Does Society Work on Power or Competence?

[Shroomdoctor]

After watching both a lot of JP's talks on Society and Leo's viewpoint on society, I have come to the following very important question.

What does society, wealth, and sucess work on and how is the "pyramid sheme" or the "dominance hierachy" based on:

Power or Competence?

I would like to have a discussion on that and see your various viewpoint, as I myself try to find out which of those is true.

Especially I would like to hear @Leo Gura's opinion on that specific question.

[Zigzag Idiot]

There's an old saying that sex is what makes the world go around. Gurdjieff countered this notion saying it's not sex that makes the world go around but negativity does. The momentum of the world is propelled by negative emotion and this is a major ingredient in spiritual sleep.

This is connected with the idea of awakening and not being a puppet of reactivity in accord with group think. People are afraid of being alienated from the herd. Projection comes from the subconscious in which people extract elements they don't want to be responsible for and then pin it on others in their outer world. Many have connected this tendency with the phenomena of scapegoating others. Let's find someone to scapegoat so we can relax for the time being while it's someone else in the spotlight. Stuck in duality of good and bad, (blue) sheeple of fear point to those awful sinners. The (orange) ambitious materialists point to the unambitious ignorant losers sustained by others tax dollars. Better not become one of them,,,, The (green) self righteousnessly condemn those in the territory they have just traveled through,,,

This idea of negativity propelling the world would align more with power than competence. Look at the news media and how people's attention becomes hooked or the advertising industry sending a constant barrage of messages telling us what we should want or be afraid of and how it splits one against themselves in comparison to others. The fundamentalists of the religions constantly shaming people and instilling fear,,,,

I could go on but instead of a nickel, I'll stop at two cents.

[Yonkon]

I think it's beneficial to acquire competence over gaining power to influence and shape the world. When you are in addition also skilled in your field then you are well set i guess.

Edited May 17, 2019 by Yonkon

[tenta]

Jordan Peterson would NEVER admit hierarchies aren't based on competence.

[UDT]

On 5/17/2019 at 0:50 PM, Shroomdoctor said:

After watching both a lot of JP's talks on Society and Leo's viewpoint on society, I have come to the following very important question.

What does society, wealth, and sucess work on and how is the "pyramid sheme" or the "dominance hierachy" based on:

Power or Competence?

I would like to have a discussion on that and see your various viewpoint, as I myself try to find out which of those is true.

Especially I would like to hear @Leo Gura's opinion on that specific question.

Its a mixture, it depends on the hierarchy. 

society is a hierarchy upon purchasing power

purchasing power is aquired through sub-hierarchies which are either power or competence based. 

The more we as a world move towards competency hierarchies, the better we will be able to live in peace

 

[Wyatt]

I think you need to define power better. Power comes in many forms: money, prestige, physical strength, willpower, aggressiveness. Do you mean hierarchical power? Like a slaveowner has power over a slave? A boss having power over an employee? A person having power over himself?

The dominance hierarchy and economic 'pyramid scheme' aren't based on the standard definition of power. They focus on what you were born into. Were you born in a healthy body? Were you born a good-looking person? Were you born with a functional brain? Do your parents have lots of money? Then you will probably benefit from all of these things and be high on the social hierarchy. If you are given a lot, you will have even more. If you aren't given much, you may end up with less. That's the nature of society right now. 

Also, there are so many different facets of society that are constantly in motion and changing. Each person and each group values things a little bit different than any other. Some highly value power and dominance, others value intelligence and knowledge and competency. If you want to find out more about what traits different groups value, study spiral dynamics.