If everything else is an illusion, why does Leo make videos?

[Shaun]

I have been feeling better recently so I revisited the what is god video and Leo said it himself that he had an insight and a freakout that his parents and everything else basically don't exist and that he created the whole illusion, which I, writing this post am a part of. He even checked with an enlightened friend to confirm. Why then does he continue to make videos for a non existent audience?

Could it be a paradox that he is the only creator yet you, I and everyone else is also?

Is it right to say that the world and all in it do not actually exist as matter but it's just all consciousness like what Rupert Spira says?

What about the zen master Thich Nhat Hanh, he never talks about himself being god but everything interbeing. The lotus can not be without the mud and so on.

Edited March 18, 2019 by Shaun

[SoonHei]

@Shaun If everything else is an illusion, why does Leo make videos?

 

 

short answer.

movies are not real (illusion) - they are still made.

[Shin]

The main reasons are:

• He loves what he does
• Even if it is true, the vast majority of people firmly believe in duality/separation and thus suffer (and thus needs to realize the truth)

[Shaun]

That was a pretty good answer. I hope to have a discussion with everyone at length here about it as the whole thing has been causing me a lot of stress.

The main thing that really upsets me is the possibility that other people are not real. They are not having any conscious experience of their own. If that is true, then basically that is like finding out that my entire family has been murdered right now because they are basically dead. Rupert and other teachers say that consciousness takes the form of all things including our "finite minds". This is different from what Leo said which sounds pretty much to me like solipsism where nothing else actually exists.

Could it be that we are all co creating this same reality from consciousness?

[Shaun]

6 minutes ago, Shin said:

The main reasons are:

• He loves what he does
• Even if it is true, the vast majority of people firmly believe in duality/separation and thus suffer (and thus needs to realize the truth)

But therein lies the problem. Those who believe in separation don't exist. No need to do any convincing. The enlightened people don't exist either so I can't understand why he even continues his life. There is no point in being kind, loving and compassionate if there is nobody to be kind to. There is no point whatsoever in doing anything because nobody else is there to experience life with me. If what he is saying is really true then that is the most tragic, terrifying and worrying truth there is.

Edited March 18, 2019 by Shaun

[Shin]

The thing is,

For them, they still exist,

Hence the suffering, and hence the compassion.

[zambize]

1 minute ago, Shaun said:

The main thing that really upsets me is the possibility that other people are not real. They are not having any conscious experience of their own.

I think this is a very common thought/worry.  We all want our love ones to actually experience the love we give them.  Unfortunately I just dont see a way of varifying that.  I think there are intellectual arguements such as, "people have been able to explain how my experience would change in different ways by drugs and emotions before I knew it myself from my own direct experience".  But of course, it could be all part of the illusion and maybe you dont actually exist.  I dont think you'll ever get certainty on this, even though it really seems like there are other people with their own experience, in a relative sense.  Hopefully you'll get more and more comfortable with lack of certainty, because there is very little certainty to be had in the world

[Shin]

You think about this from an egotic point of view.

With full realization you realize you are everything, too.

 

You would literally see yourself everywhere,

What do you think you would do if that was true for you ?

Nothing ?

[Shaun]

34 minutes ago, Shin said:

The thing is,

For them, they still exist,

Hence the suffering, and hence the compassion.

So from an enlightened perspective, the other people cease to exist or are no longer experienced as apparently separate people? Does that mean that upon enlightenment they cease to exist from my perspective yet still exist from their perspective at the same time? Reality being a strange loop and all that.

[Shaun]

34 minutes ago, Shin said:

You think about this from an egotic point of view.

With full realization you realize you are everything, too.

 

You would literally see yourself everywhere,

What do you think you would do if that was true for you ?

Nothing ?

I know, Leo's videos are addressing egos.

 

If I saw myself everwhere, that would be kind of interesting but if I literally created it all and everything and everyone else is a total illusion or cardboard cutouts as Rupert Spira said, that would send me into a state of unfathomable terror and total insanity. A loneliness from which suicide would not be an escape.

[ajasatya]

@Shaun because everything is an illusion and everything is real.

[Shaun]

2 minutes ago, Joseph Maynor said:

It's funny watching everyone rationalize.  You're starting to rationalize your rationalizations haha.

I just can't see how living alone in an illusion of my own making can bring any form of happiness. I guess this ego must die and then I will be OK with everyone else around me not experiencing anything I do for them. I now feel like I am asking my own simulation for answers. How absurd.

[Shaun]

2 minutes ago, ajasatya said:

@Shaun because everything is an illusion and everything is real.

I've had that thought a few times and I am basically living my life in a sort of back and forwards state, one moment I am living life normally and getting on with it, the next I am freaking out a bit about everyone possibly not existing. I am probably just confused as different teachers are saying different things, almost like in religion.

[ajasatya]

Just now, Shaun said:

I am probably just confused as different teachers are saying different things, almost like in religion

then quit teachers.

beliefs are helpless. do the entire work on your own or you won't ever reach liberation.

[Billy Shears]

We are all connected with each other, but that doesn't necessarily mean that I am an illusion which only appears in your mind. 

[Shin]

1 hour ago, Shaun said:

I've had that thought a few times and I am basically living my life in a sort of back and forwards state, one moment I am living life normally and getting on with it, the next I am freaking out a bit about everyone possibly not existing. I am probably just confused as different teachers are saying different things, almost like in religion.

That's all projections and IDEAS.

You don't actually know what life would be if you would know  the truth.
To know that you would need to be conscious of the truth !

How do you know what loneliness is, when there is only you ?
Would that make even sense to think or feel lonely, if there never was something else than you ?

See, you can't answer this question, the best you can say honestly is "I don't know".

Why ?

Because you're not living it, it's not actual for you, it's not your experience.
And everything that is not your current experience is an idea in your head, a fantasy.

Edited March 18, 2019 by Shin

[Shin]

2 minutes ago, Joseph Maynor said:

And you can’t beat a rationalization with another rationalization.  It’s like two young boys sparring at each other swinging their invisible swords.

Stop being a spiritual smartass who thinks nothing can be said.

At that point, why even coming to a forum if it's to say that nothing can be said about anything ?

Pride ? Being looked as a spiritual person ? Something else ?

[Shin]

6 minutes ago, Joseph Maynor said:

Look at how your Ego got triggered.  I’m impressed!  Stop telling me what to do.  You’re not yet ready to hear what I have to say on here — others are though and appreciate my voice.

 

Yeah because that is not egotic at all

[Shin]

12 minutes ago, Joseph Maynor said:

Your reaction to me was classic unenlightened Ego dude.  And I’m really surprised.  I thougiht you were at a higher level.  Your humor made me think that initially.  But no, you’re just humorous — that doesn’t necessarily signal advanced placement on the Path.  Your actions spoke and gave you away haha.  Oops!

 

You're still highly deluded and that's the reason I'm an ass to you, because no one else is being the mirror you need to see your own bullshit.

So as long as you are being full of shit I'm gonna telling you you are, sometimes, just like I expect everyone else to do the same for me.

 

[Nahm]

4 hours ago, Shaun said:

I have been feeling better recently so I revisited the what is god video and Leo said it himself that he had an insight and a freakout

I saw that video. Was not a freak out, was blissful, pure joy, pure relief.

that his parents and everything else basically don't exist and that he created the whole illusion

That’s why it’s a relief. 

 which I, writing this post am a part of.

And he is of your illusion. 

He even checked with an enlightened friend to confirm.

Tee he he 

Why then does he continue to make videos for a non existent audience?

You exist. Everyone exists. Everyone is the one, the one is being everyone. Everyone is one Being, you.

Could it be a paradox that he is the only creator yet you, I and everyone else is also?

Sure can. Get comfy with paradox. Leave dualistic beliefs behind. Transcend.

Is it right to say that the world and all in it do not actually exist as matter but it's just all consciousness like what Rupert Spira says?

Yes. But you are that consciousness. You “exist”. You waaay more than you think you are. Thinking limits. 

What about the zen master Thich Nhat Hanh, he never talks about himself being god but everything interbeing. The lotus can not be without the mud and so on.

Give Leo a break, and you give yourself about Leo a break. There’s nothing to gain comparing. They are you in actuality anyways. Do not look to them or anyone for the Truth. Look in yourself, check there first before believing anyone. Makes sense, no?

 

4 hours ago, Shaun said:

That was a pretty good answer. I hope to have a discussion with everyone at length here about it as the whole thing has been causing me a lot of stress.

“The Whole Thing” is not causing your stress. Avoiding the Truth is causing the stress. You avoid the Truth by believing you are a part. You avoid Truth, with beliefs. 

The main thing that really upsets me is the possibility that other people are not real. They are not having any conscious experience of their own.

Consciousness = Experience.        No “there own”, no “your own”, no “my own”. There is just consciousness / Isness / Now (rather, what those words points to).

If that is true, then basically that is like finding out that my entire family has been murdered right now because they are basically dead

No it’s not. Finding out your family is murdered is finding out your family is murdered. Finding out reality is all God is the greatest Joy possible. Miraculously, when you look around, everyone still appears exactly the same. Not only do they appear the same, but they will still insist they are “not enlightened”. There’s just no explaining that but it’s true.

. Rupert and other teachers say that consciousness takes the form of all things including our "finite minds". This is different from what Leo said which sounds pretty much to me like solipsism where nothing else actually exists.

Solipsism is the consciousness that you know as a person is real, and no one else is in the same boat. The consciousness you know is real, and again, it’s magic, but, same is true for “everyone else”. 

Could it be that we are all co creating this same reality from consciousness?

It could be that “we” are each the one creating our own reality, yet it magically appears as if there is an objective physical reality “we” are all “in”. You’d have to be infinite to pull that off though. Not sure it’s possible. Let me know. 

 

3 hours ago, Shaun said:

I know, Leo's videos are addressing egos.

 

If I saw myself everwhere, that would be kind of interesting but if I literally created it all and everything and everyone else is a total illusion or cardboard cutouts as Rupert Spira said, that would send me into a state of unfathomable terror and total insanity. A loneliness from which suicide would not be an escape.

Draaamaaa. 

Shaun: “Ya, so, I realized I’m God, an eternal infinite unconditional Being. It’s really terrible. I have to live out the rest of this life knowing that. Soooo terrible”  ?

 

2 hours ago, Shaun said:

I just can't see how living alone in an illusion of my own making can bring any form of happiness.

You brought the happiness. Don’t look for it. You’re it. The whole “thing” is made of you.

I guess this ego must die and then I will be OK with everyone else around me not experiencing anything I do for them. I now feel like I am asking my own simulation for answers. How absurd.

I know right!? You could be self inquiring, dropping the beliefs, and discovering your infinite levels of awesomeness. 

 

2 hours ago, Shaun said:

I've had that thought a few times and I am basically living my life in a sort of back and forwards state, one moment I am living life normally and getting on with it, the next I am freaking out a bit about everyone possibly not existing.

“The sensations that feel good are cool, but when sensations don’t feel good, I don’t listen to them, I run like hell in fear”.

I am probably just confused as different teachers are saying different things, almost like in religion.

They’re all saying the same thing. Are you looking for differences and finding them, or are you looking for inclusion and finding it?

Leo discovered he is The All That Is, and it is Love. He discovered he can do whatever he wants, and it doesn’t matter. He has chosen to help everyone in the world discover this real Joy and Peace, and you’re thinking there is something more worthwhile he should be doing....?      Define for yourself what that is that he should be doing, and do that!