does absolute ethics exist?

[Adilbek]

If God is the totality of existence, ethics should be wrong. So lying is just as good as telling the truth. Do you agree? But why do I still think that lying is bad?

[tsuki]

@Adilbek Because both lying and honesty are devil's playthings.
By being radically honest, at least you're doing a service to others so that they can be weary of you and think for themselves in your presence.

An empty mind can neither lie, nor say the truth.

 

[Highest]

Ultimately, no. 

[Leo Gura]

Since God is Absolute Truth, even a hint of lying, dishonesty, falsehood, or inathenticity automatically severes your connection to God. That is okay. It is not "bad" to be seperated from God, but it painful since you become lost in your own falsehood. That is the definition of devilry.

Lying is only "bad" relative to if you want to be happy. If you are okay with being unhappy, then lie a lot. If you want to be happy, lie as little as possible. If you want to realize God, lie as little as possible.

There is only one reason you lie: fear. If you were immortal, untouchable, and fearless you would never lie. In other words if you were God, you'd never lie. Really think about that. That's deep.

Absolute ethics is Truth/Love. It is Goodness without an opposite. It is God.

[Jkris]

@Leo Gura beautiful ?. Welcome back to the forum after your retreat. 

How was your retreat? ?

[Leo Gura]

1 minute ago, Jkris said:

@Leo Gura beautiful ?. Welcome back to the forum after your retreat. 

How was your retreat? ?

Very amazing. Thanks!

[FoxFoxFox]

@Leo Gura

Hey Leo. Welcome back. In the context of what you said here, how do you reconcile it with the idea that "there has never been ignorance in the first place?" 

Through my own direct experience with awareness, i've become conscious of the fact that life happens mysteriously through the will of God. Thoughts, words, emotions, feelings etc. ultimate showed themselves to be phenomena within a multi-sensory field of awareness, which is the true self. How then, do 'lies' cut connection to God, and whose connection do they cut to begin with?  

[OrpheusNovum]

13 minutes ago, Leo Gura said:

Very amazing. Thanks!

Any new nuggets?

[tsuki]

5 minutes ago, FoxFoxFox said:

whose connection do they cut to begin with?  

Once you're born, you are not responsible for your own birth.

[Joseph Maynor]

No, but I think Ethics is not understood right in the way Enlightenment is currently taught.  Zen has some insights here that I hope soon to be able to explicate in my writings.  On the one hand there is no Ethics, that's true, but on the other hand there is.  In Zen they talk about this as the contrast between soft and hard teachings.  Right action can be real.  In many contexts it's legit to consider right action.  But you have to be smart and not cling to this in the wrong way.

This is worthwhile to listen to as a little introduction:

 

Edited March 25, 2019 by Joseph Maynor

[Leo Gura]

@Joseph Maynor Think of ethics/morality as a matter of balance/harmony.

Being too much out of balance becomes pathological relative to one's own well-being. In short, extreme selfishness or devilry backfires.

[FoxFoxFox]

@tsuki Well that's the thing. One's real nature is not born to begin with. The thing that is born and dies is the body and the ego. Even further exploration reveals that the body and ego are not separate from reality or God. So that's why I want to know how Leo has come to the conclusion that the connection to the self can be cut in the first place. In other words, how does the illusion of ignorance comes about?

[tsuki]

6 minutes ago, FoxFoxFox said:

how does the illusion of ignorance comes about?

@FoxFoxFox Ignorance of the mind comes from its finitude. Ignorance is not an insult, but a law.
It is not in the mind's power to cut or restore the connection to the higher self.
It is not your fault to be born and it not your accomplishment to die.
"Now" is directionless. Laws of causality do not apply to it, so don't expect causal reasoning as a response.
The closest you can get is a strangeloop.

[Leo Gura]

15 minutes ago, FoxFoxFox said:

@tsuki I want to know how Leo has come to the conclusion that the connection to the self can be cut in the first place. In other words, how does the illusion of ignorance comes about?

It is not cut in actually, it is cut as an illusion.

If an actor on stage got so wrapped up in playing his character that he forgot for a moment that he was just acting, that's how ignorance comes about.

It is the nature of consciousness to be very hypnotic. It hypnotizes itself into dreamlike states which it then cannot resist.

Ever play a video game and get so immersed in the world that you forget about the "real" world? Well, that's precisely how consciousness works. Appearance becomes reality. For a while. Always only for a while.

Ever jerk off to porn? What is that? You are literally jerking off to an LCD screen! There's your illusion.

[FoxFoxFox]

@Leo Gura I understand what you were trying to say now. 

Now that you have this realization, do you agree with the notion that following peace and (true) happiness is the best compass one has when it comes to navigating life? Since peace really is the nature of consciousness, do you agree that the more peaceful one is, the more he or she is in harmony with true nature?

[Leo Gura]

@FoxFoxFox Sorta. Although violence and disturbance is also an aspect of consciousness.

There is no "best" really. It depends on your goals. Some people love their suffering and fantasies. Very few people are really ready and willing to awaken from Maya.

Harmony is a tricky thing. Being a total pacificist for example when all your neighbors are wolves will not lead to harmony but your extinction or enslavement.

Violence and peace are both necessary, which is why they co-exist. Violence begets peace, and peace begets violence. It's dialectical.

[Arhattobe]

@Leo Gura Seems like you’ve grow a lot. Congrats.

[FoxFoxFox]

@Leo Gura That does ring true. Before realizing I always thought that the world should constantly be guided towards peace and harmony, but now I find surrender the best. 

[Joseph Maynor]

7 minutes ago, FoxFoxFox said:

@Leo Gura That does ring true. Before realizing I always thought that the world should constantly be guided towards peace and harmony, but now I find surrender the best. 

Careful.  Surrender can also be a clinging to surrender.  Surrender and no surrender is a mental duality.  You don't want to cling to either horn of that artificial mind-engineered and mind-created dilemma.

Edited March 25, 2019 by Joseph Maynor

[FoxFoxFox]

@Joseph Maynor Sure, but when you realize, there is nowhere for the realization to go. It won't go back to being veiled. But yeah bringing subconscious attachments to the light for them to be purge is a must for most people.

I wrote all about it here: 

http://www.actualized.org/forum/topic/32850-the-expectation-for-something-to-happen/

 

Edited March 25, 2019 by FoxFoxFox