I did push and pull to a girl and she get mad HAHAHA! How can i counter this?

[John Iverson]

7 hours ago, Andreas said:

Why do you feel the need for improvement?

That's my one of my values, it feels so good to expand your self, i am motivated from inner to outer i vision myself in to someone higher self it makes me go out there and ace life

[Andreas]

1 hour ago, John Iverson said:

That's my one of my values, it feels so good to expand your self, i am motivated from inner to outer i vision myself in to someone higher self it makes me go out there and ace life

How would you feel if you just stopped? 

[Leo Gura]

@John Iverson Push-pull is a very delicate game. You shouldn't do it much over text or message. You must do it in-person. Text does not give you enough cues to know how the girl is reacting.

In a face-to-face conversation you can quickly apologize like: "I was just joking. I actually love you. I want you to have my babies." But you cannot do that via text. It looks too weird and creepy.

DO NOT try to attract women via text! It never works. Texts are purely for setting up a date and keeping in touch. Don't get overly cute via texts or you will lose many girls that way. Attraction must be built in-person. No amount of text game will compensate for shitting face-to-face game.

Sarcasm and self-deprecating humor also does not work well via texts. Because texts do not convey enough information.

[MM1988]

On 23.4.2019 at 4:22 AM, Leo Gura said:

@John Iverson Push-pull is a very delicate game. You shouldn't do it much over text or message. You must do it in-person. Text does not give you enough cues to know how the girl is reacting.

In a face-to-face conversation you can quickly apologize like: "I was just joking. I actually love you. I want you to have my babies." But you cannot do that via text. It looks too weird and creepy.

DO NOT try to attract women via text! It never works. Texts are purely for setting up a date and keeping in touch. Don't get overly cute via texts or you will lose many girls that way. Attraction must be built in-person. No amount of text game will compensate for shitting face-to-face game.

Sarcasm and self-deprecating humor also does not work well via texts. Because texts do not convey enough information.

But how will you test the waters. I always thought do nothing over text. So I just set up to meet with a girl and we had a conversation and out of the blue I took her hand and another girl I tried to kiss. Both times they were shocked and I was rejected.

Then I see what other guys write to girls, like really "gay" stuff with heart smileys and shit. And girls seem to go crazy for it, these guys have a deeper connection with her than the guy who only writes her in a matter-of-fact style and then tries to get physical out of the blue.

Havent you seen that when a girl fancies a guy they text each other all the time, shes constantly on her phone. A PUA would tell you to never do that and ignore her. I listened to this PUA stuff, set all these rules for myself what to do and what not to do and it backfired in my face every time. I'm still working on getting all these PUA concepts out of my head, its pure neurotic poison, thats just what it is.

 

I think your advice on this topic is heavily biased by your PUA phase Leo. No offense at all but I think If dating happened naturally and not in a forced way as a PUA late in your 20s I think your advice on this would be A LOT different. 

Edited April 24, 2019 by MM1988

[universe]

@MM1988 If you like to text a lot, do that! Some people are just not into that. The fact that there are girls constantly on the phone chatting with their boys doesnt mean that everyone has to do it now. 

I really dislike texting because of the things that Leo listed. And I simply dont feel like doing it that much.

If a girl cant live with that - ok. We are not meant to be together maybe.

[Spiral]

“You look great... compared to the other girls here.” It’s a boring example but it’s not rude, it’s just not really a compliment.

Edited April 26, 2019 by Spiral

[Leo Gura]

On 4/24/2019 at 1:25 AM, MM1988 said:

Then I see what other guys write to girls, like really "gay" stuff with heart smileys and shit. And girls seem to go crazy for it, these guys have a deeper connection with her than the guy who only writes her in a matter-of-fact style and then tries to get physical out of the blue.

Havent you seen that when a girl fancies a guy they text each other all the time, shes constantly on her phone. A PUA would tell you to never do that and ignore her. I listened to this PUA stuff, set all these rules for myself what to do and what not to do and it backfired in my face every time. I'm still working on getting all these PUA concepts out of my head, its pure neurotic poison, thats just what it is.

I think your advice on this topic is heavily biased by your PUA phase Leo. No offense at all but I think If dating happened naturally and not in a forced way as a PUA late in your 20s I think your advice on this would be A LOT different. 

I was only talking about pre-sex communications. Once you have sex with her, then you can text her more seriously.

You must distinguish between pre-sex and post-sex behaviors. They are very different.

Pre-sex, while you're dating, there must be some gaming going on. After she falls in love with you, you can cut the gaming.

You don't need to manipulate her too much via text. The key is not to display neediness and desperation. The biggest mistake made with pre-sex texting is that the guy fucks it up by trying to say too much, trying to be too edgy/cocky/funny. Trying to attract her via text doesn't work. So actually my advice is to not game girls via text. Use texting mostly to handle dating logistics laced with bits of humor.

Make your texts totally non-needy and unimportant. Don't be sending her long letters via text. Never try to logically convince her of meeting you. All that crap will blow you out very fast.

Here are good kinds of texts pre-sex:

• Hey gurl, let's grab a coffee.
• Coffee! Lets go
• Saw this shirt at Walmart and thought it would be perfect for you [insert pic of ugly shirt]
• Meow...
• Moo
• Hey dork
• Let's hang out
• When you free this week?
• Let's do something this week
• How's the recovery going? (from last night's club/bar)
• You're the weirdest gurl I met last night.
• I want to build you a mansion out of Legos and stock it with exotic baby animals.
• Reading a book
• Chillin by the pool
• Making juice
• Clipping my toe nails, thought you should know
• Trimming my nose hair, thought you should know
• Going to club XXXXX tonight. You?
• You remind me of a dog I just saw
• You seem great and all but I'm trying to figure out what's wrong with you. I bet you snore like a pig.
• I want to stick a scorpion in your pants
• Hope this isn't too forward but I mailed you this basket of puppies [insert pic of basket of puppies]
  • A few of them might arrive dead, I was too cheap to swing for overnight shipping

That kind of stuff. Keep it lite and chill. Zero investment is key.

This is the extent of pre-sex texting.

NEVER, EVER get sexual via text unless you've already had sex with her a few times. It comes off way too creepy and needy. Act like you don't care about sex.

[Staples]

@Leo Gura : NEVER, EVER get sexual via text.

Also Leo: I want to stick a scorpion in your pants

 

Edited April 25, 2019 by Staples

[MM1988]

4 hours ago, Leo Gura said:

I was only talking about pre-sex communications. Once you have sex with her, then you can text her more seriously.

You must distinguish between pre-sex and post-sex behaviors. They are very different.

Pre-sex, while you're dating, there must be some gaming going on. After she falls in love with you, you can cut the gaming.

You don't need to manipulate her too much via text. The key is not to display neediness and desperation. The biggest mistake made with pre-sex texting is that the guy fucks it up by trying to say too much, trying to be too edgy/cocky/funny. Trying to attract her via text doesn't work. So actually my advice is to not game girls via text. Use texting mostly to handle dating logistics laced with bits of humor.

Make your texts totally non-needy and unimportant. Don't be sending her long letters via text. Never try to logically convince her of meeting you. All that crap will blow you out very fast.

Here are good kinds of texts pre-sex:

• Hey gurl, let's grab a coffee.
• Coffee! Lets go
• Saw this shirt at Walmart and thought it would be perfect for you [insert pic of ugly shirt]
• Meow...
• Moo
• Hey dork
• Let's hang out
• When you free this week?
• Let's do something this week
• How's the recovery going? (from last night's club/bar)
• You're the weirdest gurl I met last night.
• I want to build you a mansion out of Legos and stock it with exotic baby animals.
• Reading a book
• Chillin by the pool
• Making juice
• Clipping my toe nails, thought you should know
• Trimming my nose hair, thought you should know
• Going to club XXXXX tonight. You?
• You remind me of a dog I just saw
• You seem great and all but I'm trying to figure out what's wrong with you. I bet you snore like a pig.
• I want to stick a scorpion in your pants
• Hope this isn't too forward but I mailed you this basket of puppies [insert pic of basket of puppies]
  • A few of them might arrive dead, I was too cheap to swing for overnight shipping

That kind of stuff. Keep it lite and chill. Zero investment is key.

This is the extent of pre-sex texting.

NEVER, EVER get sexual via text unless you've already had sex with her a few times. It comes off way too creepy and needy. Act like you don't care about sex.

Great list and all but my point is more meta. Even this distinction of pre-sex, post-sex. 

If you edit a text file on your computer called "pre sex texts" you have to seriously stop for a moment and ask yourself what you are doing here.

Just imagine you are the girl in this situation and you think you have a light hearted conversation with a cool normal dude when in reality hes thinking about pre-sex, post-sex texts neediness, etc. Its all a facade and its going to blow up in your face.

 

If you care about sex, act like you care about sex. At least thatd authentic. If it turns off 10 girls in a row this will self regulate and you wont do it anymore intuitively.

Edited April 25, 2019 by MM1988

[Leo Gura]

@MM1988 There is skill and there are principles to dating, just like there is with golf, tennis, driving a car, or meditation.

You are framing what I said as "This is so inauthentic and artificial". But once you actually internalize the skill of proper texting, it will become authentic and natural.

Every skill you learned was at one point inauthentic and artificial, from mathematics to reading to writing to typing on the computer.

I am not saying you need to keep a file of canned text messages. Once you understand the principles of texting with a girl, you can generate an infinite number of spontaneous texts. Without learning this skill, your text messages will suck and you will lose girls by committing stupid mistakes which only years later will you understand why.

People expect to be good at sex and dating "naturally" without any deliberate practice. Because love is supposed to be "natural". This is a silly double-standard. Nowhere else in life do you adopt this attitude. If you want to be good at something you must train and recognize principles. Girls will appreciate it when you don't creep them out with your texts.

[kindayellow]

How did you even find this forum? 

 

Please watch more of Leo's videos on relationships and continue your journey

[bejapuskas]

10 hours ago, Leo Gura said:

@MM1988 There is skill and there are principles to dating, just like there is with golf, tennis, driving a car, or meditation.

You are framing what I said as "This is so inauthentic and artificial". But once you actually internalize the skill of proper texting, it will become authentic and natural.

Can you apply this rule to ANY habbit? Like lying for example?

[Leo Gura]

@bejapuskas Being the devil that you are, you are already a master at lying. So no need to practice it any more.

[sustainably]

On 4/25/2019 at 11:27 AM, Leo Gura said:

I want to stick a scorpion in your pants

Wait whaaaaat? !!!!!

I would never ever dare to text this to a girl. It obviously sounds very scary and creepy.

At the same time it can be sexual. Do you really think this is ok pre-sex?

[Commodent]

@Leo Gura So you condone this kind of manipulative behavior? Inflicting harm on others in order to attain some hidden goal?

[bejapuskas]

@Leo Gura  Ok  Maybe my question was unclear, I'll try to be more direct - what does the word authentic mean to you? (I've already tried contemplating it, but maybe I need to go through some paradigm shift?)

[Leo Gura]

10 hours ago, Commodent said:

@Leo Gura So you condone this kind of manipulative behavior? Inflicting harm on others in order to attain some hidden goal?

Dating is a game. Don't act too above it. This is otherwise known as flirtation. It does not harm a girl to send her some flirty texts.

What she doesn't want is needy creept texts.

[Leo Gura]

12 hours ago, sustainably said:

Wait whaaaaat? !!!!!

I would never ever dare to text this to a girl. It obviously sounds very scary and creepy.

At the same time it can be sexual. Do you really think this is ok pre-sex?

You must understand that all such texts are highly context-sensitive. So you don't just robotically send such a text randomly to a girl.

For example, I once sent that exact scorpion text to a girl because the day before at the bar she told me that she had scorpion pests in her neighborhood (she lived in Vegas). So it was a great text for her.

If you think that text is sexual that's you reading that into it.

[kieranperez]

On 4/25/2019 at 0:20 PM, Leo Gura said:

You are framing what I said as "This is so inauthentic and artificial". But once you actually internalize the skill of proper texting, it will become authentic and natural.

The lightbulb that just went off from reading this was huge...

[John Iverson]

On 4/25/2019 at 5:27 PM, Leo Gura said:

I was only talking about pre-sex communications. Once you have sex with her, then you can text her more seriously.

You must distinguish between pre-sex and post-sex behaviors. They are very different.

Pre-sex, while you're dating, there must be some gaming going on. After she falls in love with you, you can cut the gaming.

You don't need to manipulate her too much via text. The key is not to display neediness and desperation. The biggest mistake made with pre-sex texting is that the guy fucks it up by trying to say too much, trying to be too edgy/cocky/funny. Trying to attract her via text doesn't work. So actually my advice is to not game girls via text. Use texting mostly to handle dating logistics laced with bits of humor.

Make your texts totally non-needy and unimportant. Don't be sending her long letters via text. Never try to logically convince her of meeting you. All that crap will blow you out very fast.

Here are good kinds of texts pre-sex:

• Hey gurl, let's grab a coffee.
• Coffee! Lets go
• Saw this shirt at Walmart and thought it would be perfect for you [insert pic of ugly shirt]
• Meow...
• Moo
• Hey dork
• Let's hang out
• When you free this week?
• Let's do something this week
• How's the recovery going? (from last night's club/bar)
• You're the weirdest gurl I met last night.
• I want to build you a mansion out of Legos and stock it with exotic baby animals.
• Reading a book
• Chillin by the pool
• Making juice
• Clipping my toe nails, thought you should know
• Trimming my nose hair, thought you should know
• Going to club XXXXX tonight. You?
• You remind me of a dog I just saw
• You seem great and all but I'm trying to figure out what's wrong with you. I bet you snore like a pig.
• I want to stick a scorpion in your pants
• Hope this isn't too forward but I mailed you this basket of puppies [insert pic of basket of puppies]
  • A few of them might arrive dead, I was too cheap to swing for overnight shipping

That kind of stuff. Keep it lite and chill. Zero investment is key.

This is the extent of pre-sex texting.

NEVER, EVER get sexual via text unless you've already had sex with her a few times. It comes off way too creepy and needy. Act like you don't care about sex.

How about if I am using a dating app like bumble? In that case I am not really sure about this, but isn't it that most of the girls want to invest some time first before they wannahang out? It is like for what I understand from what you said here is all of that stuff is only my intro? And as soon as possible, take her on a date and meet her in person.. like meow hey lets date? Tomorrow? Haha

and what should I do is to have a conversation with a girl that it is not serious? And No personal question?

Edited April 28, 2019 by John Iverson