Alternating between enlightenment and total hopelessness

[Dumb Enlightened]

Hey guys, I've been going through a situation and if someone can relate to or has gone to the same, I'd appreciate some advice. A couple of days ago I've started to experience a felling of total hopelessness, after a few awakenings that I had a couple of weeks before. Not knowing what to do I start to meditate and trying to let go of it, and this resulted in a greater enlightenment experience, a state of total peace and serenity. The next day, the identification with the ego was back, and then all its fears start to come to the surface, again I tried to meditate and to let go of it, another awakening happened making all the fears vanish, and a kept meditating resulting in an even deeper enlightenment, it was so intense it was kind of scary, And when this experiences happen, the problems or fears, or anything.. don't matter anymore, so I didn't even think about, the identification with the ego was gone completely..

But the problem is that it doesn't last, so today I woke up with the same dread and feeling of hopeless, so that contrast between the two "states" is so huge, that it makes the situation even worse...I'm tired of this, I don't know what it is happening nor what to do about.

[Jkris]

@Dumb Enlightened enlightenment is absence of identity. Can you pls explain the difference between the enlightenment and deeper enlightenment experience? 

[Dumb Enlightened]

9 minutes ago, Jkris said:

@Dumb Enlightened enlightenment is absence of identity. Can you pls explain the difference between the enlightenment and deeper enlightenment experience? 

Leo talks about the facets of the absolute, you can experience one facet of it, for example the no self, but you don't necessary experience at the same time the love facet.

You can experience the no self , you are not attached to the body, but you don't necessary have the realization that you are eternal and immortal. Dr. David Hawkins has the map of consciousness that calibrate the levels of consciousness a human body can experience, I think it is very interesting. What happened to me was, I was not identified with the body/mind anymore, There was a deep sense of peace and serenity, all worries, problems, were gone, it is a state of total satisfaction.

Suddenly it's almost like a lightning hitting me, out of nowhere, and everything start to get really still, the world like gets in slow motion I guess, until is like everything stops, there's no time anymore, there's a feeling that is so massively strong that is even scary, the body freaks out, and I can't comprehend what the hell was going on

[purerogue]

What  is happening is completely normal , you enter state where there is almost no mind and ego , then after sleep, you lose hold of it , probably happens not just after sleep, but you feel most negative effect after sleep. 

Why it happens should be obvious for you, as of suggestion I would say to slow down and do some self inquiry, or just simply slow down and get used to both mind and no  mind states, but if you really want to move further, which again i would not advise to rush , you should focus on how you got  to that state in first place, so it becomes as your second nature to get there and with time you should be able to go deeper in it, have it trough all of your day and night. 

Good luck , just do not rush it , as it gets rather strange further. 

[mandyjw]

You've created a separation between your normal life and your meditative states. You need to watch your thoughts as you go about everyday life. You cannot expect meditation to fix your thoughts when your mind is active throughout the day, you must bring space and bits of meditation in throughout the day. 

Eckhart Tolle is an AMAZING teacher for doing just that. 

 

[Jkris]

@Dumb Enlightened ???

[pointessa]

The ego is desperate and it can be very, very convincing. When experiencing higher frequency consciousness it doesn't seem possible to go back to believing what the unbalanced ego has to offer, but it does happen. I guess that is just part of the process of awakening. As mandyjw suggested, Eckhart Tolle could be of great benefit for you. He can help you see the mechanisms of the egoic self as well as finding space.

[Ananta]

Sounds like your meditations took you into Nirvikalpa samadhi. Samadhi's will come and go. They have a benefit so long as you can extrapolate the knowledge from them, that "you are that", but then this knowledge has to be assimilated into daily life. Meaning apply this Self-knowledge to every experience you have. Are you the body/mind mechanism or are you awareness/Self/Brahman having a human experience? 

[FoxFoxFox]

@Dumb Enlightened Keep going back into that peaceful state. Eventually it will stick. What you are experiencing is fairly typical of successful meditators. 

[Dumb Enlightened]

@purerogue I was thinking about that, how did it happen, It happened by letting go of personal will, I didn't do self inquiry much, because while doing the letting go, feeling the feelings that I was experiencing and allowing them to be there, they vanished and with them the self identification, so there was no point in self inquiry anymore, but now , when I lose the hold of it, I will self inquiry about it, who is losing, who is suffering

 

@mandyjw That's true, the problem is that the difference between the two states is so massive that the normal self identification is becoming unbearable; and it's not that the higher consciousness stay only when I meditate, it sometimes comes out of nowhere during the day, and it stays during other activities, like walking to work, for example. I'll read Tolle's book again, I've read it before, I think it was the second book I read about the subject, but it's been a while

 

@pointessa That's exactly what I was thinking, In higher states of consciousness one doesn't even think about the possibility of falling asleep again, it seems absurd and impossible, it's like the identification with the self/ego has never even existed, but then the illusion comes back,

@Anna1 I'm not being able to do that, it's like the mind is coming full force, all the pain, suffer, fears from the ego are coming to the surface, almost at the same time, so the realization from before seems blocked by all of it,

@FoxFoxFox 'm trying to do that, actually it is happening by its on I guess, I'm not a great meditator I guess, my meditations don't last more than a couple of hours, these states are kinda coming and going by their on, as I was having lunch today, I felt a deep peace and stillness, coming out of nowhere, but then later it fades and then the mind kicks in, and this alternation sucks, it is happening lots of times through the day

[Truth Addict]

@Dumb Enlightened

Your capacity to feeling your emotions grows with your awareness.

The more false layers of yourself you remove, the closer you get to your true self, and therefore, you become more sensitive to everything, including positive and negative emotions.

Recognise that all of the negative emotions are derived from your thoughts, try remember that all the time.

Every time you feel fear or depression for example, remember that you are creating them, and accept that.

Your emotions are there to protect you. Welcome them 

[SriBhagwanYogi]

@Dumb Enlightened Having same expirience one day there is only peacefull awarness, pure consciousness, then another moneky mind on rage cant fo back to that place wich was effortles 

 

 

[WelcometoReality]

@Dumb Enlightened  The movement between the transcended state and the personal state is normal in the beginning. 

this thread might be helpful:

Also this video is about the "journey" after awakening.

 

[Javad]

I personally haven't experienced enlightenment yet, but i feel like this might help.

This seems to be a problem of balance in growth. If you grow your spiritual side a lot, to a point that you've had multiple and deeper enlightenment experiences, but your identity self has not been getting enough notice and growth, you could experience a big disconnect.

I believe the best thing you can do might be going back, getting to know the identity self better, finding the depth of its issues (lots of which come from unconscious programming of childhood and growing up), and facing them.

You could dissolve your identity to experience enlightenment as a state, but to be a truly enlightened self, you need to actually face every bit of your identity self and deal with it. In a way, most likely there is no human that is absolutely fully enlightened, since identity most likely has infinite parts and you have to put deliberate focus on each part to grow it or dissolve it.

 

So yeah in summary, try shifting your focus on mindfulness over your identity, and dealing with the issues. Try a GOOD psychologist who also has an understanding of enlightenment. Helps a lot.

[FoxFoxFox]

@Dumb Enlightened Don't just do it when you are meditating. Try to never leave the peace even when you engage with life. 

[Gabriel Antonio]

Dude, first of all, quit any spiritual practices you’re doing.

In reality, you’re probably suffering from depression (and likely bipolar disorder). So seek professional help! Doing spiritual gymnastics won’t help you.

[Nadosa]

Yeah give him more information, so that he feels even more insecure. Seriously, assuming a mental disorder is the most annoying information a person that suffers can receive.

[Dumb Enlightened]

@Truth Addict That's exactly what I thought, because I'm sure I have been repressing all kinds of feelings for a really long time. Yesterday I was focusing on relax and let all the emotions come up without trying to get way from them, Lots of things came to the surface, and I know there's more yet to come

@SriBhagwanYogi thanks for sharing the video, all watch it !! I really like Spira, he was the first teacher that I watched and actually understood what he was talking about

@Javad The problem is I think, that before going to non duality and spirituality, I tried the main stream self-help to grow my self identity, and most of this traditional self-help doesn't deal with the core issues, they make you forget about your feelings and emotions and give techniques to change yourself, like trying control the thoughts, pretending to be who you want to be, and all sorts of non sense. I've been doing this for some years, and it has probably repressed a lot of feelings, and eventually they had to come, probably the awakening was a trigger to them

@WelcometoReality This thread perfectly described what is going on, very helpful , thanks !!!

@Gabriel Antonio  I am always open to the possibility,I am always trying to look for more options, but I can see much difference between this and depression, I had depression when I was a teen, and I got treatment, I remember the accompanying feelings were, a really strong hate towards myself, and others, a deep sense of sadness, anger, feeling like a victim from the world and life, and of course, thinking that suicide was a way out.

Right now this feeling that I was facing doesn't have any of it, it's more like how would you feel if you found out that you actually don't have any control, when all the mind is built upon the assumption that it has control, and all that people search all their lives is to control, because people don't want happiness or freedom, they want control, the mind wants to control, but it can't

but anyway, I will book an appointment with a psychiatrist, I wanted to do it for a while now, and I think now is a good time

thanks for the reply !!

@Nadosa That's true, most people who are suffering don't like to think about this possibility, and going to doctors for me was always the last option, depression is the disease that most affect people in the world (or so the medicine says), 

I know a bunch of people that the doctors diagnosed having depression and now are having to take pills everyday, just to numb them, I know people who have been taking medicine for depression for more than twenty years, people who have gone to lots of doctors and haven't gotten better, so most of the causes of depression are surely not physical,

[Markus]

@Dumb Enlightened Purges with strong negative emotions are normal on the path. Can happen pre- or post-awakening. Don't try to escape them.

[thesmileyone]

You need to connect the feeling of the Absolute that you feel when meditating, to the feeling of the Absolute that is there when not meditating. Currently, you don't feel it when not meditating by the sound of it. it is there, underneath all the garbage that is "you". Once you can connect to it in day to day life, just keep some awareness on it at all times. Over "time" it will be there more and more until eventually.... And this is where I stop giving advice because I do not know yet what happens when it is there 100% of the time outside of meditation.

And as @Markus states, there's cycles of purging constantly. Cycles of depression and it's opposite, constantly. The good news is you get used to recognizing the cycles for what they are.