What percentage of people do you think are liberated?

[Ponder]

Please don’t lock this thread for trolling, because I think this question is actually helpful and interesting to explore. 

The reason I ask this question is because I think that there are a lot of enlightened people out there who don’t show any signs of enlightenment. 

Ram Dass talks about how your mum, who stays at home cleaning and cooking all the time could be enlightened, while you go to some Indian Ashram in the hunt for this elusive ‘goal.’ 

I listen to a lot of underground rappers on soundcloud and, based on their lyrics, they sound enlightened to me. Enlightenment means you basically don’t give a fuck about anything. Literally.

I’m of the personal belief that this term ‘zen devil’ that Leo has come up with is actually an egoic construct trying to impose itself on how an enlightened being should behave. 

Thoughts? 

Edited May 13, 2019 by Ponder

[Inliytened1]

I don't know but i wish there were more.  I had a mystical experience today and im still feeling the bliss sensation.

I see everything as One so crystal clear its heart wrenching.  And i can make the shift in consciousness between the finite and the infinite.

Edited May 13, 2019 by Inliytened1

[zeroISinfinity]

@Inliytened1 You become THE TRUTH or something different? Yeah it always emotional as hell. I shout like moron but do not have desire to get "there anymore. Just pouring THAT is fine. 

[Inliytened1]

@zeroISinfinity i felt a massive force it was terrifying and beautiful simultaneously.  I think it was all of Infinity.  The godhead.

I did not surrender..but i was weeping and screaming like a little baby.

And it has me blissing out today.

[Flatworld Crusades]

11 minutes ago, Ponder said:

Please don’t lock this thread for trolling, because I think this question is actually helpful and interesting to explore. 

The reason I ask this question is because I think that there are a lot of enlightened people out there who don’t show any signs of enlightenment. 

Ram Dass talks about how your mum, who stays at home cleaning and cooking all the time could be enlightened, while you go to some Indian Ashram in the hunt for this elusive ‘goal.’ 

I listen to a lot of underground rappers on soundcloud and, based on their lyrics, they sound enlightened to me. Enlightenment means you basically don’t give a fuck about anything. Literally.

I’m of the personal belief that this term ‘zen devil’ that Leo has come up with is actually an egoic construct trying to impose itself on how an enlightened being should behave. 

Thoughts? 

I agree that there must be many people who have enlightened in a different way to your experience and to that of other members of the forum. However I disagree they show no signs of enlightenment. I think you will find there lives great compassion, kindness, love, generosity etc in their souls.  They simply have a different vocab to you and their spiritual practices would be varied. 

I also disagree about enlightened individuals not giving a fuck about anything.  Living to their values they would encounter many situations involving others, however being enlightened or even highly aware they simply choose to not get involved at times or know where their place and responsibility is, so once again they choose the right path for themselves. 

[DrewNows]

While I see enlightenment to be unique to the individual with differing degrees of delusion/expression, either everyone or no one is enlightened.

Are you enlightened enough? If not, will you ever be? 

[Forestluv]

The ego loves the narrative that it will figure this thing out, become enlightened and act however it pleases. Not only does this keep the ego in The Game, it is the star of the show! ? 

[Inliytened1]

@DrewNows its all relative in the end.

[Joseph Maynor]

Liberated from what exactly?  If one believes that they're liberated, they should be able to state what they're liberated from.  Just to say I'm liberated without giving that from what is liable to be an incomplete idea and/or a half-baked thought.

Edited May 13, 2019 by Joseph Maynor

[ajasatya]

@Ponder you're still projecting a lot of pride/status onto this, as if enlightenment made some people better than others somehow.

there is no prize, no pride, no winner, no loser. enlightenment is a phenomenon of the universe, like a volcano, a nimble, a river or a super nova.

Edited May 13, 2019 by ajasatya

[Inliytened1]

@Ponder Ponder what have you become conscious of during your mystical experiences?  Did you experience bliss?

For me Absolute Love = God so when I've had my experiences i felt how powerful Absolute Love is.  

 

[zeroISinfinity]

@Inliytened1Yup Very much, it is terrifying. That is what reality is. "Nothingness" 

[mandyjw]

We're all like radios, we have to tune into a channel. It's not that you can be enlightened or not. You can be in tune or out of tune. Sometimes you'll talk to your Mom and she will be an enlightened master. Other times she will be very unconscious. Our own state of consciousness also somewhat determines states of consciousness or attunement from other people. We mirror them, and them us. 

[jbram2002]

I think the number of people who believe they are enlightened is significantly higher than the number who actually are. I'd almost wager that none of us are enlightened, even those who we hold as enlightened masters. There are people who have awakened to something deeper, but I'm not convinced anyone has truly attained enlightenment yet.

[mandyjw]

@jbram2002 There was that one video Eckhart Tolle I saw where he had a cold, and I think he was pretty annoyed with the world. 

[jbram2002]

@mandyjw Never underestimate the man cold! Even enlightened masters cannot withstand its power!

[mandyjw]

@jbram2002

YOU'RE RIGHT! I have to forgive him the man cold don't I?  

[Ananta]

@mandyjw @jbram2002

Curious, since you're married, are you sitting next to each other, across the room or in seperate rooms while posting?

[jbram2002]

@Anna1 We have our own computers. I'm in the living room with our adorable daughter and Mandy is in the next room over with a great view of our backyard.

[Ananta]

Just now, jbram2002 said:

@Anna1 We have our own computers. I'm in the living room with our adorable daughter and Mandy is in the next room over with a great view of our backyard.

Hehe, thanks!

I was picturing you both in recliners in the living room on cell phones. Boy, was I wrong.