant, perhaps because he liked to glorify himself and thought it was useful.

Useful because through loving devotion or even simply gazing into the eyes of the teacher with openness can help you enter into their state, I can say this because I have experienced it myself with some teachers (by the way, it was always so shocking I resisted and came back into my own state).

And saying he is the 7th stage realizer, the One and Only Enlightened Person, stuff like that, is something that I also think is ridiculous, but the funny thing about this enlightenment thing is that He Is You, which is what he says, so then how can he actually put himself above Ramana Maharshi etc. If he is them..

- It's a bit too long now to read the whole thing and comment on it, I may do so later, and I feel like I said the most important things so far.

_ All in all, I can say also, I have experienced quite some beautiful and benevolent dreams with this manifestation of the universe (though I dream a lot in general), and from the videos he is incredibly wise, funny and deep, and he left a community of genuine people, whose core value is serious devotion to Truth, Love and Devotion, and left quite a few western Ashrams, whose communities are getting older, and who, as far as I have seen, need new young people, which is quite rare and interesting in and of itself.

Also he has said a few times, despite also having said words can certainly have use;

'It's all bullshit what the guru says, and people meditate on that' (indeed how can the truth, love, be said), or 'It's garbage what the guru says and you are suppose to throw it away', like many other great masters have said, and that 'the only reason he spoke, is there to have be a reason so people can be in the room with him', 

in my experience this is true, the relation to the guru should not be an intellectual one, but something that is suppose to go to the deepest of your heart in every moment, and that will generally not happen through intellectual contemplation, so probably also quite easily misunderstood in this sense.

Edited October 27, 2019 by AlwaysBeNice

[AlwaysBeNice]

Never the less, the accusative reports also seem compelling and disturbing. Unfortunate and somewhat frustrating to see, as I would imagine they have truth to them as well, and becoming part of this organization would have had a lot of good potential.

[AlwaysBeNice]

Warning: negativity drama:

It honestly kind of pissed me off, I don't think so many of these accusations are just all of them lies..

I don't know, he may even had semi-positive intentions, wanting actually test people, help them breakthrough.. it may have been all good and all lies, but then it's a pitty so many people have tainted his work (and I just don't think that's very likely either from what I've gathered, though I hope it)..

--

It seems like he just played fire, in his experimentations,

his devotional experimentation too, getting carried away by it, getting angry at the poor results, not wanting to disappoint people either> not admit his mistakes, getting more carried away it perhaps.

Why he had to do that, he had such inspirational and true dharma even, very wise, super charismatic, could have been a perfect sign post, but it seems like he stained it at some points, I guess it's also just not easy leading a spiritual community and have so many people look up to you etc. though on the videos he always seemed to do well.

Kind of a mystery, surely a deeply spiritual presence still. 

edit: and still worth saying that he still lived a very good life for the most part, 90-95-99%, who knows.. oh well, may you be happy

edit 2:But what is unacceptable to me, is that despite his good behavior over all, and probably good intentions overall, he went all-in on his Avatar status, yet then (probably) not even living up to that standard of also great behavior. Pity.

 

Edited October 28, 2019 by AlwaysBeNice

[Nahm]

Ester Hicks. Yep. Again. Still. 

[Wisebaxter]

Of all the teachers I've come across, which isn't a huge amount admittedly, Matt Kahn seems to have the deepest wisdom, which just flows out of him. I often find myself wondering 'how does the fucker know so much?' It's almost inhuman. Ok, so knowledge is mind based, but the effect that Matt's words have on me is instantaneous, on a deeper level than just the mind. I can feel my whole being just light up and start to buzz. He does the whole transference thing and these 'repeat after me's' which feel like they're clearing bullshit out of my system. I've had a shift in consciousness since finding him and devouring his teachings about five months ago. His approach of choosing love as the answer to everything just works for me. It's cut down on all my spiritual busy work massively and put an end to the neurosis surrounding it. His shit just.... Works. His approach to me, is the closest thing I've come across to how I'd imagine Jesus rolled. 

Ultimately though, something tells me it's down to the individual, where their consciousness is at, their particular issues. I needed Matt's gentle, feminine, loving approach to help me work on my big ass shadow. Really, Matt Kahn is a beast when it comes to shadow work. That's pretty much the core of it. I also like the way he's careful with the language he uses to talk about the ego. There seems to be a tendency to demonise the ego in a lot of circles, so you walk around scared of your own shadow and not seeing it as an aspect of divinity. He says it's just your wounded, neglected inner child that needs love in order to feel safe again. So far, treating my pain that way has been very healing for me. It helps you to welcome it with loving arms. He says that this new feminine, heart centred approach is needed to balance out and compliment the older, more masculine teachings. So it's merging wisdom with love. He's funny as hell as well. 

Oh and apparently when he was born he shocked doctors by spontaneously adopting the Cobra pose! Hahaha. In yoga it represents a willingness to transcend the materials realms. I did piss myseld laughing when I heard that. Not sure how true it is of course. Watch the first 10 seconds of this clip where its mentioned:

 

 

Edited October 28, 2019 by Wisebaxter

[Wisebaxter]

@NahmAre you kidding around about Ester? I wasn't too sure. I've found some of her teachings helpful but I haven't delved that deep. I'm pretty much turned off to Law Attraction stuff nowadays. Not that I ever gave it much of a go. Always seemed a bit counter productive to imply that the present moment isn't already perfection. I'm 99% sure you're kidding. Is it the LOA stuff you don't like? Or the channelling? 

Edited October 28, 2019 by Wisebaxter

[Nahm]

@Wisebaxter No, I wasn’t kidding. There’s a full circle of magical thinking. A mind blowing actuality of creation, and relatively speaking, no one is in the ‘pocket’ like Ester. Loosely speaking, it would take years for someone new to her teaching to get a glimpse of the actuality she is pointing to. You could say that about any teacher, about reality and self in general, but every other teacher has discernible limits (“ime”). Another way to say that, is Ive not experienced a teacher who doesn’t stand to learn more, from her. 

[Wisebaxter]

2 hours ago, Nahm said:

@Wisebaxter No, I wasn’t kidding. There’s a full circle of magical thinking. A mind blowing actuality of creation, and relatively speaking, no one is in the ‘pocket’ like Ester. Loosely speaking, it would take years for someone new to her teaching to get a glimpse of the actuality she is pointing to. You could say that about any teacher, about reality and self in general, but every other teacher has discernible limits (“ime”). Another way to say that, is Ive not experienced a teacher who doesn’t stand to learn more, from her. 

@Nahm I read 'Ask and it is Given' and thought it was great. I still haven't gotten around to trying out the practices though. I stumbled upon Matt Kahn shortly afterwards and have been in an intense love affair with him ever since

I'll certainly dive back into Ester then at some point, having heard this from you. I've only scratched the surface. 

[Nahm]

@Wisebaxter I hear ya. I’ve often thought, wouldn’t it be great, if someone wrote a book that goes beyond the practices of law of attraction, so I could simply see that it is the actuality, that it is already the case. 

[AlwaysBeNice]

I got into Bashar when I first started, most dysfunctional years of my life, to each their own I guess.

[Aaron p]

@AlwaysBeNice leo is by far the best teacher. He is extremely powerful in his teaching methods and extremely dynamic. very wise

[zeroISinfinity]

Yeah lets speak about pre apocalypse and breadcrumbs. Or how Heart perfectly manifests and destroys your devil or donkey whatever. 

For me it was psychology at first and Heart God damn Heart. Typed master psychology on YouTube and @Leo Gura videos came about. What I saw "oh look stoic dude" exactly like me. Speaks about minimalism and other stuff that deeply resonated with me. It seemed like some sort of my own reflection. (What a set up that was All along, Laughing now).

Deep down I Just knew "This is it", somehow I Just knew, intuition I dunno. But Leo's videos are not What waked me up it was practises. Then I actually realized What Leo's videos actually are. Complete fucking mindfuck. It was really like OMFG moment. Leo's videos were Me whole time and I couldn't beleive it. It was such a shock. How? What sorcery is THIS. ❤️?‍♂️

Greatest Master of All times forever and ever is Self (❤️) 

Edited October 29, 2019 by zeroISinfinity

[MusicalPotato]

Do you really want to know the greatest master of our time? It isn't me, It's definitely not Leo, and there is no way that it is any guru or teacher that you know of. Unless of course, that teacher is you. You are the greatest master of our time, congrats. It doesn't really change anything, does it?

[AlwaysBeNice]

That's true, and it doesn't in a way and relatively speaking we can talk of embodiment and achievements.

What is impressive for example, to me, is to lead a whole movement of people to a better and communal life.

Adi Da truly was a master at this I think, unsurpassed aside from Osho, with whom things also went South (tho idk the whole story, and afaik it wasnt so much his fault.

Adi Da also left many accounts also of people coming into his company or helping people through many extraordinary yogic stories, and had very powerful darshans.

Just seems he got corrupted to some degree at the end, attached to his way of teaching and to being the figure head, is what it seems to me.

Leo is great, but is also only in this just for what, 4 years? It's young in that regard, albeit developed for it's short time scale. Personally I find he says a lot of great things, is very effective at impacting a large audience.

I only read the forum avidly, so I only lnow about that, he sometimes here says things I still find just wrong sometimes.

This is a pretty cool creation tho, this forum.

Though the real test, you could say i think, of a potential spiritual leader, lies in if they can create great community or communities, that are devoted and very developed, that can then inspire many more people directly who come in person, and how the Realizer's relationships are, how well they lead, not get carried away with fame or status. Can remain established in high love.

Of course that is just one expression envisioned by my young mind, one can stay low key as well or what ever.