Why become enlightened while living?

[Joker_Theory]

@bejapuskas you right i don't get it but does the ego not exist as a delusion and cause i believe that is what i am? I don't believe i am the ego but the habit is so strong and deep rooted that it blocks me from the truth?

So you say the way is though Zen? any books i can read about learning Zen??

Edited March 12, 2019 by Joker_Theory

[Nahm]

16 minutes ago, Joker_Theory said:

I am not sure were to post this so cause it's my thread i hope it's okay.

This morning i woke up from a really deep sleep and had vivid weird dreams but could not remember the dreams and the ones i do were just my fears so don't think they mean anything but what my fears mean but when i went to the toilet it felt like i had  taken a psychedelic and i did not or even meditate.

I did not see anything but i could hear like voices whispering but could not make out what they were saying and then this evil sounding voice said "Jesus." Also, i felt very weird like i was on a psychedelic but the feeling went away after about 5 mins or so.

Anyone have these experiences before or know what happened??

You’ve been assuming there is ‘reality’, and then there is a ‘dream state’ (in your sleep). Aka, suffering. 

During your ‘waking time’, during your day, unbeknownst to you, you keep many patterns of thought and belief going to support the delusion of “physical reality”.

During sleep, you are pure consciousness; without the patterns held while ‘awake’.

So, you’ll be experiencing some weird dreams, due to this reconciliation. 

Notice, the dreams do not happen sporadically through out the night, they happen in the instant you are waking up. Though it certainly does appear your body lays in a physical reality for 8 hours while ‘you’ sleep, this is not actually the case at all. 

Look very closely at your direct experience, without any added beliefs or concepts, and you will see there is no experience of this “8 hours of time”. 

This actual experience, this ‘popping in and out of the dream’, is revealing of the actuality, a deeply true nature of the “reality” experienced. “Reality” is only, and always, “popping in and out of existence”. (Read a little on Planck time / scale, and the double slit to “loosen” up your mind, then the dreams will get more intense, but you must relish in the waking experience, in the reassurance upon waking that all is well, you’re fine - it was just a dream)

When you wake up, regardless of the “content” of the dream, the message is always the same... it is

 

”Hey...it’s just a dream” 

Don’t take that waking experience, that reassurance, that obviousness - for granted. 

Stop assuming you are “living”. 

Change you can see, along with change you can’t see, does not “prove” time...only change. 

 

And drop the belief there is an “it” which is not you. Don’t excuse it, don’t justify it - stop perpetuating it. 

[Joker_Theory]

@Nahm Thanks will read and hope it will loosen my mind.

[bejapuskas]

3 hours ago, Joker_Theory said:

@bejapuskas you right i don't get it but does the ego not exist as a delusion and cause i believe that is what i am? I don't believe i am the ego but the habit is so strong and deep rooted that it blocks me from the truth?

So you say the way is though Zen? any books i can read about learning Zen??

@Joker_Theory  I know what you mean, but you cannot grasp it intellectually from the ego mind I think. It is basically Wakeness trying to convince itself, that it isn't Wakeness and trusting itself blindly  Think of it this way, the Universe is like a big living organism, that is constructed from small cells, aka humans, planets, galaxies... in the same way as this body is constructed from the heart, the brain, stomach etc... Is the stomach not a part of you? Can you say, that the brain is you and the stomach is not you at the same time? I think this could be a useful metaphor for you.

Zen is practice, not a theory. You can study all these concepts, they can surely help you understand yourself a bit better, they can save you some time, warn you about certain traps, but they are not it. The teacher opens the door, you walk through it. You have to actually sit in zazen everyday. You can read a book as a supplement after your meditation, like Zen mind: beginner's mind by Shunryu Suzuki. 1 chapter everyday after your session, otherwise you won't understand a single word that is written in it  

[Joker_Theory]

1 hour ago, bejapuskas said:

@Joker_Theory  I know what you mean, but you cannot grasp it intellectually from the ego mind I think. It is basically Wakeness trying to convince itself, that it isn't Wakeness and trusting itself blindly  Think of it this way, the Universe is like a big living organism, that is constructed from small cells, aka humans, planets, galaxies... in the same way as this body is constructed from the heart, the brain, stomach etc... Is the stomach not a part of you? Can you say, that the brain is you and the stomach is not you at the same time? I think this could be a useful metaphor for you.

Zen is practice, not a theory. You can study all these concepts, they can surely help you understand yourself a bit better, they can save you some time, warn you about certain traps, but they are not it. The teacher opens the door, you walk through it. You have to actually sit in zazen everyday. You can read a book as a supplement after your meditation, like Zen mind: beginner's mind by Shunryu Suzuki. 1 chapter everyday after your session, otherwise you won't understand a single word that is written in it  

Thanks man. I have been meditating for about 5 years now but i have not stayed with a curtain meditation and moved on as i keep involving. Now i feel like doing a meditation that might get me to realize the truth. So you say zazen right?

Thanks

 

Edited March 12, 2019 by Joker_Theory

[Shin]

Why should I be unconditionally happy when I could continue to suffer and wish life made sense ?

That's what I read when I see the original question.

Edited March 12, 2019 by Shin

[Joker_Theory]

7 minutes ago, Shin said:

Why should I be unconditionally when I could continue to suffer and wish life made sense ?

That's what I read when I see the original question.

Yes something like that. Was is a bad space when i wrote it. Also, very important point you make that i forgot about is to be unconditional with myself and just was the opposite like 1 hour ago.

Edited March 12, 2019 by Joker_Theory

[Shin]

3 minutes ago, Joker_Theory said:

Yes something like that. Was is a bad space when i wrote it.

You're playing hide and seek with yourself, you actually don't want to be found.

?

[Joker_Theory]

3 minutes ago, Shin said:

You're playing hide and seek with yourself, you actually don't want to be found.

?

Yes but the seeker want so desperately to find myself but i did not even know we were playing so that's cheating. Thanks

[bejapuskas]

@Joker_Theory  Zazen is what I do. But it also depends on how you practice. Don't expect Wakeness to come to you in the future  

[Joker_Theory]

22 minutes ago, bejapuskas said:

@Joker_Theory  Zazen is what I do. But it also depends on how you practice. Don't expect Wakeness to come to you in the future  

Cool, thanks

[non_nothing]

I recently asked the following questions to myself:

 

(This thread was lucky to receive this information)

 

 

Will I die? (yes)

Can I die right now (yes)

If death is in the future (yes), it means it is not in the now (true)

Future is an illusion (true)

So death might be an illusion (maybe)

Did I born (yes)

It was in the past (yes)

So birth might be an illusion (maybe, or certainly not! I am born for sure)

(asking again) Can I die right now (yes, there's a chance)

Can I be born now (...)

 

(three dots might give you some insight if you follow the questions accordingly, if not go over again, if not meditate for the questions yourself)

Edited March 15, 2019 by non_nothing

[Joker_Theory]

@non_nothing

Did not get it the first few time cause first i thought no then yes now maybe but i will meditate on it and will see.

Thanks allot!!!

[non_nothing]

On 3/15/2019 at 10:57 PM, Joker_Theory said:

@non_nothing

Did not get it the first few time cause first i thought no then yes now maybe but i will meditate on it and will see.

Thanks allot!!!

No problem, further additional points that might help is to think about which part is really you. In reality our body and cells actually dies and gets be born every second. They say that over a few years, actually your body almost completely changes. So where we can fit in this equation literally?

[Shin]

Why taking a dump when you need to to poop ?

Because if you don't, your pants will be shitty at some point !